In this brief update, Chaz Robbins (producer of The Pastor’s Table) shares a word of gratitude, reflection, and clarity as the podcast enters a short season of pause. After three years and more than 150 episodes, this moment is about tending the table well by listening, discerning, and ensuring that what comes next continues to serve pastors with theological depth, honesty, and care.

This isn’t a goodbye. It’s a reminder that faithful ministry requires rhythm, rest, and intentionality, especially after demanding seasons like Advent and Christmas.

Thank you for being part of this community. We’ll gather again soon.

If this opportunity is to be fully realized, it requires pastors to know their people. God has invited pastors to be the guides on a journey of where God is taking the community. Forming the life of God in your church starts with the leaders to be formed.

Everyone has the opportunity to experience God’s grace that brings inner peace. Mindy, Mark, and Tara Beth give leaders practical examples and reasons to hope that they can experience God’s grace in their calling.

Discussion Questions:

1. How do you see the role of a pastor in helping their congregation "stay alive to God"? What specific actions, practices, or approaches can pastors implement to better know their people and guide them on the journey of spiritual formation within the church community?

2. Mindy emphasizes the idea that forming the life of God within the church starts with the formation of its leaders. What steps can pastors take to prioritize their own spiritual formation and growth as leaders? How might their personal transformation influence the spiritual life of the congregation?

3. The podcast episode highlights the potential for everyone to experience God's grace and inner peace in their calling. In what ways can church leaders provide practical examples and reasons to inspire hope for their congregation? Have you personally witnessed or experienced God's grace and inner peace in your ministry, and how has it impacted your calling?

Cultural Idols

Social Media

News Media

Work Demands and the list could go on …

Mindy Caliguire gives clarity on how pastors can enhance the vision of a formed life after Jesus. The people who are suffering from a poverty of imagination can be given guidance and tools on the journey of formation Jesus offers.

Get Soul Care’s 21 Days to Jumpstart Journaling at soulcare.com/resources.

Discussion Questions:

1. In a world where people are being influenced by a multitude of sources, how can pastors and church leaders effectively guide their congregations toward a vision of a formed life after Jesus? What specific challenges do you see in addressing the impact of cultural idols, social media, news media, and work demands on spiritual formation within your church community?

2. Mindy Caliguire emphasizes the importance of addressing the "poverty of imagination" in people's faith journeys. How can churches actively engage and equip individuals to develop a richer and more imaginative spiritual life in the context of today's distractions and influences? What practical strategies or tools can be implemented to facilitate this transformation?

3. Considering the diverse array of influences mentioned, what steps can pastors take to foster an environment where spiritual formation becomes a central focus for their congregation? How do you see your church community addressing these challenges and helping members embark on the journey of formation that Jesus offers?

Pastors must tend to our own souls. Mindy Caliguire provides 4 different practices of page, person, plan & place to tend well to our souls as leaders.

Page is the invitation to reflection. Person to be ruthlessly honest. Plan is a rule of life to create intentional space for growth. Place is honoring the location God has placed us. Get Soul Care’s 21 Days to Jumpstart Journaling at soulcare.com/resources. Discussion

Questions:

1. How does the concept of a "capped" leadership tied to self-reflection resonate with your understanding of effective pastoral leadership? In what ways can implementing the four practices of page, person, plan, and place, as outlined by Mindy Caliguire, help pastors overcome this limitation and enhance their leadership abilities?
2. The four practices mentioned—page, person, plan, and place—each play a distinct role in tending to the souls of leaders. Which of these practices do you find most challenging to integrate into your own life as a pastor or church leader, and why? Conversely, which one resonates with you the most, and how do you envision it positively influencing your leadership style? Reflect on the significance of "honoring the location God has placed us" as one of the practices for tending to our souls as leaders. How can this practice be applied in your specific ministry context?
3. What changes or adaptations might be needed to ensure that you are faithfully honoring your role and location as a pastor or leader in your church community?

Congregants are leaving. Pastors are burning out. Loss of all kinds is painfully present in the church.  

Many times people feel tending to a surrendered life of Christ is hard. Mindy Caliguire suggests that what is really hard is facing the pain of staying the same. There are so many pressures facing the church, but a community that tends to souls is possible.  

Make sure to come back for the other episodes with Mindy to learn more!   

Discussion Questions: 

1. How does Mindy Caliguire's perspective on loss and the challenges within the church encourage us to reevaluate our approach to spiritual growth and transformation? What might be some of the obstacles that prevent congregants and pastors from engaging in this process effectively?
2. In what ways can we build and nurture a church community that focuses on tending to souls amid the various pressures of ministry? What practical steps and principles did you draw from this discussion to help address the present challenges within your congregation?
3. Reflecting on the idea that facing the pain of staying the same can be more challenging than the work of tending to a surrendered life of Christ, how can we cultivate a mindset and environment that embrace growth, change, and healing within our churches? What role can individual members and leaders play in making this transformation possible?

Can God take that loss and birth something new?

In this deeply personal anniversary episode, Mark and Tara Beth look back on three years of The Pastor’s Table and the untold story of how it all began. From Mark’s unexpected firing, to the disorientation that followed, to the Spirit-led formation of this podcast, they revisit the moments of pain, clarity, calling, and redemption that shaped their ministry.

This episode is raw, honest, and full of hope for any pastor navigating disappointment, transition, or questions of identity and vocation.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The firing that blindsided Mark — and the prayer he kept repeating
• How a season of painful disorientation birthed the Center for Theological Integrity
• The unexpected way God redeemed loss (“I already have… wait and see.”)
• Why theological integrity—not vanity metrics—remains the heartbeat of the podcast
• How the Holy Spirit compelled Tara Beth into a pastorate she never planned to take
• Wild Sunday-morning stories (fainting, wheelchairs, choking… all in one sermon!)
• What’s next for the relaunch of The Pastor’s Table

⏱️ Timestamps

00:00 – Why this anniversary episode matters

02:00 – Mark remembers the early podcast days

03:00 – “My services were no longer needed”: the firing

05:45 – Transparency, leadership, and the cost of truth-telling

07:30 – Praying through disorientation: “Lord, how will you redeem this?”

10:00 – “I already have”: the surprising answer that kept repeating

11:30 – The birth of the Center for Theological Integrity

12:45 – How Northern Seminary became home for the vision

17:20 – How suffering shaped the podcast’s heartbeat

21:00 – Tara Beth’s reluctant call to Good Shepherd

24:00 – “They needed a mom”: the Spirit’s inner leap

27:00 – When everything goes wrong mid-sermon

33:00 – Returning to theological integrity

36:00 – Daily Scripture reading and resisting vanity metrics

38:00 – What’s next for the podcast

God never wastes suffering.

Your hardest losses may become the very soil where new ministry, clarity, and courage begin to grow.

In this heartfelt conversation, Pastor Hector Alfaro joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom to share what Hispanic churches in Chicago are experiencing as ICE activity intensifies. From families torn apart to churches emptied in a matter of weeks, Pastor Hector offers a raw, front-line perspective on shepherding undocumented and mixed-status communities living under daily threat — and the hope the Church must offer in this moment.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Hector’s journey from Guatemala to Chicago at age 17
• The explosive growth of Hispanic churches — and why everything changed
• How immigrants encountered Jesus on the journey north
• What ICE presence has done to church attendance, jobs, and daily life
• How pastors are caring for families living in fear
• Why the wider Church must step in with courage, compassion, and resources

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00 – Welcome & introduction to Pastor Hector

01:00 – Leaving Guatemala and adapting to American culture

04:00 – His father’s call to plant Spanish-speaking churches

06:00 – Multinational, multiethnic Hispanic congregations

08:00 – The unique challenges of pastoring undocumented families

10:00 – Immigrants meeting Jesus on the journey north

12:00 – Discipling new believers from Venezuela & Central America

15:00 – ICE presence and fear reshaping entire neighborhoods

17:00 – Families choosing deportation over living in fear

20:00 – Churches providing food, visits, and emergency support

23:00 – Pastors carrying passports — and heavy pastoral burdens

26:00 – Navigating work, danger, and survival

30:00 – How it changes the way a pastor preaches and shepherds

31:30 – A call for the wider Church to step in

Pastor Hector reminds us that the Body of Christ is not whole unless we carry one another’s burdens. When some churches worship in fear, the whole Church is called to respond with prayer, presence, and sacrificial love.

In this powerful continuation, Pastor Paco Amador joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom to share how his congregation in Chicago’s Little Village is responding to the immigration crisis with courage, compassion, and prophetic witness. From offering tamales and prayer outside a migrant shelter to confronting the fear of deportation in his pews, Paco embodies the gospel as both resistance and hope.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The harrowing journey of migrants through the Darién Gap
• How the church in Chicago became a sanctuary of love and welcome
• The rise of fear and persecution amid ICE detentions
• How Paco’s preaching has changed to meet a scattered and suffering flock
• The unbreakable hope of a church that refuses despair

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00 – What it means to be a Hispanic pastor in Chicago today

04:00 – The migrant journey through the Darién Gap

07:00 – Prayers, tamales, and the birth of a street-side church

13:00 – Organizing mercy: how the church met the need

17:00 – Stories of separation and injustice

21:00 – Fear, invisibility, and the immigrant experience

28:00 – The church as prophetic resistance

34:00 – Preaching for a scattered people

38:00 – Seeds of the gospel in persecution

In a city divided by politics and fear, Pastor Paco Amador reminds us that the Church’s truest power is love.

When systems fail and families are torn apart, the gospel still takes root on sidewalks, in shelters, and through the songs of a people who refuse to lose hope.

In this episode, Pastor Paco Amador joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom to share his journey from Mexico to North Carolina to Chicago’s Little Village. With honesty and humor, Paco reflects on his encounter with Jesus as a teenager, the grief and beauty of leaving home, and the long road toward discovering where he truly belongs.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Leaving home at fourteen and encountering Jesus on a North Carolina bench
• How immigration shapes faith, identity, and dependence on God
• The unlikely path from Mexico to Moody Bible Institute
• Planting a church in college that became his lifelong ministry
• Building a multicultural congregation in Chicago’s Little Village

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00 – Introducing Pastor Paco Amador

04:00 – Leaving Mexico at 14 and learning to start over

08:00 – An unmistakable encounter with Jesus

11:00 – A teacher’s nudge, a missionary’s challenge, and the call to Moody

15:00 – Starting a church in college and learning by failing forward

20:00 – Two years in Spain and an unexpected love story

24:00 – Planting roots in Little Village, Chicago

28:00 – Preaching in Spanish, English, and Mayan

31:00 – God’s quiet work in a vibrant immigrant community

The call of God often begins in disorientation.

Paco’s story reminds us that in every language, every journey, and every act of leaving, God is already at work turning exile into belonging.

In this second conversation, Pastor Nathan Hoff returns to unpack the theology and practice behind The Rule of Life at Trinity Lutheran Church in San Pedro. He joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom to explore how intentional rhythms of prayer, reconciliation, and presence can shape both pastors and congregations for a non-anxious, deeply human way of life.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The rhythms of prayer that anchor Nathan’s community—morning and evening
• Why reconciliation is harder (and holier) than routine
• How “formation as resistance” counters cultural conformity
• What technology, resources, and even our bodies reveal about our formation
• The invitation to stay rooted in a transient world

⏱️ Timestamps:

04:30 – The challenge and beauty of reconciliation

09:45 – The gift of rootedness through the Rule of Life

15:00 – Formation as resistance to conformity

19:00 – Practicing grace in technology, money, and relationships

24:30 – A pastoral reflection on the hard work of community

🔗 Resources & Links:

• Learn more about Trinity Lutheran Church → trinitysanpedro.org
• Explore The Rule of Life → trinitysanpedro.org/ruleoflife
• Listen to Low in the Water from the Eugene Peterson Center → petersoncenter.org/low-in-the-water-podcast
• Follow Nathan Hoff’s writing → nathanhoff.substack.com
• Explore reflections on pastoral life → practicingbenediction.substack.com

Spiritual formation isn’t about escaping the world; it’s about being reshaped within it.

Pastor Nathan Hoff reminds us that resisting conformity begins with prayer, reconciliation, and the courage to stay rooted in community.

In this episode, Pastor Nathan Hoff joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom to share his story of 20 years at Trinity Lutheran Church in San Pedro, California. From a childhood marked by constant moves to forming a residential community in an unrooted city, Nathan reflects on the beauty of long obedience, shared rhythms, and a “rule of life” shaped by prayer and presence.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Growing up in a pastor’s family that moved 15 times before he turned 30
• The call to ministry at age eight—and how grace reshaped his vocation
• How generational faith shaped Nathan’s theology of rootedness
• Creating a parish community with shared rhythms of prayer and life
• Why stability is countercultural—and deeply spiritual—in urban ministry

⏱️ Timestamps:

04:00 – From constant moving to a life of rooted ministry

07:00 – A childhood call to ministry and early formation

10:00 – Discovering Trinity Lutheran Church in San Pedro

13:00 – The influence of charismatic and sacramental renewal movements

17:00 – Generational faith and the grace that carries through families

20:00 – “On the block”: creating a shared residential community

24:00 – Rule of life, rhythms of prayer, and the call to rootedness

🔗 Resources & Links:

• Learn more about Trinity Lutheran Church → trinitysanpedro.org
• Explore The Rule of Life and the Common Way → trinitysanpedro.org/ruleoflife
• Listen to Low in the Water (from the Eugene Peterson Center) → petersoncenter.org/low-in-the-water-podcast
• Follow Nathan Hoff’s writing → nathanhoff.substack.com
• Explore reflections on pastoral life → practicingbenediction.substack.com

In a world that prizes movement and novelty, Pastor Nathan Hoff reminds us that faithfulness often looks like staying put—rooting deeply in a place, a people, and the daily rhythms of grace.

In this second conversation, Pastor Katie Langston joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom to share how the gospel of grace led her from Mormonism to the waters of baptism and into the freedom of ministry. Katie opens up about her conversion, her calling as a Lutheran pastor, and why she now preaches grace as the Church’s most radical gift in an anxious world.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• How Katie’s baptism became a moment of real deliverance
• Why law and gospel must be preached together—but not confused
• The tangible grace of communion for weary believers
• The temptation to prove worthiness—even in ministry
• How pastors can rest in being “sealed” by Christ’s finished work

⏱️ Timestamps:

03:00 – Discovering grace as a lived reality, not a doctrine

08:00 – Luther Seminary and finding home in the Lutheran story

11:00 – Baptism as exorcism and renewal

15:00 – Learning to preach grace in a law-driven world

18:00 – Pastoral care and the non-anxious presence of the gospel

20:00 – Communion as Christ given “for you”

24:00 – Why every culture worships worthiness

26:00 – “You are sealed to Christ forever.”

Grace doesn’t ask for your worthiness; it gives it.

Katie’s story reminds pastors and believers alike that baptism marks us with the promise of a God who will never, ever let us go.

In this powerful conversation, Pastor Katie Langston shares her journey from growing up Mormon to discovering the freeing power of grace. With honesty and humor, she describes life in a worthiness-based system, her battle with scrupulosity, and the moment she first heard the gospel of grace through a Wheaton professor’s words: “I know enough of my deficiencies to be devastated.”

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Growing up in a loving but rule-bound Mormon home
• The weight of worthiness interviews and religious anxiety
• Battling scrupulosity and finding a name for her struggle
• Hearing the gospel for the first time—and believing it
• Why grace and Mormon theology can’t coexist

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00 – Introducing Pastor Katie Langston

02:00 – Growing up in a faithful Mormon home

05:00 – Worthiness interviews and the burden of perfection

09:00 – Temple rituals, baptism for the dead, and Mormon theology

13:00 – Missionary life in Bulgaria and early cracks in the system

18:00 – Marriage, motherhood, and the onset of despair

21:00 – OCD, scrupulosity, and the search for help

23:00 – Hearing Jerry Root’s message on grace

24:00 – “What if Christ has made me worthy?”

26:00 – Ten years of wrestling between Mormonism and grace

Grace is not another rule to keep; it’s the end of the "worthiness" game. Katie’s story invites weary pastors and believers alike to rest in the gospel that declares: you are already enough in Christ.

In Part 2 of this conversation, Pastor Benji Van Fleet joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom to unpack the Methodist system of itinerancy and what it teaches us about obedience, humility, and trust. From matchmaker bishops to Methodist “March Madness,” Benji shares a vision of ministry rooted in submission rather than self-promotion, and a faith that follows wherever God leads.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• What the Methodist itinerant system teaches about calling and surrender
• How being sent shapes a pastor’s humility and courage
• The dangers of “pastor as CEO” and the freedom of not owning your church
• How diversity flourishes through a Spirit-led appointment process
• Why obedience to the Church’s discernment can deepen faith

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00 – The theology behind being sent rather than hired

03:00 – Contextualizing mission: unity without uniformity

07:00 – The “matchmaker” role of bishops and discernment in appointments

11:00 – Fresh eyes and prophetic courage in short tenures

15:00 – Undermining the “pastor as CEO” model

20:00 – Methodist March Madness and the beauty of discernment

24:00 – Diversity and the Kingdom of God in appointment systems

32:00 – A phone call on Holy Week that changed everything

36:00 – Saying yes when it could’ve only been six months

38:00 – Submission, humility, and the Spirit’s surprising work

Ministry is not a career we climb; it’s a call we receive. Benji’s story reminds us that when we live as sent ones rather than stationed ones, we find the freedom to trust God’s wisdom over our own plans.

In this episode, Pastor Benji Van Fleet joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom from Abilene, Texas, to talk about his journey from architecture student to Methodist pastor, how cancer and heartbreak became catalysts for his call, and why he describes himself not as a shepherd—but a sheepdog.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• How a broken engagement and a tumor redirected Benji’s life toward ministry
• The moment God spoke when everything else fell apart
• What it means to be a “sent” pastor in the Methodist itinerant system
• Why Benji refuses to call St. Paul “his” church—and what that means for pastoral health

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00 – The world of Abilene and Texas-sized hospitality

04:00 – The story of St. Paul UMC and its 100-year legacy

07:00 – Benji’s faith upbringing and the “zebra” of denominations

10:00 – Losing everything—and hearing God’s voice for the first time

13:00 – “Exactly. Now we can start again.” A calling moment

15:00 – Sharing the gospel in Russia and being called as God’s diplomat

20:00 – Seminary, marriage, and the Methodist call system

23:00 – Going where you’re sent: the theology of itinerancy

26:00 – Why Benji says, “I’m not the shepherd—I’m the sheepdog.”

29:00 – The cult of personality and pointing people to Jesus

Pastors are not owners of the church; they’re guides pointing the flock toward the Good Shepherd. Benji’s story reminds us that calling often begins in surrender, and ministry flourishes when we lead with open hands.

In this candid conversation, Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom reflect on Tara Beth’s widely shared Substack essay, When the Wounded Take the Mic. They explore the rise of “wounded influencers,” the temptation for pastors to preach from fresh wounds rather than healed scars, and how leaders can discern the difference between prophetic truth-telling and reactive venting.

Read the article here: https://tarabethleach.substack.com/p/when-the-wounded-take-the-mic

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why woundedness has become a new form of credibility in the church
• The danger of confusing deconstruction with discipleship
• Lessons Tara Beth learned from preaching with fresh wounds
• How pastors can lead from scars instead of unhealed pain
• Why the church—flawed and fallen—remains God’s chosen place of healing

⏱️ Timestamps:

02:00 – The rise of wounded influencers and the pull of platform

06:00 – When honesty and rawness aren’t the same as holiness and wisdom

10:00 – Tara Beth’s personal reflections on preaching while wounded

15:00 – How the church itself became a place of healing

20:00 – The danger of binary thinking: victim vs. villain

24:00 – Family systems theory and the culture of shared anger

27:00 – Mark’s reflection: preaching while angry and what changed

28:00 – Pastors will always lead while wounded—the question is how

Every pastor carries wounds, but not every wound should be amplified. Ministry rooted in healing scars—rather than raw pain—creates space for true discipleship, renewal, and hope in the body of Christ.

In this conversation, Sarah Hinlicky Wilson joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom to share how a decade away from the pastorate became a season of theological reflection, healing, and rediscovery of God’s mercy. From the theology of the cross to the false lure of utopian church ideals, Sarah offers hard-won wisdom for pastors whose hearts are broken.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why stepping away from the pastorate was necessary for recovery
• The dangers of chasing validation in ministry
• How churches confuse the theology of the cross with glory
• Facing sin in the church without losing hope
• Returning to your first love as a pastor

⏱️ Timestamps:

01:05 Sarah’s season away from ministry

05:00 Wrestling with anger and recovery

09:30 Lessons from failure and immaturity

13:50 Roots vs. fruits: pursuing word and sacrament

16:20 Cross and resurrection held together

20:00 The church’s sins and the call to confession

28:00 American utopianism in church life

30:30 A word for pastors with broken hearts

Healing after ministry wounds is slow, but it is holy work. By returning to our first love in Christ and trusting God’s mercy, pastors can find hope beyond anger and rediscover the joy of serving God’s people.

In Part 2 of her story, Sarah Hinlicky Wilson reflects on moving from disillusionment in New Jersey to surprising renewal in Tokyo. With honesty and humor, she describes serving a fragile, English-speaking congregation during COVID, watching people show up because Jesus himself drew them, and discovering her pastoral heart restored.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Recovering from disillusionment and learning to be a parishioner again
• Moving to Tokyo and reluctantly stepping back into pastoral ministry
• The loneliness of Japan—and the surprising ways God calls people to church
• How catechesis shaped new believers and renewed her pastoral heart

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00 – Leaving Trenton and healing in Strasbourg

03:00 – Becoming a supportive parishioner before pastoring again

06:00 – Moving to Tokyo and reluctantly accepting a call

09:00 – Serving in a city of 40 million isolated people

11:00 – COVID, reopening, and an unexpected growth in the church

13:00 – “Jesus told me to come to church”: new believers in Tokyo

17:00 – Using the Small Catechism as an evangelism tool

20:00 – Formation vs. just getting people in the door

24:00 – A renewed pastoral heart and the gift of a faithful congregation

God doesn’t waste seasons of pain. In Tokyo, Sarah discovered that even when she felt unqualified, God was faithful to bring people, heal her wounds, and give her back a pastoral heart.

In this riveting conversation, Sarah Hinlicky Wilson shares her story of growing up in a third-generation pastoral family, wrestling with her call as a woman, and stepping into a church full of both history and heartbreak. From dollar-priced communion to deep theological reflection, Sarah’s story reminds us that God often works through unexpected twists.

Learn more about Sarah's writing at sarahhinlickywilson.com

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Growing up in a healthy Lutheran family and finding her call to ministry
• Wrestling with being a woman pastor—and discovering unlikely mentors
• Her first call in Trenton, NJ, and the painful reality of a declining church
• Nostalgia, culture, and the surprising places God redirects us

⏱️ Timestamps:

04:00 – Third-generation pastor with a happy church upbringing

07:00 – Wrestling with women in ministry through theology and mentors

10:00 – From PhD work to ordination

13:00 – First call: a struggling Slovak Lutheran church in Trenton

17:00 – Communion for a dollar? The odd traditions she inherited

20:00 – Facing racism, loss, and resistance in a shrinking congregation

24:00 – The deeper challenge of nostalgia and bound wills

30:00 – God’s unexpected redirection: Strasbourg, France

Ministry is rarely a straight line. Sarah’s story reveals how even in broken churches and cultural tensions, God is still at work redirecting us, reshaping us, and surprising us with new callings.

In this special episode, the tables turn as Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom interview their producer, and now executive pastor, Chaz Robbins. From a childhood shaped by faithful mentors to an RV road trip with his family, Chaz opens up about his winding path through ministry, media, church planting, and finally, back into pastoral leadership.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• How a youth pastor at Taco Bell modeled the love of Jesus
• The moment Chaz’s grandfather called him into ministry: “You were made for this”
• Lessons from planting a church—and letting it go in 2020
• What a year on the road in an RV taught about community and resilience
• Why stepping into executive ministry feels like coming home

⏱️ Timestamps:

05:00 – Growing up in Missouri, football dreams, and broken bones

08:30 – A youth pastor’s presence that changed everything

10:00 – Called into ministry at a Nebraska retreat

12:00 – From Ozark Christian College to Northern Seminary

16:00 – Learning ministry through Next Steps & Rooted at Parkview

18:00 – Church planting residency and the dream of a coffeehouse church

20:00 – Planting in Colorado… and closing during COVID

17:00 – Selling everything and living a year in an RV with two toddlers

23:00 – The bittersweet ache of stepping away from pastoral ministry

26:00 – The long road of healing and rediscovering call

31:00 – A new chapter: becoming Executive Pastor at Osage Hills

33:00 – Why Jesus’ promise “I will build my church” matters most

🔗 Resources & Mentions:

• The Great Morning Revolution by Tara Beth Leach → Amazon link
• Threaded Bible Study by Tara Beth Leach → Amazon link

Even when ministry dreams fall apart, God wastes nothing. The same call that sparked at a Taco Bell table and a Nebraska retreat still echoes today: you were made for this—to love people with the presence of Jesus.

In Part 2 of this conversation, Ben Cachiaras reflects on the dangers of achievement addiction, the symptoms of ministry at an unsustainable pace, and the practices that helped him and his staff find a healthier rhythm of life and leadership. From numbing emotions to creating a staff-wide REST policy, Ben shares the hard-won lessons of thriving in ministry without losing holy ambition.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The signs of burnout pastors often minimize or ignore
• Why achievement can become an addiction in ministry
• Creating a culture of health through the REST policy
• Holding urgency for the gospel and soul care in tension

⏱️ Timestamps:

02:00 – Ben’s story of overcommitment and achievement addiction

07:00 – Symptoms of burnout: numbness, resentment, escapes

13:00 – When staff intervention became a turning point

19:00 – False dichotomies of soul care vs. gospel urgency

25:00 – How Mountain Church institutionalized rest

31:00 – REST policy: relax, exercise, social, time with God

35:00 – Final reflections and resources

Thriving in ministry doesn’t mean abandoning holy ambition—it means learning the rhythm of pouring yourself out and allowing God to fill you back up.

Pastor Ben Cachiaras of Mountain Christian Church has spent nearly three decades leading with holy ambition, holding together the call to discipleship and evangelism. His story is one of clarity, perseverance, and joy in ministry that truly “fits like a glove."

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Ben’s early call to ministry through his grandfather’s powerful invitation
• Why discipleship and evangelism aren’t opposites and how they thrive together
• The challenge of staying faithful for the long haul in one place
• Discernment in ministry: when to persevere and when it might be time to go

⏱️ Timestamps:

07:00 – A clear and undeniable call to ministry

13:00 – The role of the church in affirming pastoral callings

20:00 – Discovering his heart for evangelism and discipleship together

28:00 – What sustains 28 years at Mountain Christian Church

34:00 – Perseverance, “remaining under,” and knowing when to stay or go

Pastoral ministry may not always be easy, but when it fits your calling, it can become the most joy-filled way to spend your life.

In this lively, behind-the-scenes conversation, Mark Quanstrom and Tara Beth Leach pull back the curtain on their rhythms of ministry, family life, writing, and rest.

From the myth of busyness to the art of batch working, they share practical ways to sustain pastoral life without burning out—and why mornings might be the most important part of the day.

CLICK HERE to Pre-Purchase The Great Morning by Tara Beth Leach

CLICK HERE to Purchase Threads by Tara Beth Leach

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The myth of “doing it all” and how pastors can set realistic expectations
• How batch working creates space for ministry, writing, and family
• The heart behind The Great Morning Revolution and starting the day with the Lord
• Why taking extended time away is essential for long-term ministry health

⏱️ Timestamps:

02:00 – The myth of “doing it all” in pastoral ministry

05:00 – Batch working and protecting focused time

08:00 – Inside Tara Beth’s Threaded Bible study

09:00 – The story and practices behind The Great Morning Revolution

15:00 – Mark’s morning prayer rhythm and sacred spaces

18:00 – Ministry health and the necessity of time away

24:00 – Building churches that don’t revolve around the pastor

27:00 – Final encouragement: mornings with God, time away, and a nourished mind

A sustainable ministry life isn’t about hustling harder; it’s about stewarding your mornings, protecting your time, and trusting that the church is Christ’s to hold, not yours.

In this conversation, Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom open up about what keeps them in pastoral ministry after decades of challenges, transitions, and spiritual fatigue. From the support of their spouses to the importance of theological education, they reflect honestly on what sustains them when things get hard.

Learn more about The DMin in Pastoral Theology & Practice at Northern Seminary: https://www.seminary.edu/programs/doctor-of-ministry-in-pastoral-theology-practice/

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why presence (not performance) is key to longevity in ministry
• How spouses and friendships help pastors endure storms
• The spiritual and vocational value of ongoing theological education
• An exciting announcement about the launch of a new Doctor of Ministry program

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:30 – Catching up and Mark’s decision to stay another 4 years

03:00 – Tara Beth shares about a recent painful leadership season

07:00 – The role of their spouses in surviving ministry

10:00 – Why community and presence matter more than performance

13:00 – Reflections from a missionary couple on staying faithful

16:00 – Theological convictions that ground pastoral work

18:00 – How ongoing learning has sustained Mark’s ministry

25:00 – Why churches should support their pastors’ education

27:00 – Tara Beth announces her return to school

28:00 – Introducing the new DMin in Theology & Practice of Pastoral Ministry

32:00 – How to apply and what’s coming next

In this episode, Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom continue their conversation with pastor and author Faith Eury Cho. Together they explore how a season of uncertainty, silence, and scarcity became fertile ground for trust, surrender, and a deeper experience of God’s presence. From living without a paycheck to planting a church from her living room, Faith shares how waiting can be both painful and profoundly sacred.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Learning to “do nothing” and adore God during a season of loss
• How waiting can reveal God’s provision in unexpected ways
• The hidden power of childlike faith and sacred assumption
• Why friendship with God often begins where certainty ends

⏱️ Timestamps:

02:00 – Adoring God while facing housing insecurity

06:00 – A call to seek the Kingdom first

08:00 – The house that only God could provide

12:00 – Trusting God with the pace of church planting

14:00 – The cost and courage of waiting

18:00 – Wounds that distort our view of God

21:00 – Parenting, presence, and rediscovering joy in the process

💡 Takeaway:

Waiting on God is not weakness; it’s faith in action.

In a culture obsessed with control and productivity, Faith Cho reminds us that the deepest growth often happens when we stop striving and trust God to move.

Ask ChatGPT

🎙️ In This Episode:

• From mystical childhood wonder to Spirit-filled ministry
• The difference between manifest and indwelling presence
• Why church planting in 2020 revealed God’s sufficiency
• How motherhood changed her understanding of holy ground

📍 Timestamps:

04:00 – Faith’s story of spiritual longing and discovery

08:00 – Salvation at 16 and her call to ministry

12:30 – Motherhood, presence, and reshaping theology

19:00 – Practicing the presence vs. manufacturing moments

25:00 – The call to plant Mosaic Covenant Church

🔗 Resources & Links:

• Faith’s book: Experiencing Friendship with God
• The Honor Summit

🛠️ Takeaway:

You don’t have to manufacture God’s presence; it’s already with you. Ministry is less about chasing sacred moments and more about building a life around a sacred friendship.

In this powerful follow-up conversation, pastor and author Aubrey Sampson joins Tara Beth and Mark to talk about leading while grieving, pastoring through pain, and creating sacred space for sorrow in the church.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• How unprocessed grief distorts our leadership and faith
• The courage it takes to bring your honest self to the pulpit
• Why lament isn’t faithless, it’s an act of deep spiritual trust
• What churches gain when they normalize grief in worship

⏱️ Timestamps:

03:00 – Prayers we’re afraid to pray

08:00 – The grandkids only God could give

12:00 – The gift of lament in public worship

17:00 – Creating space for sorrow in Sunday services

21:00 – What unprocessed grief does to leaders

26:00 – Giving yourself permission to pause

30:00 – Big Feeling Days and writing for the littlest grievers

💡 Takeaway:

Grief doesn’t disqualify us from ministry: it deepens it.

Lament is not a detour from discipleship; it is discipleship. Aubrey’s story invites us to become churches that grieve well, love honestly, and make space for the sacred work of tears.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why Aubrey never imagined herself as a pastor
• What it means to plant a church with conviction and complexity
• The emotional toll of leadership and stepping into grief while serving
• How theological clarity became a freeing force

⏱️ Timestamps:

03:00 – From volunteer to pastor: discovering a hidden call

06:00 – Wrestling with guilt, theology, and spiritual authority

09:00 – Why church planting was the only path forward

12:00 – Honeymoon seasons, heartbreak, and sacred disappointment

17:00 – Co-pastoring through sabbatical and spiritual weariness

24:00 – Grief, illness, and loss behind the scenes of ministry

28:00 – Pastors and the cost of not being allowed to lament

💡 Thought to ponder:

Ministry doesn’t protect you from pain; it shapes you in it.

Aubrey’s story is a reminder that faithful leadership isn’t found in perfection, but in showing up anyway, trusting that God meets us in the dark.

In this episode, Pastor Elizabeth Bair returns to The Pastor’s Table to reflect on the quiet tension of pastoral identity, learning to relax into the authority God has given, and why she's not chasing titles, but transformation.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The burden of “proving yourself” in ministry as a young woman
• Singleness and the myth of being “incomplete” in church culture
• When call becomes confirmation: living into the identity God speaks
• Learning to lead with grace when you're underestimated

⏱️ Timestamps:

03:00 – Proving yourself vs. resting in your call

07:00 – The “triple threat”: young, single, female pastor

13:00 – Finding spiritual authority in the midst of critique

20:00 – When ministry fits “like a glove”

27:00 – What Gen Z pastors wish older leaders knew

🧭 Takeaway:

God doesn’t define you by what others see as limitations. He calls you by name. That is enough.

In this episode, youth pastor Elizabeth Bair opens up about stepping into ministry at age 22, navigating life in rural Michigan, and wrestling with loneliness as a single, young woman in a church leadership role. Her honesty is both refreshing and deeply relatable for pastors who feel isolated or unseen.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why Elizabeth almost ran from her calling
• The hidden costs of ministry that no one talks about
• What to do when your prayers for community go unanswered
• How Propel and community theater became lifelines of grace

⏱️ Timestamps:

03:00 – The surprising moment she accepted her call

07:00 – Moving in with her grandmother

10:00 – Confessing loneliness and finding lifelines

17:00 – God’s unexpected answer through art and community

23:00 – The cost of being a woman in ministry

28:00 – Age bias and the challenge of pastoral authority

🔗 Learn more about Propel Cohorts at https://cohorts.propelwomen.org/

💡 Takeaway:

Ministry can be lonely, but you are not alone. God often brings community in unexpected places, and you don’t have to carry the weight of your calling by yourself.

In Part 2 of this powerful conversation, Pastor Paul Dazet opens up about pastoring through cancer, exhaustion, and loss. He found these limitations became a surprising gateway to renewal. With honesty and humility, Paul describes how letting go of performance gave birth to a church culture rooted in healing, authenticity, and radical grace.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The impact of pastoring a small church after leading a growing one
• How vulnerability—not charisma—transformed his congregation
• Why confession and emotional honesty are spiritual practices
• What happens when safety becomes the culture, not just the sermon

⏱️ Timestamps:

01:20 – Embracing limits and learning to love without pretense

04:00 – Deconstruction, reconstruction, and spiritual honesty

07:30 – Mystical moments and learning outside the institution

10:00 – Pastoring alongside his daughter in the same town

13:00 – A new kind of church culture: vulnerability and authenticity

16:00 – Unexpected growth rooted in emotional safety

19:00 – A theology of confession and communal healing

26:00 – A beautiful mess: letting go of performance

28:00 – Health limitations and spiritual clarity

30:00 – Writing, Substack, and the ministry of centering prayer

💡 Takeaway:

Church doesn’t have to be big and perfect community.

Paul’s story is a reminder that when pastors lead from a place of vulnerability and honesty, the Spirit does work no strategy could accomplish. This is a vision of ministry where weakness is not a liability, it’s the doorway to healing.

In Part 1 of this compelling conversation, Paul Dazet joins Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom to reflect on his unexpected path to faith, his climb through the ranks of church leadership, and the moment it all came undone. From a picnic table conversion to the painful fallout of cancer and burnout, Paul shares what it took to stop pretending—and start pastoring with honesty.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why Paul faked his first altar call—and what finally made it real
• The pressure to perform in a results-driven church culture
• How cancer forced him to reexamine his identity and calling
• Leaving the “dream church” to shepherd a smaller, healthier community

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00 – Welcome & Paul’s early background

03:00 – Growing up unchurched and marrying a pastor’s daughter

06:00 – Faking a conversion to impress others

09:00 – Real surrender on a roadside picnic table

12:00 – Falling in love with Scripture and community

16:00 – The business mindset in church leadership

20:00 – Ministry growth, cancer diagnosis, and burnout

25:00 – The personal toll of unresolved pain

28:00 – Leaving behind platform for presence

💡 Takeaway:

Paul’s story is a mirror for every pastor who has felt the gap between ministry success and soul health. Sometimes healing begins not in doing more—but in finally being honest about what’s breaking.

How do pastors hold space when words fall short?

In this deeply personal and reflective episode, Tara Beth Leach reads from her Substack essay, “The Sacred Threshold That is Hospice,” sharing the journey of walking with her mother through dementia and hospice. Joined by co-host Mark Quanstrom, they unpack the theology of presence, the temptation to “preach things pretty,” and the grace found in simply showing up when life unravels.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Tara Beth reads her powerful essay on hospice and her mother’s decline
• Mark and Tara Beth reflect on the role of pastoral presence in seasons of sorrow
• The danger of escapist theology and the invitation to stay with suffering
• How the incarnation shapes our understanding of holy moments at the end of life

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00 – Introduction to the episode

01:08 – Tara Beth reads “The Sacred Threshold That is Hospice”

09:10 – Reflection on writing, presence, and resisting tidy theology

12:00 – How pastoral care sanctifies suffering

18:00 – Blessing, the Beatitudes, and ministry at the margins

21:00 – A story about Jack Puckett and a glimpse of heaven

24:00 – Prayers, hospice, and moments of clarity

28:00 – Grace alone and the stripping away of self-sufficiency

31:00 – Final reflections on presence, sorrow, and God’s mercy

💡 Takeaway:

The holiest moments in ministry are often quiet, unspectacular, and full of grief. But in the hospice room, at the deathbed, and in seasons of deep loss, pastors embody the presence of Christ—not by fixing, but by staying. This is the sacred gift of showing up.

In Part 3, Pastor Ivan Ramirez reflects on his transition from the city streets of Chicago to leading a small-town church in Wisconsin. With humor, vulnerability, and pastoral wisdom, Ivan shares how cultural challenges, ministry mergers, and personal growth have shaped his approach to leadership—and why “let’s see where this goes” has become his life mantra.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why stepping away from ministry became the turning point

• The unlikely path that led Ivan to Burlington, Wisconsin

• Navigating cultural differences and subtle bias as a Hispanic pastor in a white rural context

• How healing, humility, and faithful presence create space for healthy ministry

⏱️ Timestamps:
03:00 — Leaving ministry and finding rest 07:00 — Preaching on July 4 and falling in love with a new church 10:00 — Merging two congregations and selling a building in two days 15:00 — Pastoring as the only Hispanic leader in a white community 19:00 — Confidence, calling, and finishing seminary after 20 years 22:00 — Letting go of “going home” and serving where God sends 27:00 — The wisdom of “let’s see where this goes”

💡 Takeaway:
You don’t have to know the outcome to be obedient.

Ivan’s story reminds us that when we trust God enough to take the next step—even without a plan—He writes stories we never could have imagined.

In Part 2 of this gripping conversation, Pastor Ivan Ramirez shares how he left gang life, survived trial, and discovered God’s call through unlikely mentors, a Moody dorm room, and a courtroom bench. From early ministry mistakes to a doctoral degree, Ivan’s story is one of grace that keeps showing up.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The unexpected grace that led Ivan out of the gang—and into ministry

• Navigating life after jail: roommates, youth ministry, and cereal-fueled discipleship

• Why academic struggle didn’t disqualify his calling

• How pastoring a small church taught him who the gospel is really for

⏱️ Timestamps:
02:30 — Choosing Jesus over gang life… again 06:15 — Transferred to the Christian wing 10:00 — Released from jail and taken in by a youth pastor 13:00 — From GED to Moody Bible Institute 17:30 — Facing trial while attending Bible college 21:00 — Not guilty verdict—and the cost for others 25:00 — Struggling academically but thriving spiritually 28:00 — Learning to pastor without making “little Ivans”

💡 Takeaway:
You don’t need polish to be called. Ivan’s story reminds us that the gospel forms pastors not just through pulpits, but through scars, failures, and second chances. Freedom doesn’t always come in the ways we expect—but it always comes with grace.

In Part 1 of this gripping conversation, Ivan Ramirez shares his remarkable story of searching for belonging, spiraling into despair, and encountering Jesus while facing a murder charge in solitary confinement. What begins as a tale of survival becomes a testimony of grace.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Growing up without church but aware of God

• The loneliness and boredom that led Ivan into gang life

• Dropping out of school—twice—and wrestling with purpose

• Facing suicidal thoughts and crying out to God

• Getting arrested for a crime he didn’t commit—and finding freedom behind bars

⏱️ Timestamps: 03:00 — Ivan’s childhood in Little Village, Chicago 07:00 — The gang lifestyle and dropping out of school 12:00 — Searching for meaning through partying and friendships 16:00 — Depression, suicidal thoughts, and a near-fatal moment 20:00 — Arrested and falsely charged with murder 23:00 — Solitary confinement and discovering the Bible 25:00 — Accepting Christ in a jailhouse chapel 28:00 — The danger of leaving gang life—and the grace that followed

💡 Takeaway: God often shows up in the places we least expect—jail cells, lonely apartments, and broken stories. Ivan’s journey reminds us that no one is beyond reach, and freedom can begin even when the doors are still locked.

From a life-changing fishing trip with strangers to a tearful reconnection with his family and church, Scott reflects on the slow work of reintegration. With honesty about the setbacks and sacred practices that help him stay tethered, this episode is a call to resist isolation, embrace confession, and fight the subtle seduction of success metrics.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Healing through honesty and sacred vulnerability

• Creating relational spaces where confession is normal

• Letting go of success metrics as identity markers

• How to stay rooted when performance whispers loudest

⏱️ Timestamps:
02:20 — What started to shift: "I’m tired of lying." 06:15 — A pastor’s fishing trip—and honest friendship 09:42 — Returning to church, scared but honest 14:00 — Leading without hiding 18:40 — Why metrics nearly broke Scott’s sense of self 22:33 — The WhatsApp group and the gift of confession 28:14 — Soteriology, scars, and staying tethered 32:50 — Closing reflections on hope and hard-won identity

💡 Takeaway:
You don’t have to pretend you’re okay to keep going. The road back is rarely clean or linear—but confession, connection, and calling are still possible on the other side of burnout.

In this raw and courageous conversation, Scott Moore shares his story of stepping into a conflicted congregation, facing impossible expectations, and slowly losing himself in the isolation of unacknowledged burnout.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• How Scott moved from a thriving ministry to a pastor-killing church

• The early warning signs of burnout he didn’t recognize

• Why loyalty to "toughing it out" can deepen the isolation

• What it feels like to lose hope quietly—while still preaching every Sunday

⏱️ Timestamps:
03:00 — Stepping into conflict without knowing it 07:00 — No honeymoon and immediate resistance 12:00 — Internalizing failure and the slow onset of despair 17:00 — Five years of secret depression 24:00 — A surprising invitation to Wyoming—and the first crack of hope

In this honest, unscripted conversation, Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom reflect on the emotional and spiritual aftermath of Holy Week. From packed services and buffet lunches to depression dips and pastoral guilt, they name what many church leaders feel—but rarely say out loud.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why post-Easter exhaustion is real and normal
• The difference between burnout and sacred rest
• How “preacher crowds” reveal spiritual hunger
• What happens when Scripture is read aloud—even to an empty room

⏱️ Timestamps:

02:30 — 16 services in 7 days: Tara Beth’s Holy Week marathon

07:00 — Mark on pastoring in a college town at Easter

10:00 — Why we gorge on buffets and sleep for 12 hours

14:00 — Preacher crowds and the privilege of one-hour ministry

19:00 — Reading Scripture aloud during Lent—even when no one shows up

26:00 — Tazé worship, confirmation joy, and why repetition matters

29:00 — Permission to rest: “Christ is risen… so I don’t have to run the world today.”

💡 Takeaway:

If you feel tired, numb, or unsure after Easter—it doesn’t mean you did anything wrong. Jesus is still risen. Your worth isn’t tied to a service. Rest is sacred, and grace holds you, even when your brain is foggy.

In Part 2 of their candid host recap, Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom reflect on the pressures pastors face to mimic big-box ministry models or speak out on every cultural issue. From franchise churches to the idolization of family and politics, they unpack the theological convictions that keep them grounded—and pastoral.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why mimicking other churches misses the heart of incarnational ministry
• How to lead without getting hijacked by political pressure
• Church as God’s primary redemptive strategy—not politics, not family
• What keeps liberals and conservatives worshiping together

⏱️ Timestamps:

04:30 — The Disney analogy for contextualized ministry

10:00 — How tradition and personality shape different worship styles

13:00 — Mark’s Willow Creek detour and rediscovering pastoral identity

20:00 — Church, not politics or family, as God’s redemptive plan

27:00 — Should pastors name “Tesla” in the pulpit?

31:00 — Creating space for political difference in the Church

In this honest and vulnerable host recap, Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom revisit the origins of The Pastor’s Table and unpack the convictions that continue to drive the show. From painful memories to surprising grace, this episode explores why the Church is still worth loving—and leading.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• How the podcast began in a conversation over coffee
• Redeeming painful ministry memories through time and forgiveness
• The importance of talking theology in real-life spaces
• Why the Church remains central—even when it wounds us

⏱️ Timestamps:

03:00 — How this podcast started (and why)

06:00 — Working out theology with real people

11:00 — When your memory gets redeemed

18:00 — Forgiveness as the path to healing

23:00 — Finding hope after being hurt by the Church

29:00 — The surprising grace in the painful places

💡 Takeaway:

Ministry will wound you—but it will also surprise you.

Through story, theology, and the slow work of grace, The Pastor’s Table is a place to remember why we’re still here, and why the Church is still worth it.

In Part 2, Jason Micheli returns to explore what it means to preach the gospel when life itself feels fragile. He shares how cancer reshaped his theology, why the Church must reclaim its sacramental identity, and how sermons should declare—not just instruct.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The theology of the cross vs. theology of glory
• Why every sermon should offer a promise, not just a takeaway
• Learning to trust the Church when healing doesn’t come
• The sacred weirdness of taking Christian tradition seriously

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:07 — Influences: Barth, Hauerwas & Jensen

07:00 — Preaching as promise, not performance

12:00 — Why suffering belongs in the gospel

15:00 — The Church as the literal body of Christ

17:30 — Preaching that leads to the Table

22:00 — Intimacy with God in suffering

27:00 — Books: Sermon on the Mount, I Like Big Buts, 104 Skins

29:00 — How to pray for Jason

🔗 Resources & Guest Info:

Jason Micheli writes at The Tamed Cynic

Books: I Like Big Buts, The Sermon on the Mount (forthcoming)

In this vulnerable and deeply pastoral episode, Rev. Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom welcome Jason Micheli, United Methodist pastor, author, and writer of The Tamed Cynic. Jason shares his unexpected call to ministry, his battle with mantle cell lymphoma, and how cancer has shaped both his preaching and his relationship with his congregation.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Jason’s unconventional call to ministry and how “permission” became a form of calling
• What it’s like to pastor while actively undergoing chemotherapy
• Why being honest about suffering builds trust in a congregation
• The challenge of preaching Psalm 23 when you're living it

📌 Highlights:

• [00:03:00] Jason hears Jesus say, “Do what you want to do.”
• [00:07:00] Learning how to pastor through a “clergy-killing church”
• [00:12:00] What mantle cell lymphoma has taught Jason about receiving love
• [00:17:00] Preaching through Psalm 23 while becoming “the elephant in the room”
• [00:21:00] Suffering as a place of deeper intimacy with God
• [00:25:00] Why writing and storytelling are acts of pastoral care

💡 Takeaway:

Pastors are often expected to carry everyone else’s burdens—but what happens when they’re the ones who need care? Jason’s story reminds us that vulnerability is not weakness—it’s leadership, and that God is often most present in the dark and hidden places we’d rather avoid.

Read more on Jason's Blog Tamed Cynic: https://jasonmicheli.substack.com

📖 Next Week:

In Part 2, Jason opens up about the theological convictions that shape his ministry—expect a deep dive into the theology of the cross, suffering, and the beauty of telling the truth.

In this episode, Rev. Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom continue their conversation with Ryan & Danny Quanstrom, digging into the theological convictions that shape their ministries.

From embodying the gospel in a rural town to creating third spaces for belonging, this episode explores how place matters in pastoring—and why the church must resist the forces that isolate and fragment communities.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why ministry isn’t about programs—it’s about presence.
• How theology of place shapes their vision for the church.
• The challenge of pastoring in a world designed to erase human connection.
• Practical ways to build spaces where people experience belonging, dignity, and love.
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📌 Highlights:

• [00:05:00] Ryan on how modern culture teaches us to avoid each other—& why the church must resist that.
• [00:12:00] Danny on why churches shouldn’t just reflect their communities—they should reflect the Kingdom.
• [00:19:00] Building third spaces: How Ryan turned Wednesdays into a church-wide community meal.
• [00:26:00] Danny on pastoring in a historically segregated town and making space for diversity.
• [00:36:00] Why courage and love are at the heart of true pastoral leadership.

💡 Takeaway:

Pastoring is about embodied presence in a particular place, among particular people. In a world designed to make us bypass relationships, the church is called to build spaces where people linger, belong, and transform.

In this special family edition of The Pastor’s Table, Rev. Tara Beth Leach takes the lead, sitting down with Ryan & Danny Quanstrom, both senior pastors in Michigan and the sons of co-host Dr. Mark Quanstrom.

This conversation explores how faith is formed in the home, the unexpected twists in their calls to ministry, and what shaped their theological vision for pastoring today. It’s an inside look at the joys, struggles, and surprises of answering the call—especially when you grew up in the church.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• What it was like growing up in a pastor’s home—the good, the bad, and the unexpected.
• How Ryan & Danny’s call to ministry unfolded (and why it wasn’t always a straight path).
• The tension of pastoral identity, academic ambition, and finding where you truly belong.
• A glimpse into their ministry contexts—from suburban Grand Rapids to a rural county seat.

📌 Highlights:

• [00:05:00] A 5-year-old Ryan leads his friend to Jesus—right before jumping off a garage.
• [00:12:00] Danny planned to be a history teacher—but God had other ideas.
• [00:21:00] Wrestling with pastoral calling vs. academic ambition—and how they reconciled both.
• [00:28:00] The unique challenges of pastoring in Grand Rapids vs. small-town Michigan.

💡 Takeaway:

Ministry isn’t always a straight path, and pastors don’t all come from the same mold—even in the same family. Whether you grew up in the church or came to ministry later in life, God’s call often weaves through unexpected places.

📖 Next Week:

What theological convictions shape Ryan & Danny’s pastoral leadership today? Join us for Part 2, where we dig into the theological frameworks that guide their ministry.

In this episode, Rev. Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom continue their conversation with Randy Frazee, exploring how culture—not just strategy—determines a church’s future.

Randy shares how his leadership philosophy has shifted over the years—from top-down leadership models to team-based collaboration, from focusing on numbers to prioritizing engagement. His wisdom is a must-hear for pastors wrestling with staff culture, leadership expectations, and burnout.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why culture eats strategy for breakfast—and how to shape it well.
• How collaborative leadership (instead of top-down models) creates healthier churches.
• Why self-awareness and humility matter more than being a "visionary leader."
• How pastors can embrace their strengths instead of trying to do it all.

📌 Highlights:

• [00:06:00] The danger of fear-based leadership and how Randy’s approach has changed.
• [00:12:00] “We stopped counting attendance and started measuring engagement.”
• [00:19:00] Why hiring well means knowing what you’re bad at.
• [00:24:00] Moving from ownership to stewardship—how to stop making church about you.



💡 Takeaway:

Pastors don’t have to be everything to everyone. True leadership comes from embracing your strengths, surrounding yourself with the right people, and fostering a culture where others thrive.

In this episode, Rev. Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom sit down with Randy Frazee, Pastor Emeritus of Westside Family Church, to talk about his intentional journey of succession, the emotional weight of stepping away, and what it means to let go with grace.

With over 36 years in ministry, Randy reflects on the wisdom, courage, and planning that made his transition smooth—and why every pastor should be thinking about succession, legacy, and identity beyond the pulpit.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Why Randy started planning his succession three years ago.
• How pastors can separate their identity from their role in ministry.
• The biggest mistakes churches make in leadership transitions.
• The freedom of releasing control and trusting God with the next chapter.

📌 Highlights:

• [00:05:00] What does it mean to be “Pastor Emeritus” and how does it actually work?
• [00:12:00] From an unchurched childhood to pastoring for 36 years—Randy’s unexpected call.
• [00:22:00] Life planning and how coaching helped clarify Randy’s next steps.
• [00:27:00] How to leave a church without bitterness, regret, or burnout.

💡 Takeaway:

Pastors, you are free to leave. Whether it’s five years or fifty years into ministry, succession done well is an act of faithfulness, not failure. Randy’s story challenges us to think about the long game of pastoral leadership—one that prioritizes healthy transitions, church culture, and a legacy that outlasts us.

📖 Next Week:

How does a pastor shape culture—on staff, in leadership, and throughout the church? Join us as we dive into this topic with Randy in Part 2!

In this episode, Tara and Mark continue their conversation with Derek Vreeland, diving into how these seemingly distinct streams of faith are coming together in a new movement of worship and discipleship.

Derek shares why weekly communion, historic prayers, and Spirit-led worship are forming his church in deep and lasting ways. Plus, they explore how the sacraments can tether us to faith in seasons of doubt, and why pastors need to embrace both mystery and tradition in leading their people.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The rise of sacramental-charismatic worship—and why it matters.
• How weekly communion can shape both individuals and entire congregations.
• The power of liturgical prayers to sustain faith in dark seasons.
• How pastors can lead through doubt, weariness, and the dark night of the soul.

📌 Highlights:

• [00:07:00] The convergence of sacrament, scripture, and Spirit in today’s church.
• [00:12:00] Why taking communion weekly never becomes “rote” or routine.
• [00:18:00] How the Eucharist and liturgy sustain believers in crisis.
• [00:25:00] When you can’t pray—let the church pray for you.
• [00:27:00] Why memorized prayers (like the Jesus Prayer) are lifelines in spiritual deserts.

💡 Takeaway:

Derek reminds us that faith is communal, not just personal. Whether through communion, liturgy, or intercessory prayer, the body of Christ carries us in seasons of doubt and darkness—so we don’t have to walk alone.

📖 Next Week:

How do pastors lead when they are the ones going through the dark night of the soul? We’ll explore that and more in our next episode.

In this episode, Rev. Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom sit down with Derek Vreeland, discipleship pastor at Word of Life Church in St. Joseph, Missouri. Derek shares his journey from a Southern Baptist upbringing to the charismatic movement and, eventually, a sacramental, ecumenical faith—all while remaining deeply rooted in the Church.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The pivotal moment as a teenager when Derek first encountered Jesus.
• How studying scripture led him away from rigid formulas and into the mystery of faith.
• Why he never felt the need to "deconstruct"—but still experienced profound transformation.
• How pastors can lead faithfully through personal seasons of doubt and transition.

📌 Highlights:

• [00:03:00] A Friday night youth group event that changed everything.
• [00:07:00] From Baptist to charismatic—how scripture challenged his assumptions.
• [00:13:00] "Don’t do what I did—but it worked!" The unexpected ways God speaks.
• [00:19:00] Does every Christian need a “deconstruction” story? Or is there another way?
• [00:26:00] Navigating the dark night of the soul without losing your faith.

💡 Takeaway:

Not every faith journey requires tearing everything down. Derek’s story reminds us that spiritual growth can be a slow, steady process of transformation, where God leads us deeper into trust, mystery, and love for the Church.

📖 Next Week:

How do pastors lead through the dark night of the soul—for themselves and their congregations? Join us next week as we dive into this question with Derek.

In this episode, Rev. Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom continue their conversation with pastor and church planter Laura Tarro, exploring how patience, trust, and a few unconventional worship spaces (yes, a donut shop and a brewery) have shaped her ministry.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The unexpected church visit that finally affirmed Laura’s pastoral call.
• Why embracing the title of “pastor” was harder than expected.
• How planting a church in a donut shop (and later, a brewery) became a story of God’s provision.
• The tension of wanting measurable success but trusting God to grow the church in His way.

📌 Highlights:

• [00:05:00] “We’re going to call you pastor”—the moment that changed everything.
• [00:12:00] Church planting without striving: “God builds His church, not us.”
• [00:16:00] From donuts to drafts: How a donut shop and a brewery became places of worship.
• [00:23:00] Wrestling with the need for progress while trusting God’s pace.

💡 Takeaway:

Laura’s story reminds us that faithfulness matters more than metrics. When we surrender our expectations and trust in God’s provision, we find freedom from the pressure to perform and space to let the Spirit lead.

In this compelling episode, Rev. Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom welcome church planter, pastor, and theologian Laura Tarro to share her inspiring story of waiting, persistence, and faithfulness. 

Laura opens up about her unconventional call to ministry, the barriers she faced, and how God led her to steward her gifts for the church.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Laurra’s early sense of calling and how it clashed with her conservative upbringing.
• Navigating spaces that questioned women’s leadership in ministry.
• Hearing God’s call to “something more” and the surprising ways it unfolded.
• The tension of loving the church while waiting for it to make space for her gifts.

📌 Highlights:

• [01:15] Meet Laura Tarro: Pastor, Scholar, and Church Planter
• [02:10] Laura's Unconventional Journey to Ministry
• [04:18] Challenges and Barriers in Ministry
• [12:40] A Turning Point: Embracing the Call
• [16:35] Starting a New Chapter: Church Planting
• [21:58] Navigating Church Dynamics and Finding a New Path
• [30:26] Theological Convictions and Final Thoughts

💡 Takeaway:

Laura’s story reminds us that God’s timing is often slower than ours, but His faithfulness is steadfast. Even when the road to ministry seems blocked, God prepares the way for those He calls.

📖 Next Week:

Join us for Part 2 as Laura dives deeper into her journey, sharing the theological convictions that have shaped her ministry and how they continue to guide her today.

In the final part of this compelling conversation, Rev. Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom sit down with Pastor Greg Wenhold to discuss the unique dynamics of pastoral succession, the power of trust in leadership, and the ongoing work of transformation at Good Shepherd Church.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• How a “redeemed succession plan” brought Greg and Tara Beth together in ministry.
• The delicate balance of leadership and humility in a thriving church community.
• Lessons on honoring a church’s past while calling it forward into God’s future.
• Practical insights on co-leading, mutual respect, and modeling healthy transitions.

📌 Highlights:

• 01:26 Pastoral Challenges and Anxieties
• 02:15 The Journey Back to Good Shepherd
• 03:46 The Fear of Failure
• 08:49 The Decision to Return
• 10:13 Navigating Leadership Dynamics
• 12:18 Reflections on Pastoral Leadership
• 14:30 Navigating Funeral Requests
• 15:30 Mutual Respect and Trust in Leadership
• 17:07 Honoring Past Leadership
• 20:26 Practical Roles and Responsibilities
• 24:56 Challenges and Anomalies in Church Leadership
• 29:55 Calling the Church Forward

💡 Takeaway:

This episode is a testament to God’s ability to work through unconventional paths, weaving redemption into every stage of ministry. Whether you’re stepping into a new role, supporting a leader, or transitioning out, trust that God’s plans are always for the good of His church.

📖 Additional Reflection:

How can your leadership amplify the mission of others and build trust in your community? Share your thoughts with us!

In this second part of their conversation with Pastor Greg Wenhold, Rev. Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom explore the challenges and growth that come with navigating transitions, including stepping away from—and returning to—a beloved church community.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Lessons from an unconventional call to ministry.
• The hard conversations and deep growth during seasons of leadership change.
• Embracing God’s timing in moments of uncertainty and transition.
• A pastor’s wisdom on leading with humility and trusting God’s sovereignty.

📌 Highlights:

• 00:32 Unconventional Paths in Ministry
• 02:16 Challenges and Growth at Good Shepherd
• 03:50 Embezzlement Revelation
• 05:21 Leadership Transitions and Reflections
• 10:17 Retirement and New Beginnings
• 14:34 Navigating Church Leadership During COVID
• 18:03 Mass Exodus and Church Challenges
• 20:25 The Glass Cliff Dilemma
• 21:49 A Divine Calling and Guest Preaching
• 24:43 Holy Mischief and Acceptance
• 27:31 Facing Congregational Expectations
• 31:34 Concluding Thoughts and Future Plans

💡 Takeaway:

Greg’s story serves as a reminder that God’s plans often unfold in ways we don’t expect. Trusting His timing, staying humble, and keeping Christ as the center of ministry allow us to navigate even the hardest transitions with grace and hope.

In this episode, Tara Beth Leach and Mark Quanstrom sit down with Pastor Greg Wenhold to explore his unconventional and inspiring pastoral story. From being "gently led" into ministry to navigating unexpected transitions, Greg’s journey is filled with honesty, resilience, and grace.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• How Greg’s unique call to ministry unfolded over time.
• The role of faithful mentors and unexpected opportunities in shaping a pastor.
• Navigating transitions—including leaving and returning to the same church.
• Wisdom for young pastors feeling the weight of uncertainty in their calling.

📌 Highlights:

• 01:09 Introducing Special Guest: Pastor Greg Wenhold
• 02:08 Pastor Greg's Journey and Mentorship
• 04:38 The Unique Path to Ministry
• 05:36 Early Ministry Experiences
• 08:05 Finding a Calling in Seminary
• 14:46 Innovative Worship in the Lutheran Church
• 18:03 A Call to Sioux Falls
• 19:08 The Unexpected Envelope
• 21:25 A New Beginning at Good Shepherd
• 21:55 Challenges and Burnout
• 24:23 A Mentor's Call
• 25:15 Returning Home
• 26:23 The Struggle for Leadership
• 27:48 Missionary Journey
• 28:44 Co-Senior Leadership
• 34:06 Final Reflections and Advice

💡 Takeaway:

Your pastoral journey doesn’t need to fit a template. Greg’s story is a reminder that God works through every twist and turn, equipping us for the work He calls us to do.

In this heartfelt continuation, Tara Beth and Mark share honest reflections on their daily rhythms, the grace required for pastoral work, and the joy found in staying grounded amidst the demands.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• Living within the boundaries of God’s grace for the calling.
• The quiet work of sermon preparation: listening for the Spirit and discerning the needs of the congregation.
• Balancing ministry and family life through intentional rhythms and heartfelt priorities.
• Moments of levity—from pre-writing jitters to creative hideouts for getting the work done.

💡 Takeaway:

In the midst of long hours and deep responsibility, the work of pastoring is filled with grace. This episode invites you into the heart of the pastoral vocation, reminding us all of the beauty and challenge of answering God’s call.

📌 Highlights:

• 00:32 Balancing Pastoral Duties and Personal Life
• 04:58 The Concept of Sabbath for Pastors
• 07:56 Sermon Preparation Strategies
• 14:27 The Importance of Research in Sermon Writing
• 17:50 A Young Pastor's Early Challenges
• 18:50 Weekly Sermon Struggles
• 22:14 The Importance of Staff Connection
• 26:18 Balancing Ministry and Family
• 31:16 Reflecting on Pastoral Work
• 32:17 Looking Ahead to 2025

In this candid and lighthearted episode, Tara Beth and Mark pull back the curtain on their daily routines, juggling ministry, family, and their own spiritual practices.

🎙️ In This Episode:

• The unique rhythms of pastoral life: from Sunday sermons to late-night small groups.
• Hilarious and humbling moments, including DoorDash mishaps and the reality of managing schedules.
• Insight into the pressures of ministry, including the differences in expectations for male and female pastors.
• How these two leaders balance preaching, leadership, and their personal lives.

📌 Highlights:

• 00:59 Reflecting on Past Guests and Personal Pastoring Experiences
• 02:11 Managing Pastoral Schedules
• 04:25 The Challenges of Calendar Management
• 07:04 Embarrassing Stories and DoorDash Adventures
• 11:06 Sunday Morning Routines
• 14:08 Early Morning Routine and Church Preparation
• 14:30 Support from Jeff: Breakfast and Sermon Prep
• 17:37 Sunday Services: The Pastor Scramble
• 20:35 Balancing Church Duties and Family Time
• 21:36 Monday Meetings and Small Group Fellowship
• 22:56 Teaching and Administrative Responsibilities
• 24:07 Weekly Prayer and Staff Meetings
• 29:42 Reflecting on Pastoral Life and Future Topics

In this heartfelt conversation, Reverend Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom sit down with Mandy Smith to uncover the transformative power of vulnerability in ministry. Instead of feeling pressured to have every answer or maintain a polished facade, discover how owning our weaknesses allows God’s strength to shine through.

Mandy shares her personal journey—moments of crisis, the temptation of the “perfect leader” lie, and the profound relief in letting go. Together, they explore how gender dynamics influence leadership, the importance of truthful self-reflection, and why authentic shepherding resonates more deeply than scripted competence. 

If you’ve ever felt the weight of needing to appear flawless in pastoral work, this episode offers encouragement to lead boldly from a place of honesty and trust.

Timestamps:

00:46 Continuing the Conversation on Vulnerability

02:37 Mandy’s Crisis and Revelation

04:24 The Lie of the Perfect Leader

07:46 The Role of Gender in Ministry

09:16 The Burden of Leadership

10:46 God’s Strength in Our Weakness

14:12 The Call to Authentic Leadership

28:31 The Journey of Redemption

31:51 Closing Thoughts and Book Recommendations

We fear that if people knew who we really are, we'd be disqualified from ministry.Not so. Mandy Smith unpacks the biblical paradox that God's strength is revealed through our human weakness. 

Transparently describing her pastoral journey, Smith shows how vulnerability shapes ministry, through our spiritual practices and relationships, influencing our preaching, teaching and even the nuts and bolts of the daily schedule. Understanding our human constraints makes our ministry more sustainable and guards us against disillusionment and burnout.

Timestamp:

00:36 Celebrating Milestones and Special Guests

01:40 Mandy Smith's Journey to Pastorship

03:44 Challenges and Triumphs in Ministry

21:21 Leading with Vulnerability and Faith

32:24 Concluding Thoughts and Encouragement

In this episode, Pastor Vicki Kopp discusses her journey into ministry later in life, her challenges following her husband's death from pancreatic cancer, and the unwavering strength provided by her faith and congregation. 

Personal suffering informs and often deepens pastoral care for others.

Timestamp: 

00:47 Vicki's Call to Ministry

01:34 Challenges and Triumphs in Ministry

02:42 Dan's Illness and Community Support

05:40 Life After Dan's Passing

12:17 The Healing Power of Ministry

18:14 Empathy Through Shared Suffering

26:15 Closing Thoughts and Future Conversations

They explore the dynamics of church leadership, gender challenges, and her personal experiences, including the profound loss of her husband and the ongoing mission to serve her congregation.

Timestamps: 

00:35 Meet Reverend Vicki Kopp

02:36 Vicki's Journey to Ministry

05:43 Challenges and Triumphs in Ministry

09:40 Becoming a Pastor in Cameron, Missouri

12:51 Navigating Pastoral Roles and Responsibilities

18:15 Personal and Professional Struggles

25:41 Conclusion and Reflections

Join Reverend Tara Beth Leach, Dr. Mark Quanstrom, and guest David Bunce from Bad Ishel, Austria, as they explore the theological and existential challenges of justifying a church's existence in modern society. Dive into deep conversations about community, cultural pressures, and the essence of the church's mission while understanding diverse perspectives from both the U.S. and Austria.

Timestamps

01:25 The Mission and Justification of the Church

02:21 Theological Reflections on Church Identity

03:32 Challenges of Small Church Communities

04:10 The Role of the Church in the Community

07:39 Understanding Church Through the Lens of Dementia

11:05 Practical Church Leadership and Community

12:40 Cultural and Contextual Dynamics in Church Life

19:53 Church Weekend Retreat Insights

22:09 Global Church Challenges and Solutions

28:15 Final Thoughts and Farewell

David Bunce shares his experience leading a church community in Bad Ischl, Austria.  

Tara Beth and Mark delve into the unique challenges and experiences of David. Discover the complexities of pastoring in a culturally Catholic and secularizing Europe, and explore the evolving mission of the church in this context. 

Timestamps:

00:34 Meet Pastor David Bunce from Austria

01:57 David's Spiritual Journey

03:34 Understanding European Baptist Theology

04:47 Life and Ministry in Austria

09:16 Challenges and Cultural Context

15:26 Mission and Community Engagement

25:32 Reflections and Future Conversations

Yet after a season of serving in academia, he found himself in a community that would prove to be tremendously supportive. On December 9th, 2022 Kyle’s daughter Jaya experienced a traumatic brain injury. Kyle shares about his experience of ministering through weakness and the way his church carried his burdens.  

Despite all the pain of this moment, Kyle found strength in weakness. 

Read more about Kyle processing his daughter’s accident on Jaya Fever’s Caring Bridge - https://www.caringbridge.org/site/public/1e79b5f2-c4c3-3e3b-9ff3-e0107e40a7fc 

You Can reach Kyle on email at kfever@miseminary.com 

Timestamps

01:17 Kyle Feaver's Background and Ministry

04:21 Transition to Pastoral Ministry

11:31 Challenges and Reflections in Ministry

16:06 Embracing Vulnerability and Community Support

17:23 A Life-Altering Accident

19:22 The Struggles of Recovery

22:56 Seeking Help and Taking a Leave

26:09 Returning to the Community

27:54 The Power of Showing Up

32:38 Conclusion and Looking Ahead

Over the past six weeks, their conversations with local pastors have illuminated the pressing need for consistent Christian values in the political arena beyond election seasons. The dialogue emphasizes addressing privilege, especially white privilege, in political contexts and voting behaviors. The hosts discuss the balance required between secular and divine responsibilities, stressing authenticity and vulnerability in leadership. They invite listeners to reflect on personal and theological values, examine the compromises in voting, and engage with strategies to empower congregations to address community needs. 

Through shared pastoral experiences, the episode aims to offer refreshing insights and encourages unpretentious, authentic leadership.

Timestamps:

00:34 Reflecting on Past Conversations

02:44 Navigating Political Seasons in the Church

03:52 Creating a Political Podcast Series

07:30 Balancing Theological Convictions and Political Engagement

09:04 Addressing Privilege and Political Responsibility

15:45 The Apocalyptic Nature of Elections

17:26 Is the Constitution Enough?

18:16 Political Creatures and Their Convictions

19:16 The Dilemma of Voting

20:26 Two Kingdom Theology

21:21 The Flaws of Each Candidate

23:41 Local Politics and Shepherding

24:47 Pastoring in Challenging Times

26:01 Leading with Vulnerability

28:10 Upcoming Topics and Guests

31:32 Gratitude and Farewell

The discussion addresses how Christians can navigate political ideologies, empowering local congregations to enact meaningful change and avoid isolating themselves. Caitlin emphasizes understanding scripture holistically to inform both private spiritual and public political life, advocating for regular integration of faith and political discourse beyond just election seasons. 

The conversation highlights the importance of prayer, community engagement, and long-term spiritual formation over quick fixes. The episode encourages pastors to be non-partisan, responsive to their specific context, and to guide their congregations with wisdom and compassion.

Timestamps 

00:34 Reflecting on Kaitlyn Schiess' Insights

02:07 Empowering Local Churches

04:15 The Intersection of Faith and Politics

05:51 Scripture and Political Relevance

07:59 Balancing Political Engagement and Faith

14:14 Challenges of Discussing Politics in Church

17:44 Practical Advice for Pastors

25:47 Concluding Thoughts and Blessings

How do Bible passages written thousands of years ago apply to politics today? What can we learn from America's history of using the Bible in politics? How can we converse with people whose views differ from our own?

Kaitlyn Schiess explores these questions and more in The Ballot and the Bible. She unpacks examples of how Americans have connected the Bible to politics in the past, highlighting times it was applied well and times it was egregiously misused.

In this episode, Kaitlyn shares her journey from studying history at Liberty University to authoring 'The Ballot and the Bible,' discussing the challenges pastors face in addressing political issues within their congregations.

Timestamps: 

00:33 Navigating Politics in the Church

01:03 Introducing Caitlin Schuss

02:55 Caitlin's Journey and Insights

04:42 The Impact of Politics on Faith

06:18 The Liturgy of Politics

09:36 Challenges and Costs of Speaking Out

19:43 Historical Context and Modern Challenges

24:39 The Role of the Church in Political Discourse

29:48 Conclusion and Next Steps

“We hold these truths to be self-evident.” This beloved phrase from the Declaration of Independence isn’t “self-evident” for everyone in the world.  Dr. Bird gives a helpful perspective to understand the pervasive impact of the Christian Gospel on society.  

Dr. Bird discusses the strengths and weaknesses of the Anabaptist tradition, the role of Christians in politics, and the historical roots of democratic systems in Christian thought. This dialogue explores how Christians can navigate participation in government while maintaining theological integrity and offers practical insights into balancing prophetic witness with political engagement.

Timestamps: 

02:05 Anabaptist vs. Anglican Debate

05:06 Christian Involvement in Politics

13:00 The Christian Foundation of Western Politics

22:01 Concluding Thoughts and Reflections

Dr. Michael Bird offers a fresh and candid perspective on the current American political landscape, drawing compelling comparisons between the U.S. and Australia. Michael, Tara, and Mark explore the challenges pastors face as they strive to maintain theological integrity in a politically polarized environment.

From the influence of social media to societal shifts, Dr. Bird breaks down the complex dynamics shaping faith and politics today. He emphasizes the critical need for unity within the church, even as divisive political forces continue to grow. Whether you're a pastor, church leader, or simply seeking clarity on how faith intersects with politics, this episode delivers profound insights on navigating these turbulent times.

Episode Timestamps:

01:33 Dr. Bird's Early Life and Background

04:35 Journey to Faith and Academic Pursuits

07:49 Observations on American Politics

14:51 Challenges for Pastors in Political Times

21:01 The Role of Secularism and Religious Freedom

24:41 Next Week Preview 

This pervasive apocalyptic language is forming the people in our rows.  

Scot McKnight delves into the intricate topic of how current political climates and social media influence church congregations. The discussion explores the challenge of counteracting this pervasive influence without being overtly political from the pulpit. McKnight emphasizes the power of creating an alternative theopolitical narrative and encourages a stronger ecclesiology that prioritizes the teachings of Jesus and the Kingdom of God over partisan politics. 

It is possible to transform church culture to align with biblical principles of justice and equity, steering away from political partisanship. This thought-provoking episode offers pastors perspectives and language to help guide their congregations through these turbulent times.

Timestamps:

00:34 Discussing Politics in the Pulpit

02:22 The Power of Apocalyptic Language

05:56 Creating an Alternative Theopolitics

10:32 The Role of the Church in Society

23:06 Concluding Thoughts and Reflections

Should pastors ignore the political issues of the day? Does timing matter when it comes to talking about cultural and political issues?  Dr. Scot McKnight discusses these questions and more with Mark & Tara Beth. They delve into the challenges pastors face when addressing political topics from the pulpit and explore the importance of maintaining theological integrity while navigating diverse political perspectives within their congregations. 

McKnight shares his experiences, insights, and advice on how pastors can speak truthfully yet carefully, ensuring they remain pastoral leaders for all sides. The conversation focuses on the broader implications of political discourse in the church and the necessity of prioritizing the gospel message over political allegiances.

Timestamps

03:36 - Navigating Politics in the Church

06:17 - Challenges of Political Discussions

10:19 - Balancing Pastoral Responsibilities

15:52 - The Role of Pastors in a Politically Charged Environment

29:03 - Concluding Thoughts and Next Episode Preview

Tara Beth & Mark discuss their personal experience of pastoring through previous election seasons. They share personal anecdotes and strategies for addressing divisive political climates within congregations, emphasizing the importance of humility, gentleness, and theological integrity. 

Nurturing a congregation to be more like Jesus is always challenging.  Gain wisdom from Mark & Tara Beth’s experiences navigating these seasons. The call to pastor well is critical in these seasons!  

Pastors, you are not alone in your struggles to shepherd your communities through complex political landscapes. It’s possible to have a balanced approach to navigating these tumultuous times.

Timestamps: 

00:34 Fall Season and Church Activities

03:05 Election Season and Pastoral Challenges

05:41 Navigating Political Sermons

11:56 Cultural and Political Tensions in Church

14:14 Fear and Emergency Plans Post-Election

15:30 A Polarized Congregation Reacts

17:20 Communion Sunday Controversy

19:31 Backlash and Accusations

23:51 Navigating Racial Tensions in Church

26:08 Preaching Political Messages

29:19 Humility and Political Perspectives

33:39 Conclusion and Call to Unity

In this episode of The Pastor's Table Podcast, the focus is on Tara Beth's course highlights the empowerment of women in ministry through mentorship. Tara Beth shares her personal experiences, including her transformative encounters with female leaders. She offers practical advice on fostering supportive relationships among women, mentoring, and navigating the cultural and biblical contexts surrounding gender roles in ministry. 

Tara Beth also explores gender roles in Christian marriages. The importance of partnership is so profound and to have a supportive spouse in ministry is paramount.  There is so much important insight about what ways husbands can be supportive of their spouses in ministry.  

Timestamps: 

00:29 Meeting Carla Sundberg: A Personal Story

01:42 Challenges and Importance of Female Mentorship

03:37 Concrete Actions for Empowering Women in Ministry

06:17 The Lie of Tokenism and Embracing Sisterhood

07:13 Biblical Examples of Female Support: Mary and Elizabeth

11:12 Personal Reflections on Non-Traditional Christian Marriage

13:24 Biblical Foundations of Gender Equality

22:38 Paul's Teachings on Marriage and Mutual Submission

Tara shares personal stories and biblical references to discuss the challenges women face in ministry, including stereotypes and opposition. She emphasizes the importance of embracing one's unique, God-given traits—whether nurturing or assertive—and offers practical advice on dealing with opposition while staying true to one's calling. 

Through scripture and personal experiences, Tara highlights the diverse ways women can lead and serve effectively in ministry.

Timestamps:

00:29 Facing Gender Bias

01:15 The Struggle with Leadership Perceptions

03:32 Biblical Examples of Nurturing Leadership

05:18 Breaking Gender Stereotypes in Ministry

09:23 Facing Opposition in Ministry

14:01 Dealing with Bitterness and Anger

15:51 Practical Tips for Handling Opposition

19:21 A Story of Forgiveness and Healing

In this Seminary Now course, Pastor Tara Beth Leach issues a stirring call for a new generation of women in ministry: to teach, to preach, to shepherd, and to lead. God not only permits women to minister—he emboldens, empowers, and unleashes women to lead out of the fullness of who they are. The church cannot reach its full potential without women using their God-given gifts. Leach provides practical expertise for how women can find their place at the table, escape impostor syndrome, face opposition, mentor others, and much more.

Learn more about Seminary Now at https://seminarynow.com/

Tara Beth & Mark explore with Matt Croasmun the implications of understanding sin beyond an individualistic framework. America has a set of unique cultural norms that make it challenging to understand all that Paul has to say about the impact of sin on the community.  

Dr. Croasmun discusses the vital role of community in understanding sin, the influence of social systems, and the importance of fostering healthy communities that embody the teachings of Christ. The conversation also touches on the challenges pastors face in maintaining personal integrity and creating cultures that reflect the Kingdom of God. Listeners are invited to reflect on the formation of their own identities and the potential of the church to serve as a powerful witness to the broader society.

Timestamps: 

00:55 Understanding Sin Beyond Individualism

02:07 The Social Nature of Sin and Personhood

06:33 Implications for Pastoral Leadership

09:22 The Role of Community in Spiritual Formation

16:40 The Power of Imitation in Christian Life

21:13 The Church as a Model for Society

29:53 Concluding Thoughts and Future Conversations

In this episode of The Pastor's Table, hosts Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom engage in a compelling conversation with Dr. Matthew Croasmun about the multifaceted nature of sin. Drawing from his book, "The Emergence of Sin," Dr. Croasmun discusses sin from personal, social, and cosmic perspectives, challenging the conventional view that sin is merely individual misdeeds or social ills. He shares his journey from the Midwest to Yale, his accidental church planting experience, and the significance of embracing a comprehensive understanding of sin as a cosmic force that constrains our moral freedom and opposes our efforts to do right.

Dr. Croasmun's perspective re-mythologizes the world through scientific and theological lenses, presenting sin as an emergent feature of a vast human network of transgression. Yet, this power is real and personal, necessitating our resistance. The discussion emphasizes the importance of viewing Paul's ancient text as a relevant field manual for modern living. This episode invites pastors and church leaders to adopt a robust understanding of sin, promising to delve deeper into its practical implications in future episodes.

Timestamps: 

01:57 Journey from Midwest to Yale

05:17 Accidental Church Planting

17:59 Theological Insights on Sin

32:23 Implications for Pastoral Ministry

34:31 Closing Blessings and Reflections

The fact is that many of us struggle with a gap between what we believe about God and how we encounter him in our everyday lives. We don't want our faith to be merely conceptual—we want to experience it viscerally—and yet we often come up against one or more of these major gaps:

• I believe God loves me, but I don't feel it.
• I believe God is with me, but I don't see him.
• I thought I'd be further along in my spiritual progress by now.

In The Expectation Gap, Steve Cuss—pastor and founder of the leadership organization Capable Life—offers tangible tools for engaging with God in a deeper, more soul-satisfying way. You'll unveil harmful expectations and patterns that keep you spiritually stuck so that you can replace them with habits and practices that will lead to a more vibrant faith life.

Timestamps: 

01:01 Understanding the Expectation Gap

01:46 Exploring Core Gaps in Faith

02:31 The Struggle with God's Love and Presence

02:57 Reactivity and Awareness of God's Presence

03:39 The Challenge of Measuring Faith

08:02 Misinterpretations of Biblical Stories

17:51 Personal Reflections and Vulnerability

18:11 Struggling with Guilt on Vacation

18:40 Letting God Carry the Relationship

19:15 Relaxing into God's Presence

20:33 The Challenge of Following Jesus Today

21:59 The Complexity of Modern Faith

24:33 Ordinary Lives, Extraordinary Faith

33:15 Embracing Your Unique Calling

34:57 Final Thoughts and Encouragement

In this episode of The Pastor's Table, Steve discusses his journey of finding the end of himself. From being unchurched to becoming a pastor, his transformative experiences as a hospital chaplain, and the challenges of pastoral leadership. Highlighting the importance of vulnerability, self-awareness, and managing anxiety, Steve shares valuable lessons for pastors and church leaders.

There are ways in which we can recognize and manage what is going on in our leadership anxiety.  Steve discusses all this and more about how we can be human size in our pastoring. 

Learn more about Steve’s work at stevecusswords.com 

Timestamps 

00:33 Meet Steve Cuss: Journey into Ministry

06:58 The Impact of Chaplaincy

22:29 Managing Leadership Anxiety

25:02 Navigating Pastoral Challenges

28:58 Resources and Conclusion

In this episode of The Pastor's Table, Tara Beth and Mark discuss the challenges and joys of pastoral life beyond the pulpit. They share personal anecdotes, including Mark's weekly routine and the guilty pleasure of watching 'Survivor,' and Tara Beth's heartfelt journey of caring for her mother with dementia. 

Play & rest are essential to tending to personal and familial responsibilities, arguing for a holistic approach to ministry that integrates both sacred duties and everyday life. Pastors are at their best when they embrace their humanity and find balance in their lives.

Timestamps: 

01:31 The Confession: Midweek Struggles

02:53 Finding Joy in Simple Pleasures

04:40 The Importance of Play and Rest

10:05 Caring for Aging Parents

13:01 The Holiness of Everyday Life

24:14 Final Thoughts and Encouragement

In this episode of the Pastor's Table, hosts Reverend Tara Beth Leach and Dr. Mark Quanstrom candidly discuss the challenges pastors face in balancing their professional and personal lives. They share personal anecdotes about their own struggles and strategies for maintaining well-being, such as embracing hobbies and setting boundaries. 

Tara Beth highlights her therapeutic connection with horses, while Mark reflects on the sanctity of family time and his passion for sailing. Together, they offer an encouraging message for pastors to embrace the everyday gifts and rhythms that bring balance and joy into their lives.

Timestamps: 

01:56 Balancing Pastoral Duties and Family Life

03:44 Personal Stories and Reflections

07:14 Establishing Healthy Rhythms

12:18 Family Time and Personal Hobbies

19:06 Rediscovering a Passion for Horses

19:28 Balancing Work and Competitive Riding

21:11 The Therapeutic Bond with Horses

23:20 Encouraging Hobbies for Pastors

24:18 Sailing: A Personal Journey

29:52 Embracing Life's Gifts

30:30 Final Thoughts and Encouragement

When we behold God there is a transformative power that flows. In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus subverts so many ways in which we view spirituality.  Life with God transcends moralism, successism, and individualism. In this conversation, Mark & Tara Beth have a profound discussion with Pastor Rich Villodas.  

Pre-Order The Narrow Way: https://www.richvillodas.com/the-narrow-path 

Timestamps: 

01:08 Leading as a Contemplative Pastor

02:16 The Importance of Beholding God

08:52 Incorporating Silence in Worship

13:25 Introducing 'The Narrow Path'

20:37 Responsibilities of a Pastor

24:28 Final Thoughts and Farewell

Following Jesus means following Him along Jesus’ narrow way. Spiritual practices aren’t just an add-on to the way of Jesus. Rich Villodas presents a compelling theological vision for a church that focuses deeply on the formation of Jesus’ disciples.  

Rich also highlights the unique membership process at New Life Church, which emphasizes relational and spiritual formation over rapid growth. This episode is a heartfelt exploration of what it means to shepherd a weary world while maintaining theological integrity.

Pre-Order The Narrow Way: https://www.richvillodas.com/the-narrow-path 

Timestamps: 

01:58 Rich's Journey to Faith

05:16 Early Ministry and Family Influence

14:20 Monastic Influences and Leadership

17:49 Contemplative Practices in Church Leadership

24:57 Challenges and Reflections on Church Growth

26:50 Conclusion and Encouragement for Pastors

Pastors face unexpected challenges all the time.  

Tara Beth and Mark talk with David Fitch and Mark Quanstrom from Theology on Mission Podcast about the many active struggles of ministry. Antagonism and all sorts of sources have created a polarized world. Often this blows up in the church.  Mark and Tara Beth share their insights from mediating conflicts, understanding underlying issues, and knowing when it might be time to move on from a pastoral role. 

Pastors foster a reconciling presence as Christ was a reconciling force through his ministry.  

Outline: 

00:00 Introduction and Banter

01:58 Special Guests Introduction

04:23 Challenges of Ministry

10:01 Antagonism in the Church

18:09 Historical Context of Marriage

18:49 Modern Affluence and Marriage Dynamics

19:56 Pastoral Leadership in Conflict

21:56 Understanding Congregational Antagonisms

23:18 Modeling Reconciliation in Church

29:53 Social Media's Impact on Pastors

38:12 Differentiation and Pastoral Identity

39:28 When It's Time to Leave

41:03 Final Thoughts and Podcast Wrap-Up

David Fitch & Mike Moore from The Theology on Mission Podcast join Mark and Tara Beth to discuss power dynamics in the church's life.  Church leaders must discern power and avoid its abuses and traumas. By learning from the church's historical pitfalls, Christians can be empowered to relinquish worldly power and make space for God to disrupt and transform our culture for his kingdom.

In this episode they explore the appropriate exercise of power within the church, distinguishing between God's and worldly power, and the importance of mutual submission and humility. The conversation addresses how pastors can discern when they are misusing power and the need for a community and friends to hold them accountable. 

🎧 Listen to The Theology On Mission Podcast: https://pod.link/999549544

Timestamps:

01:08 Meet the Guests: Dr. Mike Moore and Dr. David Fitch

03:35 The Challenge of Power in Pastoral Leadership

05:00 Distinguishing God's Power from Worldly Power

07:33 Recognizing and Managing Misuse of Power

10:45 Spiritual Authority and Mutual Submission

26:40 Practical Applications and Organizational Structures

33:34 Concluding Thoughts 

Amanda opens up about the challenges they faced, the emotional and spiritual toll, and the eventual decision to close the shop. Her story is one of resilience, empathy, and unwavering faith. Throughout the episode, Amanda reflects on Jesus’ vision to seek peace and leave if necessary. 

In the end, Amanda and her team were struck by the truth that God’s justice will be delivered. Holding that space is what brought them peace and guidance during the turbulent waters they’ve navigated. 

Timestamps: 

​​01:57 Navigating Opposition and Seeking Peace

04:14 Empathy, Reconciliation, and the Decision to Leave

09:46 Theological Reflections on Justice, Peace, and Letting Go

11:18 Moving Forward: New Beginnings and Lessons Learned

17:30 Embracing Suffering and Finding Peace in Christ

31:26 Concluding Thoughts and Encouragement for Pastors

Backlash is a common experience for those trying to live out the faithful call of Jesus.  

Tara Beth, and Mark have an engaging conversation with Pastor Amanda Oichel. Coming from a non-religious background in Canada, Amanda's journey to becoming an ordained Wesleyan pastor and church planter in Boston unfolds. 

Amanda and their church had a vision to have a coffee shop that would be a common third place to serve their community. The dream of this compelling vision was not the reality for Amanda and her team.  What ensued was a tumultuous series of events that included protests and painful lies spread about their work.  

In this episode, Amanda, Mark, and Tara Beth explore the pain of this whole experience and the perspective it takes to scatter the goodness of the gospel faithfully!  

Timestamps: 

01:29 Amanda's Journey: From Non-Believer to Ordained Pastor

04:21 Planting Seeds in Boston: The Vision of Micro Churches and Coffee Ministry

13:25 Facing Opposition: Navigating Challenges in Ministry

32:26 Reflections on Faithfulness and the Future

To pursue unity and community impact amidst institutional challenges is no small effort. From the logistics of merging congregations to the theological and practical implications of such moves, "Navigating Church Mergers" offers rich insights into the transformative power of faith-led union.

In This Episode, You'll Discover:

- The inspiring journey of Reverend Jake Gregory and his experience merging two distinct church communities in the small town of St. Louis, Michigan.

- Challenges faced during the merger process, including denominational hurdles, property disputes, and navigating congregational expectations.

- The significant impact of community dynamics on church activities, especially concerning the city's largest employers being prisons.

- How external circumstances, such as leadership changes and the COVID-19 pandemic, influenced the course and outcome of the merger.

- The power of resilience and adaptive leadership in face of unforeseen challenges, and the critical role of support systems in enduring the process.

- Heartwarming testimonials of strengthened faith and community connection through the merger, highlighting the shelter program's touching role in redefining church outreach.

- A candid reflection on the spiritual and emotional toll of navigating denominational disputes and how it reshaped their vision for ministry.

**Episode Highlights:**

00:34 The Unique Challenges of Pastoring in St. Louis, Michigan

02:00 Exploring a Church Merger: The Journey Begins

03:01 Navigating Denominational Dynamics and the Merger Process

10:33 The Impact of COVID-19 and Legal Battles on Church Merger

23:49 The Emotional Toll and Finding Hope Again

30:00 The Power of Community and the Kingdom of God in Action

34:08 Reflecting on the Journey and the Power of Narrative

God led their church community to create a much-needed homeless shelter as an expression of their church. This change over time had the romance wear off eventually. Mark and Tara Beth talk with Jacob about the challenges of adapting to modern community needs while staying true to deep theological convictions. 

Not everything with the church was an easy transition. Jacob Gregory discusses his church's journey from desiring revival to embracing a vision of being 'recreated' to serve their economically depressed community better. They may have lost a lot of their congregation but Jacob talks about the significance of finding Jesus in the margins.  

Timestamps: 

00:42 The Journey of Becoming a Pastor & Embracing Change and Community Impact

06:56 A Bold Move: Starting a Homeless Shelter and Redefining Ministry

12:51 Facing Challenges and Reimagining Church Identity

16:37 Navigating Loss, Criticism, and Finding Redemption

22:03 The Merger: Uniting Congregations for a Greater Cause

27:37 Reflections on Leadership, Change, and Faithfulness

Dr. Dan Meyers shares about some of his unexpected ministry situations. The conversation delves into the challenges of pastoral leadership, the burden of power, and the importance of humility in guiding a church community. Dan recounts a significant turning point in his ministry when he had to make a difficult decision that ultimately led to a profound shift in perspective.

The episode also explores the concept of leadership through the lens of wisdom and mentoring, as Dan shares his experiences of navigating the complexities of pastoral care and decision-making. The discussion touches on the value of long-term relationships in ministry and the significance of knowing when to transition to a new chapter.

As Dan prepares to pass the baton to the next generation of leaders, he opens up about his upcoming transition to a chaplain role in South Florida, reflecting on the call to serve in new ways and the importance of staying true to one's sense of vocation. 

Timestamps: 

00:00 Welcome to The Pastor's Table: Navigating Leadership and Faith

00:32 Continuing the Conversation: Leadership Lessons with Dan Meyer

02:26 A Shift in Leadership: Embracing Humility and Community

07:59 Navigating Crisis: The Church's Role in Tragedy and Healing

15:23 Reflecting on Longevity in Ministry: The Journey of Staying Put

24:37 Embracing New Seasons: The Call to Transition and New Opportunities

31:47 The Importance of Ministry to the Affluent: A Future Conversation

Dan Meyers has a compelling vision of the importance of a unified Church. Tara Beth and Mark dig into everything from Dan’s call to ministry and the early years of ministry he navigated.  Dr. Meyer shares his transformative experiences, including facing internal and congregational conflict, learning from failure, and recognizing the importance of faithfulness over success. The conversation underscores the significance of non-anxious leadership, listening, and remaining open to God's guidance.

Timestamps: 

00:00 Welcome to The Pastor's Table: Introductions and Updates

01:36 Special Guest Introduction: Reverend Dr. Dan Meyer's Journey

03:38 From Affluence to Faith: Dan Meyer's Transformative Story

10:39 A Call to Ministry: Dan Meyer's Path to Pastoral Leadership

15:34 Leading Christ Church: Challenges and Growth

20:14 Overcoming Conflict and Embracing Humility

35:15 Reflections on Leadership and Looking Ahead

Tim Doyle told God that he would go anywhere and do anything. God’s call brought Tim back to his hometown of St. Joseph, MO.  Last week we covered the beginning of Tim’s surprising thrust into ministry.

Despite losing millions in property and facing personal attacks, Pastor Tim's story highlights themes of resilience, hope, and community impact. From starting over in a disadvantaged part of town to engaging in meaningful city restoration projects and ministering to marginalized groups, the conversation emphasizes the importance of enduring in ministry, relying on the Holy Spirit, and prioritizing family and mental health. The narrative illustrates the transformative power of faith and commitment to serve despite daunting obstacles.

Timestamps:

00:00 Welcome to the Pastor's Table: A Journey of Faith and Leadership

00:39 Pastor Tim's Story: Leading a Dying Church to New Beginnings

02:49 The Birth of Restoration: A Church Planted from Sacrifice

02:54 From Broadcaster to Pastor: An Unlikely Journey

06:18 Restoration Church: Reviving a City's Spirit and Heritage

14:12 The Restoration Project: Beyond Church Walls

16:10 A Pastor's Heart for Home: Embracing St. Joseph

18:16 Reaching the Marginalized: A Church for All

20:15 A Surprising Shift in Congregation Culture

20:30 The Harsh Reality of Drug Addiction and Recovery

21:45 Personal Connection to Addiction and Ministry Approach

22:32 The Power of Collaboration in Ministry

28:13 Expanding Ministry into the Prison System

30:56 Encouragement and Wisdom for Pastors

34:56 The Importance of Community and Endurance in Ministry

Tim Doyle shares with Mark and Tara Beth about the challenge of leading a tumultuous and declining church. Ultimately their church made the difficult decision to leave their current denomination and work through a grueling lawsuit. Tim's journey is a testament to the resilience and faith required to navigate unforeseen challenges in ministry. As the episode unfolds, listeners gain insight into Tim's unwavering commitment to love and shepherd his congregation through adversity, highlighting the transformative power of steadfast leadership in the face of uncertainty.

Much of the Church is plagued with a deficit of imagination about how God could use them in their lives. The role of women in particular faces a significant anemic imagination.  Sherry shares her story of being faithful to a call that is leading her through the process of ordination and preaching more regularly at College Church.  

Through deep reflection on theological convictions, challenges, and blessings encountered along the way, Pastor Sherry's narrative serves as a beacon of hope and encouragement for listeners navigating their own spiritual journeys. Join us as we explore the profound impact of humility, holiness, and surrender in ministry, celebrating Pastor Sherry's unwavering commitment to honoring her call and faithfully serving the Church.

Watch Sherry’s Message from College Church: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-qnN-UFipU 

What Sherry had to endure was more than hard. It was abusive and unacceptable.  Despite all this adversity Sherry shares how she navigated all this pain and still could say that she still loves the church. 

In the face of unimaginable challenges and profound pain, Sherry Mitchell's unwavering faith and commitment to her calling shine through. Her story serves as a beacon of resilience and strength, showcasing the transformative power of forgiveness and love in the midst of darkness. Through her unwavering dedication to the church, Sherry's journey inspires us to reexamine our own paths and find the courage to embrace hope and healing in the face of adversity.

Coach Wayne Gordon continues the conversation with Tara Beth and Mark. They talk honestly about the many ways churches can be painful and fall short of the ideal set by Jesus.  The process of confessing these faults is a powerful opportunity to be transformed to become more like Jesus!  

Embracing humility is a courageous and bold step. Coach Wayne Gordon challenges the church to live and lead with this kind of humility.  God always has worked through imperfect individuals and communities to bring about holy change.  All sorts of sins from individual to institutional can be dealt with through Christ in the church.  

Filled with the Holy Spirit Coach Wayne Gordon retells the dynamic way God led a group of people that founded Lawndale Community Church.  

Discover the transformative impact that has shaped the Lawndale community and understand why the Church, as God's change agent, holds a pivotal role in the contemporary world. Unravel the profound connection between the Church's foundation on the great commandment and its continued influence today. 

Wayne Gordon points out that the Church in America was started on sinful grounds! Yet, despite all the presence of sin, God has been faithful to his promises and people to bring peace through God’s Kingdom! 

The Church is what it will become, yet it also has a here and not yet reality.

Acknowledging the tensions within, Beth, Mark & Tara Beth explore the coexistence of brokenness and Christ's presence in the Church. The discussion delves into the impact of sin, addressing the significant pain experienced, especially by church leaders. Despite the struggles, the hosts emphasize the transformative power of holiness manifesting in ordinary acts of goodness.

Discussion Questions:

1. How does the tension between the brokenness of humanity and Christ's presence in the Church challenge our understanding of holiness?
2. What role do individuals, especially those with influence, play in stewarding the authority bestowed upon them in the Church?
3. Reflecting on the analogy of the Church as the bride of Christ, how can we navigate the tensions between acknowledging the Church's flaws and recognizing its inherent beauty?

Sin has ravaged the church. The pain and fallout have been significant, especially among church leaders. Yet, the church will always be the place where messy people interact and work out their salvation from sin.  Holiness often looks less spectacular and more ordinary acts of goodness. 

Discussion Questions: 

1. Beth, Mark & Tara Beth wrestle through some lofty discussions about sin and the holiness of church. How do you wrestle through these discussions that they bring up in this episode? 
2. Beth brings up that capitalism is often brought up and at times negatively intertwined into the church as a “product.” What ways can this be unhelpful to live in the Kingdom as God described?  
3. In the context of the Church's inherent tension and brokenness due to the impact of sin, how can the community navigate the challenge of being Christ's presence in the world while acknowledging and addressing the significant pain and fallout among church leaders? 

The inescapable nature of sin is felt in so many ways including the church. Whether it’s the pervasive brokenness in systems or grave offensives, God’s people are constantly bumping up against sin.  Tara Beth & Mark talk with Beth Felker Jones about the way God intersects with the reality of sin in the world.  

Discussion Questions: 

1. The steadfast love of God remains constant even when we fail. How can we remind ourselves and others of God's steadfast love, even when we fail?
2. We’ve all experienced the abundance and pain of sin.  What is the most obvious way you’re experiencing sin right now in your congregation? 
3. Mark and Tara Beth suggest fostering transformation by modeling vulnerability, nurturing the imagination of the church's culture, and emphasizing confession and the need for Christ's grace. What are some ways we can model vulnerability, nurture the church's culture, and emphasize confession and the need for Christ's grace?

Dr. Mark Quanstrom has been the Sr. Pastor for just over 10 years. There have been a tremendous number of really good things that have happened but despite all the good, Mark shares how he also has never mourned as much over the challenges of pastoring in 2023.  

Discussion Questions: 

1. Mark shares how the best of times and hardest of times are happening simultaneously in the life of College Church.  Describe a time when things have been both good and challenging. 
2. Tara Beth and Mark talk about the toll pastoring has on a person. Things like doing a funeral for a friend who you are simultaneously mourning is a lot to process.  How do you handle the emotions that come from situations like this?  
3.  “The only way I’m going to do this is to go all in relationships. Even if that means getting hurt and being uncomfortable.” How do you approach this dynamic with the relationships that Mark and Tara Beth discussed? 

Mark & Tara Beth continue to discuss all the ups and downs of ministry. There has been no hiding the tumultuous season that Northern Seminary has navigated. In this episode shares about the leadership transitions, systemic challenges, and a commitment to redemption still present at Northern.

Sin has a destructive and pervasive presence in the life of every organization. Northern Seminary has been no exception and yet a vision to embrace an unwavering commitment to God’s Kingdom still persists.  

Discussion Questions: 

1. How would you answer the question of whether it is possible for a honeymoon season never to end?
2. What lessons do you pull from the experience Dr. Quanstrom shared about how Northern Seminary walked through its challenging systemic issues?  
3. There is a lot of hurt and pain that is discussed in the events highlighted in this episode. What guides you when you engage with people who have been deeply hurt by institutions? 

This necessary change was hard for everyone but honesty and transparency helped guide them all into making it go as well as possible. In this episode, Tara Beth shares her experience and the internal challenges she faced during this transition. Mark and Tara Beth emphasize the importance of pastors being honest about their emotions while remaining brave. She organized a "Shepherd's Heart Live" event to address her congregation's concerns, and she highlighted the significance of unity and remaining faithful to one another, even amid tumultuous times.

Discussion Questions: 

1. Fostering authenticity and allowing differing opinions can lead to a healthier church community. Why is creating an atmosphere of authenticity and allowing differing opinions in a church community important?
2. Moses and the Israelites faced lots of change. What can we learn from the example of Moses and the Israelites experiencing grumbling and challenges during times of constant change?
3. Mark and Tara Beth reflected on the importance of unity not being contingent on agreement but on fidelity to one another. What role does unity play in the face of disagreement within a church community? 

Is it theologically faithful for a church to ever leave a denomination? 

Tara Beth and Mark talk through the arduous process of Good Shepherd leaving their previous denomination. This monumental decision was fueled by denominational hierarchy and cultural differences, unfolded over a decade, with the climax occurring under Tara Beth’s young tenure.

Despite the initial hesitations and overwhelming negative voices, Tara Beth shared how she pastored the church through the process and followed the congregation's support. Both Mark & Tara Beth underscored the importance of focusing on supportive voices amidst a sea of doubt, while also acknowledging their commitment to being transparent about their experiences. 

Discussion Questions: 

1. Tara Beth explained that through town hall meetings and discussions, the church council navigated the tension between the congregation and denomination, leading to their decision to disaffiliate. How can open, honest communication help a congregation work through difficult decisions such as changing denominations?
2. It is so easy to let the loudest and most negative voices get the majority of your attention as a pastor. Why is it crucial for pastors to also focus on the positive feedback and support from their congregation?
3. Mark and Tara Beth discuss her role in leading the church through a complex and prolonged process. In challenging times, what principles of pastoral leadership do you find crucial? How can a pastor effectively guide a congregation through significant transitions while maintaining transparency and seeking support?

https://forms.gle/JxRuJFsCkL5V6CQf7 

Ministry is a gift. So many pastors are faithfully living out a call to follow Jesus in ministry. 

In the final episode of 2023, Tara Beth, Mark, and Chaz reflect on the conversations that we were able to have that were designed to foster and lift the many pastors in located ministry.  From being challenged in how we spend time with God to honoring the beautiful differences present in Christ’s bride, this episode highlights some of the highlights and reflections had from this year.  

Thank you so much for you willingness to join us at the Pastor’s table this year!  Looking forward to sitting with you around the table again in 2024!  

Discussion Questions: 

• Reflecting on Your Ministry Journey: In the episode, we looked at the struggles and triumphs of pastoral ministry. Take a moment to share a personal experience from your ministry journey in 2023. What were the challenges, and where did you find moments of triumph?
• The Power of Love in Ministry: Love is highlighted as a significant aspect of pastoral ministry. How has the role of love shaped your interactions and decisions in ministry this year? Can you recall a specific instance where the power of love made a notable impact?
• Community and Pastoral Well-being: How has your sense of community contributed to your well-being as a pastor? Share examples of how being part of a supportive community has influenced your approach to ministry and personal resilience.

Timestamps:

00:33 Reflecting on the First Year of the Pastor's Table

02:34 The Importance of Reflection in Pastoral Ministry

04:00 The Power of a Great Morning Routine

04:16 The Struggles and Triumphs of Pastoral Ministry

07:44 The Role of Love in Pastoral Ministry

15:06 The Importance of Community in Pastoral Ministry

17:07 Looking Forward: The Future of the Pastor's Table

20:15 Closing Thoughts and Blessings

This whole year on the Pastor’s table has been inviting those in ministry to embrace the fullness of the call. Vanity metrics and comparison traps have robbed so many pastors the joy and blessings of ministry. 

This year has been such a blessing getting to be with you on this journey!  Thank you for joining us at the table!  

Discussion Questions: 

• Vanity Metrics and the Joy of Ministry:
• How have vanity metrics and comparison traps affected your perspective on ministry, and what steps can pastors take to rediscover the joy and blessings inherent in their calling?
• Theoretical vs. Existential Challenges:
• Reflecting on the discussion about theoretical and existential challenges in ministry, how can pastors navigate the tension between theological ideals and the day-to-day realities of leading a church? Share specific examples from your experiences.
• The Role of Theology in Identity and Decision-Making:
• How has your theological framework shaped your identity as a pastor, and in what ways has it influenced significant decisions in your pastoral leadership journey?

Through their conversation, they explore the significance of staying faithful to a congregation, even in the face of challenges and transitions. Mike's story serves as a powerful testament to the value of fostering deep relationships and practicing fidelity as a pastor. 

They also delve into the benefits of long-term ministry, including the impact on family, the nurturing of multiple generations in the church, and the establishment of credibility in the community. 

As the discussion unfolds, Tara Beth and Mark reflect on the importance of faithfulness, both to a local congregation and to the vocation of pastoring itself. 

Whether you're a pastor seeking encouragement and wisdom or simply curious about the realities and rewards of long-term ministry, this episode of "The Pastor's Table" is sure to inspire and nourish your spirit. Tune in and be blessed by the insights and experiences shared on this engaging podcast.

Discussion Questions: 

1. Michael's journey as a lead pastor spans 36 years, covering periods of growth, decline, and crucial decision-making. Reflect on the challenges and rewards of long-term ministry in your own context. How do you see the value of fidelity and commitment in sustaining a congregation through various seasons?
2. The episode emphasizes the significance of staying faithful to a congregation, even amid challenges and transitions. Share personal experiences or observations of how deep relationships and fidelity have impacted your local church community. In what ways have these elements contributed to the spiritual growth and resilience of the congregation?
3. Tara Beth and Mark discuss the benefits of long-term ministry, such as the impact on family, nurturing multiple generations, and establishing credibility in the community. Consider the role of family and generational connections in your church context. How does a long-term pastoral presence contribute to the overall health and credibility of a church within its community?

Timestamps: 

01:20 The Impact of Changing Church Services

03:59 The Cost of Pastoral Decisions

04:58 The Challenges and Triumphs of the Next Decade

05:01 The Consistency of Pastoral Ministry

12:38 The Role of Relationships in Pastoral Ministry

14:30 The Importance of Faithfulness in Pastoral Ministry

16:47 The Call to Pastoral Ministry

21:17 Pastoring is Pastoring  

23:52 Ending Well 

Michael Burchfield takes Tara Beth & Mark through his journey, starting from his call to mission work in the Philippines to his struggles serving in an upper-middle-class community church in Silicon Valley. Against the backdrop of church growth, loss of members, personal burnout, and challenging pastoral realities, Burchfield admits to resigning from his position, before ultimately deciding to stay and continue his call in the very same congregation.

Discussion Questions: 

1. Michael Burchfield's journey involves significant challenges, including personal burnout and a decision to resign from his pastoral position. Reflecting on your own experiences, how do you navigate challenges and burnout in ministry? What factors contribute to the decision to persevere or consider a change in direction?
2. Michael ultimately decided to stay and continue his call in the same congregation despite difficulties. How can the church community play a role in supporting and revitalizing ministers facing burnout or considering resignation? Share examples of how you've seen or experienced congregations effectively support their pastoral leaders during challenging times.
3. Michael's journey includes a transition from mission work to serving in an upper-middle-class community church in Silicon Valley. In your context, how does the cultural and socioeconomic setting impact the challenges and opportunities in ministry? Discuss practical ways to navigate and address the unique dynamics of diverse ministry settings, considering both mission work and congregational ministry.

Timestamps: 

00:30 Michael’s Journey to Becoming a Pastor

01:57 Transition to Lead Pastor

13:42 Experience in Different Communities

14:39 Reflecting on Serving in an Upper Middle-Class Area

15:02 The Journey of 36 Years in Church

16:13 Challenges and Growth of the Church

17:10 Dealing with Pastoral Transition

17:34 The Church's Struggle and Recovery

20:41 Decisions that Affected Church Growth

23:00 The Impact of Transiency in the Community

23:33 Navigating the COVID Years

23:58 Facing Doubts and Questioning the Calling

27:29 The Resignation and Return to Ministry

33:44 Closing Remarks and Preview of Next Episode

Any system involving people will always be filled with imperfections. That doesn’t mean it’s okay for systemic problems to be allowed to persist. Josh, Melissa, Tara Beth, and Mark discuss how these flawed systems that lack theological integrity contribute to burnout and fuel the pressure to perform.  

Despite these challenges, Josh & Melissa share why they remain committed to their calling and seek to find healing, transformation, and a new way of approaching ministry that focuses on being rather than doing. A way of ministry that flows out of the rhythms of abiding in the love, grace, and sacrifice of Jesus.

Discussion Questions:  

1. The discussion highlights the impact of flawed systems in ministry and how they contribute to burnout and the pressure to perform. In your own experience, how have flawed systems affected your perception of ministry, and what strategies or changes can be implemented to address systemic issues while maintaining theological integrity?
2. Josh and Melissa emphasize a commitment to healing, transformation, and a new approach to ministry that focuses on being rather than doing. How can the concept of "being" in ministry be practically applied in your context? What changes or adjustments might need to be made to prioritize the well-being of ministers and congregants over performance-driven expectations?
3. Ministry at its best is designed to flow out of the rhythms of abiding in the love, grace, and sacrifice of Jesus. How can leaders cultivate an environment where the rhythms of abiding are prioritized in ministry? Share practical ideas and examples from your own experiences that align with this vision of ministry.

Josh & Melissa share the many tumultuous times they faced in their short stint in ministry. Trying to faithfully serve the church has been filled with all sorts of challenges and difficult situations they weren’t ready to face. Josh & Melissa bravely share how these difficult moments provided a certain kind of grace for them to deal with some of their own personal wounds and seek lifelines. 

Discussion Questions: 

1. Josh and Melissa recount facing a variety of challenges and difficult situations they weren't prepared for. How can these challenging moments in ministry serve as opportunities for personal growth and healing for both ministers and congregants? Are there specific examples from your own experiences in ministry that reflect this idea?
2. Josh and Melissa discuss seeking lifelines during their ministry journey. What does seeking lifelines mean to you in the context of ministry, and how can pastors and church leaders support one another in finding the necessary support systems during challenging times?
3. The difficult moments Josh and Melissa faced in ministry provided a certain kind of grace for them. How do you understand the concept of grace in the midst of ministry challenges? Can you share instances where you've witnessed or experienced grace during challenging times in your own ministry or church community?

If this opportunity is to be fully realized it requires pastors to know their people. God has invited pastors to be the guides on a journey of where God is taking the community. Forming the life of God in your church starts with the leaders to be formed.  

Everyone has the opportunity to experience God’s grace that brings inner peace. Mindy, Mark, and Tara Beth give leaders practical examples and reasons to hope that they can experience God’s grace in their calling.  

Discussion Questions: 

1. How do you see the role of a pastor in helping their congregation "stay alive to God"? What specific actions, practices, or approaches can pastors implement to better know their people and guide them on the journey of spiritual formation within the church community?
2. Mindy emphasizes the idea that forming the life of God within the church starts with the formation of its leaders. What steps can pastors take to prioritize their own spiritual formation and growth as leaders? How might their personal transformation influence the spiritual life of the congregation?
3. The podcast episode highlights the potential for everyone to experience God's grace and inner peace in their calling. In what ways can church leaders provide practical examples and reasons to inspire hope for their congregation? Have you personally witnessed or experienced God's grace and inner peace in your ministry, and how has it impacted your calling?

Cultural Idols

Social Media 

News Media 

Work Demands and the list could go on … 

Mindy Caliguire gives clarity on how pastors can enhance the vision of a formed life after Jesus. The people who are suffering from a poverty of imagination can be given guidance and tools on the journey of formation Jesus offers.  

Get Soul Care’s 21 Days to Jumpstart Journaling at soulcare.com/resources. 

Discussion Questions: 

1. In a world where people are being influenced by a multitude of sources, how can pastors and church leaders effectively guide their congregations toward a vision of a formed life after Jesus? What specific challenges do you see in addressing the impact of cultural idols, social media, news media, and work demands on spiritual formation within your church community?
2. Mindy Caliguire emphasizes the importance of addressing the "poverty of imagination" in people's faith journeys. How can churches actively engage and equip individuals to develop a richer and more imaginative spiritual life in the context of today's distractions and influences? What practical strategies or tools can be implemented to facilitate this transformation?
3. Considering the diverse array of influences mentioned, what steps can pastors take to foster an environment where spiritual formation becomes a central focus for their congregation? How do you see your church community addressing these challenges and helping members embark on the journey of formation that Jesus offers?

It is imperative for pastors to tend to our own souls. Mindy Caliguire provides 4 different practices of page, person, plan & place to tend well to our souls as leaders. Page is the invitation to reflection. Person to be ruthlessly honest. Plan is a rule of life to create intentional space for growth. Place is honoring the location God has placed us. 

Get Soul Care’s 21 Days to Jumpstart Journaling at soulcare.com/resources. 

Discussion Questions: 

1. How does the concept of a "capped" leadership tied to self-reflection resonate with your understanding of effective pastoral leadership? In what ways can implementing the four practices of page, person, plan, and place, as outlined by Mindy Caliguire, help pastors overcome this limitation and enhance their leadership abilities?
2. The four practices mentioned—page, person, plan, and place—each play a distinct role in tending to the souls of leaders. Which of these practices do you find most challenging to integrate into your own life as a pastor or church leader, and why? Conversely, which one resonates with you the most, and how do you envision it positively influencing your leadership style?
3. Reflect on the significance of "honoring the location God has placed us" as one of the practices for tending to our souls as leaders. How can this practice be applied in your specific ministry context? What changes or adaptations might be needed to ensure that you are faithfully honoring your role and location as a pastor or leader in your church community?

Congregants are leaving. Pastors are burning out. Loss of all kinds is painfully present in the church.  

Many times people feel tending to a surrendered life of Christ is hard. Mindy Caliguire suggests that what is really hard is facing the pain of staying the same. There are so many pressures facing the church, but a community that tends to souls is possible.  

Make sure to come back for the other episodes with Mindy to learn more!   

Discussion Questions: 

1. How does Mindy Caliguire's perspective on loss and the challenges within the church encourage us to reevaluate our approach to spiritual growth and transformation? What might be some of the obstacles that prevent congregants and pastors from engaging in this process effectively?
2. In what ways can we build and nurture a church community that focuses on tending to souls amid the various pressures of ministry? What practical steps and principles did you draw from this discussion to help address the present challenges within your congregation?
3. Reflecting on the idea that facing the pain of staying the same can be more challenging than the work of tending to a surrendered life of Christ, how can we cultivate a mindset and environment that embrace growth, change, and healing within our churches? What role can individual members and leaders play in making this transformation possible?

Making a change and going with that opportunity might be full of wisdom or it could be a shortcut we take from a more faithful path serving in God’s Kingdom. No matter the decisions we make there is always a redemptive journey that God has for us. 

God invites us to be good and faithful, not always successful in our pursuit of him.

Discussion Questions: 

1. Reflecting on Chris DeMott's journey of two decades in the same rural church, have you ever faced a significant opportunity or change in your own life or ministry? How did you discern whether it aligned with God's plan, and what were the outcomes of your decision?
2. The podcast highlights the concept of "incremental steps of obedience." Can you share an experience where you witnessed the redemptive power of perseverance and faithfulness in your own life or within your faith community? What lessons did you learn from this journey?
3. In the pursuit of God's calling, it's emphasized that we're invited to be good and faithful, not always successful. How does this perspective shift our understanding of success in ministry and life? How can we better cultivate a faithful and obedient spirit in our daily walk with God?

Discover the powerful insights and invaluable lessons Chris has gathered along the way, as he reflects on the challenges and triumphs of shepherding a small congregation in a changing world. Gain a deeper understanding of the transformative power of faithfulness, even in the face of adversity.

Discussion Questions:

1. Chris said, "I’ve outstayed my expertise and brilliance." How did that phrase impact you? Where have you seen growth from saying past your expertise? 
2. The conversation returned to the reality of the pastor’s call being salvific. After walking through a difficult season, Chris confessed that he needed the transformation more than anything. What are ways you’ve experienced transformation after walking through difficult seasons? 
3. What do incremental steps of obedience look like in your ministry?  

The New Mount Pilgrim Missionary Baptist Church has been a community of salvation and liberation for decades. The Rev. Dr. Marshall Hatch discusses the theological convictions that have driven how transformation and liberation happen in the midst of their community. The transformation the New Mount Pilgrim Missionary Baptist Church is experiencing despite generations of atrocities is a beautiful testimony to the faithfulness and goodness of God.  

Learn more about the icon of the “Middle Passage” and other Black Art found at New Mount Pilgrim Missionary Baptist Church - https://www.newmountpilgrim.com/gallery  

Discussion Questions: 

1. Rev. Dr. Marshall Hatch shared many insightful moments from Black Church History. What was something you learned from this episode? 
2. New Mount Pilgrim Missionary Baptist Church primarily ministers to those outside the cultural power structures of the day. How do cultural power structures impact your ministry? 
3. How do you nurture a community of transformation and salvation in your congregation? 

They dive deeper into a conversation that explores how dangerous it is for pastors to make themselves too central to the church. If you have to believe what people say about you, you’re in trouble. There is a way to experience the waves of ministry that lets God remain in control of what only God can do and renews your strength in ministry. 

Discussion Questions: 

1. The episode started with a note from a pastor who has experienced the ups and downs of ministry. How would you describe some of the ups and downs of ministry you’ve experienced?
2. Marshall says that he rejects the responsibility to be a “marketer” for the church. How did his description talking about this hit you? Do you reject this kind of thinking?  
3. Central to this conversation is the idea that a pastor can’t think too highly of themselves. How do you explain the impact of viewing your congregation as God’s people and not your people as helpful to this idea?  

- Jesus (Matthew 16:24)

Ministry would be a lot easier if it wasn’t for this invitation by Jesus. If this invitation does anything, it shows that Jesus was only interested in followers who were all in.  

Those who minister in the Western world live in a culture that urges people to believe that our comfort is God’s primary concern. Our churches are often formed more by entertainment and business management than formed by the cross.  

Could it be that God calls those into the ministry through the way of the cross precisely because that is what is salvific?  

Discussion Questions:  

1. Most in ministry would agree with the idea that pastoring is challenging work. In your own words, describe why you find it to be difficult. 
2. Mark talked about how churches are often more influenced by entertainment than formed by the cross. Where do you see this played out in the church? Anywhere in your church, you see this to be present?
3. If the cross is salvific then living the way of the cross in pastoral ministry is what makes the call salvific. How did this idea sit with you? How does it impact your view of ministry? 

Mark goes through the many Biblical examples of calling throughout the Old Testament and New Testament scriptures. The call often comes with great cost. Reluctancy is a common and understandable response to the many people called in the Bible. Even Jesus had reluctancy to do what He was called by the Father to do.  

In this episode, Mark claims, “The only reason I’m a pastor is because God won’t let me go.”  

Discussion Questions: 

1. Mark highlights many examples of callings from the Bible. Which Biblical example of call do you most resonate with?  
2. We can see that the call of God is a costly call. What would you describe in your terms as the cost of your call into ministry?  
3. Mark claimed, “The only reason I’m a pastor is because God won’t let me go.” What do you think about this statement? How do you see God holding you in your calling?  

Check out Mark’s full course on Seminary Now: Pastoral Ministry: Calling and Resilience. 

SeminaryNow.com is a streaming video platform with short courses from leading authors and professors. The Pastor’s Table listeners can get 25% off full access to the courses by using the code TPT.

Can anything be done to alleviate the pressures of pastoral ministry?

This episode contains the 1st two parts of Dr. Mark Quanstrom’s Seminary Now course. It explores what it might look like for pastors in the American church to replace the faulty models of CEOs and celebrities and return to the path of Jesus as the example for pastoral ministry. 

Discussion Questions: 

1. There is no doubt that pastoring is a difficult challenge. What do you find to be the most challenging aspect of being a pastor? 
2. Mark highlighted the many challenges pastors face. Which challenges do you find most pronounced?  
3. Character matters when it comes to being a pastor. How does this reality impact you as you serve in ministry?

Tara Beth & Mark, explore many cultural pressures that impact women in ministry. Processing the experience of women in ministry is a powerful and important practice to live out our calling to the full.  Women possess the image of God and cultural pressures that discourage women from taking up their full call can and must be disentangled.  

Discussion Question: 

1. Women are often forced to code-switch in leadership situations. Where have you seen women have to code-switch?  
2. Think about cultural pressures you may have been unaware of before listening to this episode. What cultural pressures can you now see in your church? 
3. Mark and Tara Beth shared powerful stories of women being encouraged by other leaders to become a pastor. Tell of a time you’ve seen a woman encouraged in her call into ministry. 

Explore the concept of incarnation ministry, where one's context and location play a vital role in fulfilling their calling. Discover the beauty of collaboration between men and women, reflecting the essence of Christ's vision for the church. Throughout the discussions, gain insights into the importance of slow discernment, active listening, and fostering supportive communities. As you listen, you'll be encouraged to embrace and amplify women's voices within the local church, creating a culture of inclusion and empowerment.

Join us on this transformative journey as we explore the impact of women in ministry and envision a church that celebrates diverse leadership.

Discussion Questions:  

1. How can churches foster a culture that encourages women to explore their callings and gifts within the context of ministry? What steps can be taken to ensure that women are included and empowered in various leadership roles?
2. Melissa emphasized the importance of creative imagination when it comes to envisioning women in pastoral roles. How might we cultivate this imaginative perspective within our churches and communities? How can diverse representation positively impact our understanding of leadership?
3. The concept of incarnation ministry was highlighted, emphasizing the significance of engaging in ministry within one's context. How might this idea reshape our approach to calling and leadership, both for men and women? What are the benefits of being rooted in a specific community?
4. The pastors discussed the value of having both men and women collaborate in leadership roles, creating a "blessed alliance." How can churches actively promote and support this collaboration? What potential impact can this have on fostering a holistic understanding of God's mission?

By embracing their calling and pioneering a path, they're not only demonstrating the richness of women's leadership but also cultivating a more inclusive and diverse church community.

Gain insights into the unique dynamics at play when women take on pastoral roles in complementarian churches. Discover how these pastors are fostering collaboration, fostering dialogue, and fostering positive change within their congregations. Whether you're a church leader, aspiring pastor, or simply curious about the evolving landscape of gender roles in faith communities, this episode offers valuable perspectives on charting a new course for female leadership.

Discussion Question: 

1. Melissa said she had a mother’s heart for the church but all she was allowed to be was a nanny. Share about a time you were not able to do something in ministry you had a heart for. 
2. The speakers in the episode discussed the transformative impact of women's leadership on congregations. Can you think of specific ways in which diverse leadership enriches a church community? Share examples of how you've seen this principle in action or ways you'd like to see it implemented.
3. Reflect on the balance between maintaining a respectful dialogue about differing theological perspectives and advocating for change within a complementarian church setting. How can individuals contribute to healthy conversations that lead to positive shifts in understanding and practice?

This is one of the most common questions for women with kids who are serving in ministry.  Maria was called into serving as a pastor while she had little children at home.  Not only is it possible to merge motherhood with ministry.  Motherhood can be an asset for your ministry.  

Leading in any sort of capacity will have praise and criticism. It has been said, “If you live by their praise, you will die by their criticism.” Maria, Tara Beth, and Bethany discuss how making a strong community of peers is essential to being propelled into thriving in ministry.  

Discussion Questions: 

1. Who is a mother that you know who you deeply respect how they live out following Jesus?  
2. In the podcast, they discussed how the nuclear family is designed to function as a part of God’s larger family.  How do you foster this reality in your church? 
3. It can be tempting for women to fight for the only leadership seat available for a woman at their church. What do you think can be done to expand the table to make room for more women?

Many women have not explored what God might call them to do because they’ve never been given a vision. Mariane Elliott says, “If you can see it, you can be it.” Bethany shares her story of navigating having few examples of other women in ministry, yet finding her way to the call God had on her life.  

Expand your imagination of women as pastors and learn more about what it looks like to nurture that imagination in other women. Women have always served in critical roles throughout God’s story. Today is no different and women deserve every opportunity to live fully into the call God has for them.  

Learn more about propel ecclesial at ecclesia.propelwomen.org

Discussion Questions: 

1. Bethany shared her background understanding of women in ministry. Describe the background narrative of women in ministry that has filled out your imagination.  
2. What is your perception of the biggest challenge women face in living out the call that God has for their lives? 
3. What does the church gain when women are supported to serve at their full capacity? 

There are moments of difficulty and moments of deep meaning and significance. In this episode, Mark and Tara Beth explore the question of why stay in ministry. Pastors face all sorts of challenges from disgruntled staff to people leaving over surprising reasons. Being sustained in ministry can be challenging but there is always hope when we take courage from the deep and rich theology of God’s Kingdom.

1. Mark mentions several recent conversations he has had with those who have faced challenging ministry situations. What loss have you experienced in ministry? 
2. Tara Beth mentions how intentional pastors must be to not let ministry success be overly influenced by Key Performance Indicators that are antithetical to the gospel. How do you balance this tension?  
3. How do you answer the question of why you stay in ministry? 

By prioritizing community, discipleship, and meaningful engagement, Tara Beth, Mark, and Brian discuss the essential ingredients for creating an environment where individuals can experience the transformative power of God's love and actively participate in the collective journey of faith.

Together, they unveil the significance of theology, practices, and intentional community-building in shaping and sustaining a vibrant and nurturing salvation community, emphasizing the profound role they play in guiding individuals through transitions and fostering spiritual growth within the context of a faith community.

Discussion Questions: 

1. What season of transition in a church you’ve led comes to mind when you hear Brian talking about the transition they walked through?  Reflect on that time now.
2. Brian mentioned having good friends as a key grace that helped provide stability while pastoring through change.  Who are the peer friendships you’ve found to help be your support? 
3. It is important to have practices true to one’s theological convictions. What practices are most important to your church and the formation of your church?  

Tara Beth and Mark chat with Brian Zahnd about his journey of discovering deeper theology and leading Word of Life Church into greater theological integrity. He has been the pastor of World of Life for 41 years. There have been ups and downs on their journey but through their journey, they’ve been able to find a richer, deeper, fuller Christianity.  

Discussion Questions: 

1. Brian shares some major transitions through different theological convictions he held. What are times you’ve shifted theological perspectives while leading a church? 
2. Brain faced opposition when he started questioning aspects of Christian nationalism. When is a hard time in ministry that congregation members reacted harshly to what you were preaching about?  
3. Reading is an important practice to continue to consume rich theological ideas. What is the best theological resource you’ve read lately?  

Our theme song for The Pastor’s Table is Radiant by eleven eleven worship. LISTEN NOW on Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your music. The Pastor’s Table is Produced by Chaz Robins at Hope Story Media

These 3 paradigms are how Rock Harbor church intentionally participates in salvation. It’s not a one-time event or transaction. Salvation is a culture that nurtures people into a relationship with God. Encountering God in this kind of relationship moves to formation and then outward to mission.

Glenn also talks with Mark and Tara Beth about programs like Alpha that they’ve utilized to foster evangelism and ways to create environments that nurture questions that lead people to God. The cultural moment churches are serving today requires sensitivity and mindfulness to be a place where people can be gently nudged toward the goodness of God.

Discussion Questions:   

1. How does the paradigm of "Encounter-Formation-Mission" challenge traditional notions of salvation as a one-time event or transaction? 
2. In what ways does this paradigm emphasize the ongoing nature of salvation as a transformative relationship with God? Between encounter, formation, and mission which does your church do best and where would you like more emphasis?  
3. The podcast mentions the use of programs like Alpha to foster evangelism and create environments that nurture questions leading people to God. How can churches strike a balance between creating spaces for genuine inquiry and maintaining theological integrity? 
4. How can churches cultivate a culture of openness and hospitality that encourages individuals to explore their questions and doubts about faith? Share examples of successful strategies or initiatives that have fostered an environment where people feel safe to ask questions and seek God.

Learn more about resilient pastor groups led by Glenn Packiam in partnership with Barna: https://www.barna.com/resilient-pastor-cohort/ 

Our theme song for The Pastor’s Table is Radiant by eleven eleven worship. LISTEN NOW on Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your music. The Pastor’s Table is Produced by Chaz Robins at Hope Story Media

Glenn talks with Mark and Tara Beth about a vision for pastors rooting the source of their resilience in the resurrection of Jesus. Times are hard for pastors and it may get more challenging. There is a transformative grace available to church leaders. Without that grace, it’s impossible to be resilient. 

Discussion Questions: 

1. Glenn termed the phrase ‘fractional ecclesiology’ to describe how people often pick different elements or services of various churches. In what ways do you see this working out?   
2. We experience salvation in community. It is a key way that makes a transactional soteriology fall apart. Where do you see a salvation that is formational be experienced in community?
3. Two hallmarks of pastors who keep their focus on the long game of ministry are having peer relationships and intentional counseling or spiritual direction. How are you doing in these areas?  
4. Resilience is more than grit.  It’s about the power of the resurrection made available to us through God’s grace.  In what ways do you keep this front and center in your ministry? 

Learn more about resilient pastor groups led by Glenn Packiam in partnership with Barna: https://www.barna.com/resilient-pastor-cohort/

Tara Beth, Mark, and Beth explore the need for confession and the importance of incorporating it into worship services as a reminder of our continual need for God's grace. The episode highlights the challenge of cultivating a worship experience that focuses on relational formation rather than transactional salvation.

There is a way to cultivate worship services that reflect a view of salvation centered on relational formation rather than a transactional approach. This episode encourages churches to align their worship practices with their theological beliefs and resist the pressure to conform to a predetermined script. Being clear on what is salvation is essential because it will inevitably impact worship. 

Discussion Questions: 

1. How do institutional pressures for growth, such as measuring success through attendance, building, and cash, contribute to the temptation of reducing salvation to a transactional model? In what ways have you seen this play out in your own church or ministry context?
2. The hosts discuss the importance of confession as a foundational formation practice in Christian worship. However, they note that confession is often overlooked or considered a downer in many evangelical churches today. How does the omission of confession impact our understanding of salvation and our relationship with God? How might incorporating confession into our worship services help cultivate a more holistic view of salvation as relational formation?
3. The episode raises the question of how churches can resist the pressure to conform to a transactional model of salvation and instead foster worship experiences that align with their theological convictions. How can churches strike a balance between meeting the needs and expectations of their congregation while remaining faithful to a more holistic understanding of salvation? Share examples of practices or liturgies that you believe can help cultivate a worship environment that emphasizes relational formation rather than transactional metrics.

Salvation as a purely transactional experience is easy for Christians to latch onto. Christians from individualistic and capitalistic societies are more susceptible to this kind of thinking. The problem is that many theological problems arise in viewing salvation as only a transactional experience.

Tara Beth & Mark talk with Beth Felker Jones about the importance of viewing salvation as relational and transformational.  

Discussion Questions: 

1. An understanding of salvation is central to the understanding and practice of any church. How would you describe how your church understands salvation? 
2. Salvation that is understood in the context of a relationship can’t help but be transformational. How have you seen transformation play out from a relational view of salvation?  
3. In what ways does a transactional view of salvation limit our understanding of God's love and the depth of our relationship with Him?

All sorts of influences can lead pastors to sacrifice their theological integrity. When a pastor does church from a place incongruous with their deeply formed theological beliefs it never ends well. The result is often burnout in ministry.   

God has called pastors to be more than cogs in a machine. God has called you to a particular theological tradition.  Enjoy the gift of the calling God has given you.  

Discussion Questions:

1. Mark shares about being drawn to the seeker-friendly model and tried implementing it. He finally felt this model was “wearing someone else’s shoes.” Have you ever had a similar feeling? What was that like for you? 
2. Describe your theological convictions around salvation. In what ways do you see practices in your church come from these convictions?   
3. Tara Beth talked about the power of authenticity and the ensuing spiritual authority.  Where have you witnessed this spiritual authority Tara Beth described? 

Mark and Tara Beth explore how times of challenge can often form pastors into greater Christ Likeness.  God uses the tasks of pastoral ministry to develop his followers in the most powerful ways. The idea of salvation is so much more than a ticket to go to heaven.  This whole season is about Soteriology and in this episode, we set the table.   

Discussion Questions: 

1. Mark asked the question that “What if the Pastoral Call is Salvific?” How does that resonate with or challenge you?
2. Oswald Chambers says, "God is at perfect liberty to waste you.”  Do you agree or struggle with this quote? Do you think God cares more about the tasks you do or the person you are?  
3. How do you find the work of pastoral ministry to be formative?

Tara Beth and Mark both talked about how they experienced God’s faithfulness in the midst of challenging transitions. Despite the uncertainty and hardship they encountered, they both found hope and redemption in unexpected ways. Through their experiences, they gained a deeper understanding of God's faithfulness and discovered the power of perseverance in the face of adversity. Join us as we explore the transformative power of faith in the midst of life's toughest moments.

Discussion Questions: 

1. Tara Beth mentioned having a lot of maternal love for the congregation where she is Sr. Pastor.  She described how she pastors through the lens of mothering. What did you learn from her perspective about Pastoring? 
2. There were a lot of moving pieces that God put together for Tara Beth to now become the Pastor at Good Shepherd. How has God shown up and put pieces together in your stories of ministry transition?  
3. Mark mentioned how he experienced God in museums. Where do you seek to experience God in painful moments? 
4. Where are you experiencing God’s faithfulness right now?  

Check out Mark’s course on Seminary Now: Pastoral Ministry: Calling and Resilience. 

SeminaryNow.com is a streaming video platform with short courses from leading authors and professors. The Pastor’s Table listeners can get 25% off full access to the courses by using the code TPT.

Our theme song for The Pastor’s Table is Radiant by eleven eleven worship. LISTEN NOW on Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your music.

Tara Beth and Mark discuss the tough reality that many pastors face in the midst of transition. Often time seasons of transition are forced upon pastors in a less-than-ideal situations. Loneliness, anger, mistreatment, and many other things are all experiences pastors often have in seasons of transition.  

Pastors aren’t destined to be treated as doormats. Get guidance on discerning when to stay and when to go in ministry.  

Discussion Questions:

1. A listener left a message on thepastorstable.com about experiencing a dark season in ministry.  What do you do when you feel alone or mistreated in ministry?  
2. Mark and Tara Beth describe times when they’ve preached while angry. Have you ever realized you were preaching with anger or other emotions that could have been better proceed elsewhere? What did you do? 
3. Think of a transition you’ve experienced in ministry. What helped guide you in your process of discernment and transition?  

Check out Mark’s course on Seminary Now: Pastoral Ministry: Calling and Resilience. 

SeminaryNow.com is a streaming video platform with short courses from leading authors and professors. The Pastor’s Table listeners can get 25% off full access to the courses by using the code TPT.

Our theme song for The Pastor’s Table is Radiant by eleven eleven worship. LISTEN NOW on Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your music.

The journey of navigating ministry change is not easy work. Michael shared the ups and downs of all that he experienced in his ministry transition. No matter how challenging the situation, God is always faithfully present and working.

Discussion Questions:

1. Pastors are often the ones congregation members go to for their discernment. Who do you go to for spiritual discernment?  
2. Michael shared about having a spiritual director to navigate these experiences. He shared how he is learning to trust his feelings more. How do you experience and make sense of the emotions you experience in ministry? 
3. What is something difficult you’re facing right now in ministry? How can you let another person tend to your needs?  

Check out Mark’s course on Seminary Now: Pastoral Ministry: Calling and Resilience. 

SeminaryNow.com is a streaming video platform with short courses from leading authors and professors. The Pastor’s Table listeners can get 25% off full access to the courses by using the code TPT.

Our theme song for The Pastor’s Table is Radiant by eleven eleven worship. LISTEN NOW on Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your music.

What happened became a painful journey with denominational conflict, the slow burn of very contentious communication, and the experience of grief from fractured relationships. The situation came to a point when he was even threatened to be suspended from his work.  

Join us next week for the rest of Michael’s story.  

Discussion Questions:

• Mark observed how Michael’s church helped tend to him as their pastor. How have you experienced your congregation tending or not tending to your needs? 
• Michael talked about his idea of what ministry was going to be like and contrasted how what he experienced was much different. What are ways you’ve experienced similar differences? 
• Michael spoke prophetically into some very difficult topics of the day. What has been your experience trying to be loving and prophetic in the way God is calling you to be in your church?  

Check out Mark’s new course on Seminary Now: Pastoral Ministry: Calling and Resilience. 

SeminaryNow.com is a streaming video platform with short courses from leading authors and professors. The Pastor’s Table listeners can get 25% off full access to the courses by using the code TPT.

Our theme song for The Pastor’s Table is Radiant by eleven eleven worship. LISTEN NOW on Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your music.