Today, I am talking to the talented Khutjo Green about "Katanga January 17," a play inspired by Lumumba that promotes African unity, peace, and stability. It will be showcased at The Markey Theater from September 7th to the 22nd, 2024. Khutjo will walk us through her directing and acting processes, as well as the history and legacy of Lumumba's death.

For reduced price block bookings (of 10 or more) and school groups, contact Anthony Ezeoke (Audience Development) at AnthonyE@markettheatre.co.za or 083 246 4950 or Mamello Khomongoe mamellok@markettheatre.co.za 0815729612

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Our Give Away is Closed, Thanks to all who Commented , We'll have more in the future.

Today, I am sitting down and talking to comedian and chef, Chris Forest, about

The Ulimate Braai Master Live Montecasino in Johannesburg North.

The festival will take place from October 25th to 27th, 2024. Chris discusses cooking with coals and braai gadgets, as well as incorporating comedy

into the event and explaining its purpose.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Follow Chris Forest on

Facebook : Cooking on Coals

IG: cookingoncoalsevents

Website

www.cookingoncolas.co.za / UBMLive2024

Today, I am sitting down with the renowned playwright, actor, and director Malcolm Purkey to discuss the re-launch of the Wits Theater in Braamfontein, Johannesburg. Malcolm will take us through their current and new productions, including Antidote, The Lab of Learning Jam Sessions, and MEME[tics] – A Physical Theatre Masterpiece. He will also share his thoughts on AI and how theater can adapt to the new reality.

Wits Theater website

https://www.wits.ac.za/witstheatre/

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Today, I sat down with Jessica Denyschen, CEO of the Arts and Culture Trust, to discuss the upcoming CCI Creative Web Symposium 2024. The event will be held at the Swiss Hotel School in Ferndale, Randburg and will also be available online. Jessica explained the theme and primary objectives of the symposium, and I had the opportunity to ask her about ai

Tickets

https://www.quicket.co.za/events/267791-arts-culture-trust-the-university-of-johannesburg-and-the-swiss-hotel-school-pr/

Website

https://act.org.za/

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Today I sit down with my old colleague and friend, Lebogang Tshetlo.

We start off talking about how our lives has changed in the arts over the past few years

We then delved into the depths of Lebogang's watercolor paintings and photography, as he shares his nostalgia of our time in Newton, JHB and some stories of his late father.

Then, our conversation turns, as we delved into the topic of #ai and its profound impact on our world.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Today I sit down with Phyllis Klotz, co-founder and veteran director of the renowned Sibikwa Arts center.

Having recently debuted her multi award-winning play, '1789,' at the National Arts Festival, Phyllis is now bringing the production to the Joburg Theater from August 8th to 18th, 2024. With support from Theatre du Soleil and the French Institute of South Africa, the play offers a unique blend of rich cultural influences and powerful storytelling. Phyllis sheds light on the relevance of this production to South Africa and delves into the themes and messages woven throughout the play.

Hosted By Wesley Pepper

Today I sit with Lindiwe Mnguni and talk about her passion for her work as an ambassador for 67 Blankets for Mandela. So, everything from hosting charity knitting events to spreading awareness about the importance of giving back, Lindiwe has truly embraced her role as an ambassador. She also reveals the various techniques she has learned along the way, from organizing efficient fundraising campaigns to connecting with people on a personal level to inspire them to join the cause.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Today's episode of The Art Lexcia is one for the books. Not only do we have the pleasure of welcoming back Siza Nkosi, a longtime friend and collaborator of the show, but we also have Dr. Equinox joining us. As fate would have it, just minutes before we hit the record button, the dreaded #loadshedding struck. But instead of letting this unexpected challenge derail us, we embraced it and freestyled our entire conversation.

It's only fitting that this happens to be our 150th episode, as it's a testament to the spontaneous and dynamic nature of our show.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

https://chepapemakgato.blogspot.com/2024/06/bonnie-ntshalintshali-legacy-of.html?m=1&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR3LN6hcuHEM5p1MXJx4YHhpEsLYLWLKrv-_ufCMTKDFf_m25pXsrL1eG5U_aem_2GEUbg-v-VJ4qjNry6szdQ#google_vignette

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

The festival, which has attracted thousands of attendees from all over South Africa and the world, had recently wrapped up and we were eager to hear all about it.

As we got into the conversation

She spoke about the challenges they had faced during the pandemic, from logistical nightmares to strict safety protocols and But despite all of this, they had managed to not only survive but thrive during these unprecedented times. It was heartening to hear about the innovative ways they had adapted to the changing circumstances and how they had found a way to bring the festival to the people, even if it meant doing so virtually. And now, as the world slowly begins to recover from the pandemic, we could all learn a thing or two from the Innibos Arts festival's journey.

www.innibos.co.za

Hosted By Wesley Pepper

As we got into the conversation, Luan shared with me the inspiration behind his exhibition - his complex and deeply personal relationship with his late father. Through his beautiful oil paintings, Luan peels back layers of memories and emotions and presents them in a thought-provoking and inspiring way.

The Exhibition took place at the Innibos National Arts Festival in lowveld Mpumalanga.

His Social media handles -

@luan_nel @luan.paints @lesdamesdeluan @donatella_visagie @nel.on.long

https://web.facebook.com/share/p/Ey7AkW35vTCnTMwc/

As I sat down to have a conversation with the multi-award winning playwright and academic, Paul Noko Mutwsagule, I was interested to hear his thoughts on the complex topic of language and its role in politics.

In his acclaimed play, "One Yard 7 Shacks," Paul delves into the concept of 'scamto' - a language that is a blend of all South African languages. According to Paul, 'scamto' represents the rich diversity of South Africa and has now seeped into mainstream marketing, nation-building, and even sports events. As we delved deeper into the conversation, Paul explained how his play is his way of putting his beliefs into action at Wits University, where he uses theatre as a form of praxis to challenge societal norms and break down barriers.

https://web.facebook.com/share/p/tK1JpaY9tbQ6X82R/

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

As we began our conversation, he shared with me the story of how this NPO came to be. Ladles of Love has always been fueled by a deep passion for helping others. As Danny explained the intricate processes behind running a soup kitchen and their efforts to provide education and development opportunities for children in need

We then move onto their flagship event on Mandela Day 2024, which will take place at Constitution Hill in Johannesburg. This event symbolizes the heart of Ladles of Love - bringing people together to make a positive change in the world.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia

Today I sit down and talk Johannesburg based artist and entrepreneur Lehlononlo Dhlamini

. As a renowned watercolorist, Lehlononlo has honed his unique technique by drawing inspiration from his surroundings, people, stories, and textures. It is through this process that he is able to create breathtaking pieces that capture the essence of his environment.

Lehlononlo a talented artist, but he is also a successful entrepreneur. We discuss his work as a tattoo artist, where he brings his artistic vision to life on people's skin, and how he has built his business around his art.

This is short featuring the artwork and new direction we spoke about in the interview

https://youtube.com/shorts/_F8FDZEpTfc?feature=share

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Today I sit down with Michael Taylor-Broderick, the playwright and director from Durban who is behind the highly acclaimed Kings of Broken Things.

It all began with a simple idea, inspired by his young son, and blossomed into a powerful and thought-provoking production.

From the captivating storyline to the intricate character development, every aspect of Kings of Broken Things had a purpose and a deeper meaning. And now, with its successful showing at the Market Theater in Johannesburg, it's no surprise that the play has received multiple awards and critical acclaim.

The play will be running at the Market Theater from the 5 - 23 June 2024. You can purchase a ticket on the link

https://markettheatre.co.za/king-of-broken-things/

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

What an honor it is to sit down and converse with Carolyn Steyn, the visionary founder of 67 Blankets for Nelson Mandela. As we reflect on the past decade of this incredible initiative, Carolyn shares with us the heartwarming stories of Nelson Mandela and their meaningful encounters. From these cherished moments, Carolyn was inspired to create a movement that would embody Mandela's legacy of compassion and service. Through their installations of blankets, the organization has reached monumental heights, both literally and figuratively. The blankets serve as colorful symbols of hope, stitched together by individuals from all walks of life, united by their mission to spread warmth and love to those in need.

https://67blankets.co.za/

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Today I sit down down with Johannesburg-based writer, art critic, and journalist David Mann. His debut collection of short stories, titled 'Once Removed', is the topic of our discussion, a work that draws from his unique experiences and observations within the art world.

David shares his insights on how he conceptualized this book and the characters who populate it, offering a glimpse into his artistic process.

As we touch upon the role of AI in the world of art criticism and journalism, David's perspective is both insightful and thought-provoking, leaving me with a newfound appreciation for the ever-evolving dynamics of the art world.

You can find Once Removed on the Botsotso website

https://botsotso.org.za

Hosted By Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Today I sit down with Sonia Jackson Myles, the CEO and founder of The Sister Accord foundation. Sonia is in Johannesburg, South Africa to launch the South African chapter of her foundation. But her journey to this point was not an easy one. Sonia shares with me the challenges she faced in leaving her full-time job to pursue her dream of empowering and uniting one billion girls and women. We delve deeper into her three pillars of educating, enlightening, and empowering girls and women, as well as the power of sisterhood. We also discuss the recent Sister Accord Leadership Award that was presented to Sofia Williams De Bruyn at a tea party held at the Nelson Mandela Foundation in Johannesburg. It is clear that Sonia's determination and dedication to her cause have not only made a positive impact on the lives of countless girls and women, but also garnered recognition and support from influential figures and organizations.

https://thesisteraccordfoundation.org/

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Welcome to Asisebenze Art Studio, where the vibrant energy of Johannesburg's inner city is captured in the form of contemporary art. Today, we have the privilege of taking a closer look at Sisfiso Mkhabela's solo exhibition titled "Concrete Cocoon", curated by Nolan Stevens. As we enter the exhibit, the hustle and bustle of the city fades away and we are transported into a world of vivid colors and thought-provoking pieces. Each artwork in this collection tells a story of life in the inner city, shedding light on the struggles and conflicts faced by its inhabitants. Mkhabela's use of mixed media elements, and intricate details, captures the essence of the city and its people in a truly unique way. The title of the exhibition, "Concrete Cocoon", cleverly hints at the dichotomy of life in the inner city - a harsh, unyielding environment that is both a source of protection and a suffocating trap. As we explore each piece, we are invited to reflect on our own relationship with the city and its inhabitants.

Their website

https://asisebenze.com/

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

I had the opportunity to sit down and chat with the talented and multi award-winning poet and writer, Philani A Nyoni. We delved into the depths of his latest publication, 'The Testament of Black Jesus', an epic poem. Philani shared with me the intricate processes that went into crafting such a powerful piece of literature, his sources of inspiration, and the various themes and nuances that are interwoven throughout the poem. From social justice and identity to religion and spirituality, Nyoni fearlessly tackles complex and timely topics that challenge readers to think and reflect. We also discussed the marketing and selling a book in today's competitive market, and Pan gave his insightful thoughts on the rise of artificial intelligence and its impact on the literary world.

His page ' Once a lover Always a fool'

https://www.facebook.com/oncealoveralwaysafool

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Today, i spoke to the incredibly brave Rehana Obaray, a self-published author from Cape Town. Our conversation was nothing short of eye-opening and inspiring as Rehana shared with me her personal journey of overcoming trauma and gender-based violence in her life. Through her words, I was able to understand the depth of pain and struggle she had to endure growing up, and how she found solace in writing. Her first book, titled 'Unbottling God', is a raw and honest autobiography that delves into the complexities of her experiences and how she was able to find healing and inner strength through her faith. But Rehana's talents do not end there. She recently released her second book, 'Mommy Why Did You Throw Me Away', which is a poignant and heart-wrenching autobiography about someone else. Through her writing, Rehana sheds light on the harsh realities of abandonment and the impact it has on a person's life. Both of her works hold such deep meaning and offer important insight into the human experience. Rehana's courage to share her story and the story of others through her writing is truly commendable.

Her Youtube page and e-commerce links

https://www.youtube.com/@rehanaobaray4998

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

As I sit down and chat with Candice Harris, from Kxam Africa, a non-profit organization dedicated to promoting the knowledge systems of the |Xam and Khoe people through new media, her passion for her work is palpable. Her vision for the company is truly inspiring, as she hopes to shed light on the rich history and culture of these indigenous peoples. In our conversation, Candice shares how her own dreams and ambitions led her down a new path, one that ultimately brought her to write in a new style of poetry, one steeped in the stories and traditions of the Khoisan. Her commitment to honoring and preserving the heritage of the |Xam and Khoe people is unshakable, and as she speaks about their future projects, her enthusiasm and determination shine through. It is clear that for Candice and Kxam Africa, this is more than just a mission - it is a calling to uplift and celebrate a community that has long been overlooked and marginalized.

Hosted By Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Today I'm meeting with my good friend, Kabelo Sebolai, n entrepreneur and my neighbor. We have known each other for years and have always admired each other's work ethic and passion for business. However, today our discussion has taken a different turn. We have both noticed the significant impact that AI has had on traditional structures like family and entrepreneurship. We dive deep into this topic, discussing the potential benefits and challenges that arise with the increasing integration of AI in our daily lives. Kabelo shares his insights and personal experiences, and I cannot help but be amazed by his knowledge and perspective. As we come to the end of our conversation, I am left with a newfound appreciation for the ever-evolving landscape of entrepreneurship and the role of AI in it. It's clear that this is just the beginning of a larger conversation that will continue to shape our future.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced By #theartlexcia #podcast

As I sat down to speak with Aakriti Kuntal, a multi-talented artist from Delhi, India, I couldn't help but be drawn in by her genuine and inspiring presence. We began our conversation by discussing her influences, and I was amazed by how she observes and conceptualizes her surroundings, including her own health. Aakriti's creative repertoire includes not only writing and poetry, but also beautiful visual art. She introduced me to a new form of poetry called quantum poetry, which she skillfully incorporates into her work. What struck me most about Aakriti was her use of writing as a tool for healing. Her upcoming Chapbook, set to be published this month, focuses on her own experience with a personal condition and she hopes it will help others who may be going through a similar struggle. Through her beautifully crafted words and images, Aakriti's poetry is both conceptual and full of powerful imagery that resonates long after reading. I feel incredibly grateful to have had the opportunity to speak with Aakriti and be in the presence of her profound artistry.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

As I sat down with PJ Sabbagha, co curator of the 9th annual My Body My Space Public Arts Festival, I couldn't help but feel excited and eager to learn more about this unique event. Set in the rural location of Emakhazeni in Mpumalanga, South Africa, the festival is a celebration of art, culture, and community that brings together a diverse range of collaborators and partners. PJ's insights into the festival's history, its partners, and its location truly highlighted how these elements contribute to making the My Body My Space experience so special. As he delved into the curating process and shared details about the featured artworks, performances, and installations, I couldn't help but admire the sheer dedication and passion that goes into creating this one-of-a-kind event. From the 11th to 15th of March, audiences will have the opportunity to witness and engage with unique artistic expressions in a truly breathtaking setting. I know that I, for one, cannot wait to attend and be a part of this unforgettable festival!

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Sitting across from the brilliant Paul Khahliso Matela Zisiwe, I couldn't help but feel a sense of awe and admiration for this multi-talented individual. As an acclaimed documentarian, writer, and artist, his body of work speaks for itself. But today, our conversation takes a deep dive into his recent project – the short documentary for the historic Klerksdorp museum. We delve into the ever-evolving role of museums in a world that is constantly changing, with technology and shifting habits shaping the way we interact with these spaces. Zisiwe's insights on the subject are thought-provoking, and we discuss the involvement of AI in both the film and art industry. But perhaps the most pressing topic we touch upon is the role that artists should play in this modern world. As the world continues to evolve, it is crucial for artists to use their platform to bring attention to pressing issues, challenge societal norms, and spark important conversations – something that Zisiwe's work does effortlessly.

His blog - An Irrational Diary

https://anirrationaldiary.blogspot.com/?fbclid=IwAR3_zLd_tELNB9qpLU-vm5oovvUImM_9YHFSFlooUOOjr2OXor-7ziXBRA0

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Today is an exciting day as we welcome back the talented Siza Nkosi to discuss her debut poetry publication, 'U Grand Malume'. Through intricate and powerful verse, Siza delves into thought-provoking themes that reflect the current climate of South Africa. Her poetry acts as a telescope, giving us a closer look at the issues and views that shape our nation. With her words, Siza allows us to see beyond the surface and delve into the heart of the matter. Whether it's speaking on societal injustices or personal experiences, her poetry radiates with emotion and authenticity. As we engage in conversation with Siza, we gain insight into her creative process and the inspiration behind her work. So, let’s sit back, open our minds, and allow ourselves to be swept away by Siza Nkosi's captivating poetry. Trust me, you don't want to miss this!

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

It's the second month of 2024, and so much has happened in such a short amount of time. Today, I have the pleasure of sitting down with the incredibly talented Lerato Waga Matsomela. As a poet, journalist, academic, and Pan Afrikanist, she brings a unique perspective to our discussion. And we cover a wide range of topics, from the controversial "Coloured People's identity politics" to Tyla's historic Grammy win, and even touch on the prevalent trend of slay queen culture. Lerato does not hold back, and her opinions are robust and honest as we delve into these hot-button issues in the second month of 2024. Her insights are thought-provoking, and her words will leave you with a new perspective on these trending topics. So hold on tight as we take a deep dive into the current state of the world with Lerato Waga Matsomela.

Join me as I dive into the world of Tha H3adspace Podcast with View Joka. This podcast, founded with a purpose and a reason, has quickly gained a loyal following. As we sit down to discuss the journey of its creation, the content they produce, and View's personal views on pop culture, AI, and creativity, it's impossible not to be captivated by his robust and articulate manner of speaking. With a deep understanding of Pan Afrikanism and a strong sense of community, View's perspective sheds light on the importance of diverse voices in the media world. Located in the heart of Motherwell in Gqebertha, Tha H3adspace has become a hub for thought-provoking discussions and engaging content. Make sure to check out their channel and join the conversation.

Tha H3adsapce YouTube Channel

https://www.youtube.com/@UCnjp0kDPNDZRgm1AsJEv2OQ

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Greetings to all and welcome to the first episode of the year! I am excited to introduce you to our first guest for 2024, the incredible Lerato Rapunzulu Sokhulu. Hailing from Cape Town but currently in Johannesburg after her show at 'The Savanna Newcomer Showcase," Lerato is not only a talented comedian, but also a writer, content producer, and artist. With her unique blend of humor and truth, she takes us on a journey through her arts career and shares details about her life as a poet and artist. During our conversation, she also shares the hilarious tale of her grandmother's "church scam," which will have you laughing and in disbelief. Lerato's sharp wit and honest perspective make her a true gem in the comedy world, and I am honored to have her as our first guest of the year. So sit back, relax, and get ready to be entertained and enlightened by the one and only Lerato Rapunzulu Sokhulu.

https://www.quicket.co.za/events/248581-selective-comedy-hosted-by-lerato-sokhulu/#/?fbclid=PAAaZYUDgI3xEyRfDmdf841NVq1at8DWxI0EKRjYHnbhxN7MM6-DYbArvs-gE

https://rapunzulu.blogspot.com/

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #TheArtLexcia #Podcast

As I settle down to have a conversation with Winnie Adams, the co-founder of Arts On Ives, I am eager to learn about how their organization has fared in the past year. We discuss their most recent exhibition in August, their successful collaboration with Arts Alive, and the exciting prospects of future projects. However, what truly captivates me is Winnie's passionate recount of their vision for Arts On Ives and the dedicated efforts they are putting in to achieve it. She speaks about their deep connection with the community, acknowledging both its challenges and triumphs. Winnie does not shy away from discussing the pitfalls they have faced along the way, but confidently shares their well-thought-out solutions. It is clear to me that beyond just showcasing art, the team at Arts On Ives is committed to using their platform to make a meaningful impact in the community. And with their upcoming theatre production at The Windybrow Arts Centre on December 9th, I have no doubt that they will continue to captivate and inspire audiences for years to come.

Arts On Ives whatsapp number

+27 66 354 1241

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #TheArtLexcia #podcast

As I sat down to talk with Don Afrika-Beukes, a South African poet currently based in France and Spain, I was immediately struck by his talent and passion for words. Not only is he a skilled poet, but he is also multi-lingual, infusing his works with diverse languages and cultural influences. Through his published poetry anthologies, Don has created a space for his voice to be heard and for his powerful messages to be shared with the world. During our conversation, we delved into his creative processes, exploring the sources of his inspiration, his unique style, and his collaborations with other artists. Don's poetry serves as a powerful social tool, leading us through the complexities and challenges of our modern world. Our recorded conversation was akin to a workshop, where Don shared and dissected a poem from one of his featured anthologies, providing valuable insights and thought-provoking interpretations. It was a truly fruitful and engaging discussion, leaving me with a deep appreciation for Don's mastery of blending images and words into a powerful tool for social commentary and change.

Today promises to be an exciting day as I sit down with my regular guest, Mustapha Jinudu from Northern Virginia DC. Together, we delve into the most pressing and trending stories shaping the world, both nationally and internationally. One topic that we can't ignore is the heartbreaking issue of mass shootings in the US. Mustapha shares his insights on this ongoing dilemma, shedding light on the history of violence that lies behind it. We then turn our attention to other important issues, including the ongoing struggle in Palestine, the political landscape in Chavez Colombia, and the lasting legacy of Nelson Mandela. But it's not all serious talk - we also can't resist discussing our excitement for the much-anticipated Rugby World Cup final in 2023, which will be held in France. Through our discussion, we manage to strike a balance between being quick and chippy, while also providing insightful analysis, all while having a great time. So join us as we navigate through these important topics; it's going to be a fun and engaging conversation that you won't want to miss.

Today I had the privilege of speaking with Adewale Sobowale, the founder of The Migrant Online Magazine. We discussed the how he came to create the magazine, the content it features, and the politics of the ongoing migrant crisis across the world. In particular, we explored the situation in the UK, with its draconian laws against migrants that seek to inhibit their right to travel. Adewale has a deep understanding of the sociopolitical factors that have contributed to this crisis, and it was humbling to sit and listen as he detailed his vision for the magazine as a platform for migrant stories and experiences. He hopes it can create awareness and dialogue, and ultimately, spark meaningful action to enable the freedom of movement for all.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Today, I have the privilege of sitting down with Allan Kolski Horwitz, founder of the legendary Botsotso Jesters, and Kabelo Mofokeng, a well-known writer. Allan recounts the story of how the Botsotso Jesters were created in the mid-90s, including all of the major role players, the writers and poets who worked with them, and what they stand for. He also discussed the processes behind their publishing and current titles like Siza Nkosi's "u-Grand Malume". Kabelo looks at how the different writers' techniques and styles shaped what Botsotso Jesters has become, as well as how their many titles have influenced artists and writers in contemporary South Africa. It is evident that Botsotso Jesters has had a huge impact on South African culture, and it was inspiring to hear the story behind it from its founder and from another renowned writer.

https://botsotso.org.za/

Today, I had the pleasure of sitting down with Mustapha Jinadu, a writer from Northern Virginia DC, to discuss his writing process and philosophy. The conversation was easy, and we touched on many topics, from his published works to his travels to Afrika, and his perspectives and opinions on global politics and life in a post-pandemic world. He shared some of the influences that shape his writing, as well as some of his personal experiences that motivate him to write passionately and truthfully about the world. It was a fascinating conversation, and I left with a greater understanding of Mustapha's work, and his desire to use stories to challenge the status quo and inspire others to make a difference.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #TheArtLexcia #podcast

Today, I had the pleasure of sitting down with Jozi-based poet, Zama Madinana, to discuss his latest self-published anthology of poems, '94. We discussed his poetry, the subject matter of his art, his views on contemporary South Africa, the artwork for the book cover, and how he has gone about marketing his work. Additionally, we spoke about his upcoming gig at Poetry Africa and his other performances. It was an enlightening experience, and it left me feeling inspired by Zama's passion and dedication to his art. I'm sure many others will feel similarly when they dive into his incredible anthology of work.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #TheArtLexcia #Podcast

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Today I am blessed to have a conversation with Winnie Adams, Jennifer Botha , and Ashby from Arts On Ives. This NGO is based in the south of Johannesburg Klispruit West and is focused on using art as therapy in townships. Winnie Adams , the founder, gave us an in-depth look into the network of artists that they represent as well as a forthcoming art exhibition set to take place on August 26th, 2023 from 10pm to 4pm in Westbury. Jennifer shared her experiences and processes behind her miniature art, while Ashby Mo , who has his studio based at the Westbury Recreational Centre, discussed his techniques, art pieces, vision, and his work for the exhibition. It was an inspiring and interesting conversation.

Today I had the pleasure of interviewing Nolan ' Madhatter' Stevens, an artist, writer, and artist coach. We broadcast from the beautiful 'Inner City Views Group Exhibitions' at the Sanlam Private Wealth Gallery.

We started off the episode with a brief overview of Nolan's involvement in the Asisebenze Art Atelier studios, before taking a virtual walkabout. Nolan explained in detail the processes, techniques, and conceptual development of a few of the pieces at the exhibition.

We discussed how Nolan conceptualised the exhibition, the style and layout of the show, and how they operate. It was an enlightening conversation that gave me a greater understanding and appreciation for the hard work and dedication put into creating these stunning pieces of art.

https://asisebenze.com

www.sanlamprivatewealth.com

Today, I had the opportunity to sit down and chat with Kimberley-based visual artist Junior Oliphant. We discussed his fascinating background, exploring his influences and how these have shaped his artwork. He was generous enough to share his insight into the direction his art is taking, as well as his experience exhibiting in the London Contemporary 8th edition earlier this year. It was an enlightening conversation that offered a fresh perspective on the creative process. Oliphant's unique approach to art-making is sure to continue inspiring both his peers and the wider artistic community.

Hosted By Wesley Pepper

Produced by #theartlexcia #podcast

Today, I'm excited to welcome visual artist and content creator Keneilwe Mokeona back for another episode. Our conversation covers a wide variety of topics, with Keneilwe giving us an honest take on her two failed suicide attempts and how it has affected her mentally and artistically. We also discuss her dark sense of humour and meme culture, and we both share our views on how comedy can be used to lift our moods. Moving on, we delve into the art industry and unpack topics such as why the traditional opening of an exhibition is outdated in 2023, and explore alternative ways to reimagine the buying of art. Additionally, we talk about the future of the art industry and where we imagine it to be moving towards.

Today, I had the pleasure of co-hosting with Kabelo Mofokeng and speaking to the illustrious Jacob Mwela, a seasoned photographer. Jacob shared stories of his encounters with luminaries like George Hallet and the Bang-Bang Club - all of which were inspiring and captivating. He also shed light on his processes as a photo and studio photographer, as well as his current commission at the Art Bank South Africa in Bloemfontein's Oliewenhuis Gallery. Jacob's incredible journey through photography was an absolute delight to experience, and I'm sure it will continue to inspire many budding photographers for years to come.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper and Kabelo Mofokeng

Produced by #TheArtLexcia Podcast

Welcome to today's episode, where I'm co-hosting with Kabelo Mofokeng to talk to New Contrast Magazine's new Editor-in-Chief, Shile Ntuli. Shile is an acclaimed writer and poet from KwaZulu-Natal who will be discussing his influences, the current state of South African poetry, his vision for New Contrast Magazine, the kind of writing he is looking to publish, the challenges that lie ahead, ChatGPT, and the future editions of the magazine. His insights and combined with our conversation will provide readers with an enlightening look into the creative world of South African literature. Tune in to hear for yourself!

Hosted by Wesley Pepper n Kableo Mofokeng

Produced by #TheArtLexcia #Podcast

Today, we have a special guest: Entrepreneur Thato R Nhlapo of Atlegile Marketing Solutions in Soweto. On the show, we dive into the various challenges that modern entrepreneurs face and discuss how they are attempting to tackle them. We also chat about potential solutions and what the future holds. On top of this, Thato shares her perspective on the township economy and how they can best benefit from tools like social media while clearing up any misunderstanding and misapplication of technology. It's an interesting and inspiring conversation, so don't miss out!

This episode, I had the honor of interviewing Thabo Motseki of The Art Company Soweto regarding his current exhibition, '535 Phakedi Street, Money is Bigger than God'. Thabo opened up about his family, sister, mother, late grandfather, and the house he grew up in, and how these elements have been conceptualized in an exhibition featuring prints, mixed media artworks, and installations. This may have been the most honest and inspiring conversation I have ever had, and I highly recommend tuning in and viewing Thabo's artwork for yourself.

*The video froze after 25 minutes so I added a image over the audio

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #TheArtLexcia #Podcast

Today I talk to Kabelo Mofokeng a #writer and #artist based in #Pimville, #Soweto #johannesburg.

Kabza talks about the #processes behind his sophomore publication Hungry on Arrival, his relationship with the Botsotso Jesters, #music #art #poetry and reads us a poem titled "Somewhere."

My guest today is Mala Rama a #Seychelles based #artists who works on mixed media and water colours #paintings

We talk about her processes , how she had to adapt after #covid19 , her business and #Art

Today I talk to Sinalo Ntuli a mixed media [Beads] #artist based at August House , JHB about his journey in the #Arts , #processes , last years and Septembers 2023's #exhibitions .

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #TheArtLexcia #Podcast

Todays episode talk to Anton Siebrits a design #entrepreneur from #CapeTown about the struggles n wins on the contemporary creative in a post-covid #SouthAfrica

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #TheArtLexcia #Podcast

Todays episode I talk to Mo Afrika Wa Mokgathi about Hear My Voice and their Poets Guild .

She unpacks the ideology behind it , challenges, climate and future.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by The Art Lexcia

Todays episode we talk to Happy Mashigo from Obtain Gallery about how they adapting to the #tech revolution and #ai

We talk about how #ai is busy changing the #art industry and how Obtain Gallery is getting ahead of stream by adapting the technology to their site.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by #TheArtLexcia PODCAST

Today's episode I chat to Kimberly Anderson about her award winning poetry anthology ' Do I Look African'

We look at the identity politics and processes behind her poetry and how she used various platforms to market herself.

Today I talk Damian Harry , a Johannesburg based lecture and AI enthusiast. We look at its pro's , mostly , debunk some myths and look at practical ways the #Arts n #entrepreneurs can use n benefit from it.

Hosted by Wesley Pepper

Produced by Julius Patson ( Zimbabwe )

Todays episode we talk to Documentary Film Maker and photographer Eugene Ulman. We look at how the Johannesburg CBD has evolved , gentrification and his up and coming documentary ' 'Positive Anomaly '

First , season greetings from The Art Lexcia team.

Today we catch with Asar Alekbulan about the #BlackLivesMatter n gun violence in the US , Pan Africanism in the arts in 2023 and beyond.

Its our first episode of the year and we have plenty of new guests , features and collaborations coming in 2023

OneLove

Since its the holidays we decided to have a light n tasty episode you can all enjoy

Its our first attempt at a cooking show

Lee - Ann Topkin takes us through a simple but versatile bread recipe that you can make during the festive season. She gives the original recipe her own twist n flair and we hope everyone enjoy watching it.

This is our 100th episode, so much love to all our listeners over the past 100 episodes n here's to another 1000 more.

Todays episode is about the first Gauteng International Book fair

We talk to the programme director Lorraine Sithole about how it came to being, covid19 impact in the industry and moving forward

Today's episode we talk to Menzi Maseko from Green Ankh Works. We catch up and talk about Mental health in 2022 , traditional medicine , Covid19 legacy in Afrika and his company Green Ankh Works.

We also touch on how mental health has impacted Artists , you tube for kids and his views on the tech boom in 2022 and beyond.

Today we speak to musician , creative director n entrepreneur in the arts, Khethi Ntshangase.

Based in Reunion we catch up and talk about Campaign Africa.

We start off with how it was founded and conceptualized then we move on to all their various partners n associates across the continent and finish off with 2023 and beyond

Hosted by Wesley Pepper and Siza Nkosi

Produced by Julius Patson

Today we talk township entrepreneurship with the Grootman, Grey Mafumbu from the Dont Tatazel Pop Up Market n Stepahead Productions

We discuss the reasons why 'Dont Tatazel' platform was founded , how they operate , their vision and future events.

And we feature vox pops videos shot by Bobo Taguchi Nkosi and Thabo Lehlongwa at the Dont Tatzel Pop Up Market

Today we talk to Obert Jongwe from Zimbabwe but based in Hermanus in the western cape South Africa.

We look at his long standing relationship with his gallery , his processes behind his craft and how artists has been adapting in a post-pandemic world.

Today's episode we invited Rene Van Rensburg to talk about how creatives are coping in a crazy post-pandemic world.

We focused on deit, raising kids and using art of a form of therapy.

We talk about the processes behind her poetry, writing gigs [ langague translation] and langauge activism.

We focus on his processes and influnces behind the exhibition.

He is a Pan Afrikan writer n poet , public speaker n podcaster.

We talk about Pan Afrikasim in a post -covid world and his work as podcaster , traveler and writer.

We had rolling blackouts and that affected our scheduling .

We had two guest lined up and each time the government cut our power making it impossible TO RECORD. I explain the whole process and we look forward to the WOMAD Music fest next month

She shares her views on the current state of the art industry , galleries and her collaboration with technology

We look at his views on the topical trends like the ongoing hop hop beef and how artists and thinkers can exist in the digital world amongst other things

We have in-depth discussion on his work, influences , haiku's and current events like the 10 year anniversary of the Marikana Massacre.

Today's episode we talk to the poet Candice Harris about her journey through poetry.

We explore both the process behind his personal work and entrepreneurship in the arts

#Art #Design #Merch #Lesotho #Tech #Entrepreneurship

Today we profile Kgosi Rampa about the Locrate Market's event on the 7th August 2022

We also look at entrepreneurship in our townships #BlackLove and their process , challenges and how they growing in a post-pandemic world

#BlackLove #Entrepreneurship

#HelenSayers #Celestial #arts #healing #Jersey #UK #meditation

Today we talk to Abdul about Poetry| Art| Music| and life and pay tribute to the late Don Mattera

#AbdulMilazi #JHB #DonMattera #Poetry #SouthAfrica #Art #Music

#Buskaid #Music #ClassicMusic #MusicVideo #25thyearAnniversary #JHB #SouthAfrica

Today we talk about Sun Xa's processes of creating music | their music philosophies | community engagement projects | and we jam to their music

#SunXa #Music #Processes #SouthAfrica #MusicVideo #Jam #BlackLove

Today we talk about her company ' Book Lingo' | book festivals, typesetting, publishing, art, books

#ClareRose #Publishing #JHB #BookLingo #BookFestivals #BlackLove

There was a technical issue last week and we couldn't upload episode 78

Wesley explains what happened and moving forward

Wesley - start off with a background on previous episodes in 2020 an 2021

The Umkhondo project in review

Spin Venak

Gigs 2022

Grahamstown festival / national art festival

#Theatre #Kimberley #Poetry #Art #Blacklove #ArtsFestival

We talk about his processes , paintings , views on the art industry and his various other interests n projects

#GaryFrier #paintings #CapeTown #Art #SouthAfrica #BlackLove

Introducing a new co-host… A conversation between Wesley Pepper and Siza Nkosi about her upcoming poetry collection, the green house session, and the processes behind her cover design by mr Pepper

We met at a poetry session the east rand Gauteng.

In this episode we take a look at his journey through as a Mormon and views on Pan Africanism , religion and writing

#NhlanhlaSliga #Mormom #Writing #Poetry

She's also an activist and whistleblower , prolific social media activist

We talk about her art background , her time at Wits in 70's/ 80's , whistle blowing in Limpopo and views on the art industry in a Post-pandemic world.

#ArtletterFranks #Art #Activisim #SouthAfrica #painting

It was conversation I had with TACS about their recent dinner and art exhibition in Braamfontein JHB.

We spoke about how the concept , future shows and reflected on 2021

#Art #Braamfontein #Soweto #SouthAfrican #TACS #Printmaking

Today's episode I look at how Credo Mutwa's legacy can and does influence contemporary art and academics.   And I address  technology ( the 4th industrial revolution ) and how the current covid 19 pandemic is shifting Africans perspectives.

Questions

Nosipho Mutwa - An introduction to his legacy in the arts and academia.

His business and process

How he works in the township

[00:00:00] Wesley: Hey greetings everybody. It's Wesley pepper and you're tuned in to my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah, hi everybody, uh, to all my new and returning listeners from wherever you are, whatever part of the world you are and whatever device you're listening on.

[00:00:25] Welcome. And I really appreciate having you here today for another kick-ass episode on Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica. Um, let's just have a quick recap on last week's episode. Uh, thanks a lot Delia for coming through, man, all the way from Cape town. That was super cool. My sister, I really, uh, enjoy the process.

[00:00:41] You know, we spoke about theater of the oppressed and. I think like the way they are adapting to the pandemic is quite interesting is super, super interesting. I thought that, um, that really grabbed me, um, and the way they using, uh, you know, the, the, the digital platform and even zoom. I thought that was really interesting.

[00:00:59] So if you haven't listened to it yet, please go check it out, man. It's available on all the streaming platforms. Um, I'll, I'll. Sort of announced that at the end of the episode again, as I always do. Yeah, man, uh, also lots going on in the world, also in my life. There's also a super cool project that has, uh, since, you know, um, I guess all the energies in the right, uh, place and all of that.

[00:01:20] And I'll definitely tell you guys more about that at the end of the day, I think it's going to be really cool. Um, uh, you know, um, collaborating with some app developers and yada yada, yada, I'll tell you guys more about that towards the end of the episode. Yeah. Okay. Uh, let's go on to today's episode. Yeah.

[00:01:35] Today I'm also talking to a really interesting artist man, all the way from Port Elizabeth. Uh, we're talking to Jessica Hallier, she's a visual artist that runs, uh, a company called, uh, Jesse's Artscape. Um, you know, and, um, she's a visual artist, as I say, she does a lot of portraits and that type of thing.

[00:01:51] Also, she works. Quite, uh, I would say abstract. Um, I've seen some really interesting abstract work, which I thought was really cool and really interesting to talk about that. Uh, from what I know, I know she also does a lot of commissioned work, uh, from what we spoke about in the week. Sounds like that.

[00:02:08] So we definitely be unpacking that because I've been noticing her processes, her technique, and I thought that's really interesting, man. Especially the more abstract kind of work, um, That's that's going to be quite interesting to talk about and see how her business works. So we unpack her processes of course, as always.

[00:02:25] And, um, yeah, unpack her business, man, like how she's coping with this new reality we've been given, you know, how she's dealing with all of that, how she's adapting, um, how she's taken to the tech world and tech trends that social media as well. So, but yeah, man, so I was gonna be like, It's going to be a lot of fun looking forward to it.

[00:02:46] Um, yeah. And, um, as always I'll, um, yeah, I'll speak to guys after this and I'll make some more announcements towards the end of the episode. Um, so yeah, everybody thanks for tuning in and I'll speak to you after this. 

[00:03:01] spudcaster: baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcast, your life with baobulb.org 

[00:03:18] Wesley: [00:03:18] All right, then let's okay. Let's get straight into it, man. Uh, Jessica Hallier did I pronounce your surname...]]>Transcript

[00:00:00] Wesley: Hey greetings everybody. It's Wesley pepper and you're tuned in to my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah, hi everybody, uh, to all my new and returning listeners from wherever you are, whatever part of the world you are and whatever device you're listening on.

[00:00:25] Welcome. And I really appreciate having you here today for another kick-ass episode on Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica. Um, let's just have a quick recap on last week's episode. Uh, thanks a lot Delia for coming through, man, all the way from Cape town. That was super cool. My sister, I really, uh, enjoy the process.

[00:00:41] You know, we spoke about theater of the oppressed and. I think like the way they are adapting to the pandemic is quite interesting is super, super interesting. I thought that, um, that really grabbed me, um, and the way they using, uh, you know, the, the, the digital platform and even zoom. I thought that was really interesting.

[00:00:59] So if you haven't listened to it yet, please go check it out, man. It's available on all the streaming platforms. Um, I'll, I'll. Sort of announced that at the end of the episode again, as I always do. Yeah, man, uh, also lots going on in the world, also in my life. There's also a super cool project that has, uh, since, you know, um, I guess all the energies in the right, uh, place and all of that.

[00:01:20] And I'll definitely tell you guys more about that at the end of the day, I think it's going to be really cool. Um, uh, you know, um, collaborating with some app developers and yada yada, yada, I'll tell you guys more about that towards the end of the episode. Yeah. Okay. Uh, let's go on to today's episode. Yeah.

[00:01:35] Today I'm also talking to a really interesting artist man, all the way from Port Elizabeth. Uh, we're talking to Jessica Hallier, she's a visual artist that runs, uh, a company called, uh, Jesse's Artscape. Um, you know, and, um, she's a visual artist, as I say, she does a lot of portraits and that type of thing.

[00:01:51] Also, she works. Quite, uh, I would say abstract. Um, I've seen some really interesting abstract work, which I thought was really cool and really interesting to talk about that. Uh, from what I know, I know she also does a lot of commissioned work, uh, from what we spoke about in the week. Sounds like that.

[00:02:08] So we definitely be unpacking that because I've been noticing her processes, her technique, and I thought that's really interesting, man. Especially the more abstract kind of work, um, That's that's going to be quite interesting to talk about and see how her business works. So we unpack her processes of course, as always.

[00:02:25] And, um, yeah, unpack her business, man, like how she's coping with this new reality we've been given, you know, how she's dealing with all of that, how she's adapting, um, how she's taken to the tech world and tech trends that social media as well. So, but yeah, man, so I was gonna be like, It's going to be a lot of fun looking forward to it.

[00:02:46] Um, yeah. And, um, as always I'll, um, yeah, I'll speak to guys after this and I'll make some more announcements towards the end of the episode. Um, so yeah, everybody thanks for tuning in and I'll speak to you after this. 

[00:03:01] spudcaster: baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcast, your life with baobulb.org 

[00:03:18] Wesley: [00:03:18] All right, then let's okay. Let's get straight into it, man. Uh, Jessica Hallier did I pronounce your surname correctly 

[00:03:25] Jess: not quite but yeah. 

[00:03:30] Wesley: Um, and do I call you Jessica or Jessie or

[00:03:46] I think I’ll go for the formal thing here. I know another Jessica. Who's also an artist anyway.

[00:03:56] Jess: Well, um, I must update you. My, my business name has been changed to Jess Hallier artworks it’s no longer Jessie’s Artscape.

[00:04:12] Wesley: Okay. Uh, yeah, so yeah, man, lets jump, let’s start from the beginning, you know, I mean, I was saying a little bit off air, uh, you know, every artist has a, has a journey on how they got to where they are today, you know, um, some artists did this, some artists did that. That's uh, since you, uh, there’s actually a technical word for people like us, it's an art practitioner

[00:04:40] Um, so yeah, so,

[00:04:48] um, yeah,

[00:04:56] But you run your own business and you’re an art practitioner so before we get into the, like, the business and the art and stuff I just can you tell my listeners a little about yourself

[00:05:01] you know, what part of the world are you from? You know, and how did you get into this game

[00:05:07] Jess: Okay. So, um, I'm originally from Johannesburg, um, was born in Pretoria and I come from a very artistic family. My mom and I used to paint together. My aunt used to also paint. Um, my family did a lot of writing poetry dancing. So as I say, very creative, um, I had, I was always an introvert.

[00:05:40] I was bullied and, um, I had a very difficult relationship with my parents. And so I found comfort in art and I found that that was the only place I was being heard. Um, I wasn't being judged. Yeah. I wasn't being bullied and like, I could also express those feelings. I wasn't really good at expressing them with words.

[00:06:08] I'm not very good with words. And so art helped me to escape reality and, um, I've been doing that since I was a very little girl. I wanted to be a graffiti artist. And anyway, I ended up becoming a high school dropout and I worked as a waitress for many years and bartending and. Um, I decided in 2017 that I can't lie to myself anymore and that I, you know, follow my dreams and then I don't want to be doing what I was doing for the rest of my life.

[00:06:51] So I started teaching myself how to do art and at the same time, I landed myself a peachy illustration job, because I thought, well, while I'm learning how to do art I might as well go and look for like, we'll just call it children's book, illustration jobs, and then if I land something like that while I'm learning, I can earn some bucks for it.

[00:07:12] So that's how I started. Um, and I illustrated a book called the school in the tunnels. It was, um, Excuse me. It was

[00:07:32] published by Chestnut publishers in 2019 and it's available on Amazon and, and yeah, so I taught myself. Yeah, basically. I'm self-taught artists.

[00:07:59] Wesley: Uh, uh, interesting thing that I picked up there is there’s a common thread that runs through every artist that I know myself included is that most of our art is actually drawn through some kind of pain

[00:08:05] Um, it's, it's, it's almost as if pain, uh, is like a, uh, you know, do the artist is like in the center and then the pain sort of like almost a what's the word. Yeah. It brings out the artists explodes and then they usually that the results aren't. So that's actually quite interesting. Um,

[00:08:36] Jess: Um, you see I also suffer from epilepsy and I have mental illness attached to that and, um, I can only express how the seizures affect me through art. There is no word on this earth to say what it does to me. And I feel that you cannot create anything beautiful from a beautiful place. It has to come from, as you were saying, that deep place of broken brokenness pain.

[00:09:04] Um, so yeah, I mean mental wellness and all of that, one has to say it does kind of enable you and equip you with tools to create these things.

[00:09:20] Wesley: Um, the mental thing is quite a topical thing at the moment

[00:09:31] especially in our industry, you also said there that you were self taught.

[00:09:41] I know that with self taught artists technically I dont want to get very technical I've noticed most self taught artists, uh, draw or paint in sort of a photo realist manner, uh, uh, the way they conceptualized. Yeah. Yeah. So, so, so a lot of the, um, content come from, um, photographs, um, so in, um, In teaching in, uh, teaching yourself out of work, uh, explain it to us. Like, how did you, why did you start, um, um, uh, I guess, I guess, where did you start getting the confidence to know like, yo man, but I can do this, you know, and I'm good.

[00:10:27] Jess: Well, um, I, as I say, I mean, the high school drop out bunked school to draw graffiti the whole day. Wrong thing to do, but anyway, maybe it's not

[00:10:46] powerful. So anyway, I mean, when I started taking it seriously in 2017 again, but before then, um, I tried to draw my dog. I had to pit bull and I was, I was like 17 years old and I came really close to that super duper close. And I used to also, when I was younger draw, I started off with obviously drawing other artists art, you begin, and then you move on, you progress on to drawing things like an apple, um, things that's in your living room that you see so that you can shape and all of that.

[00:11:26] And obviously, always beginning with the first basic shapes, like triangles and in turning those into cubes, cylinders et cetera. So, and then I started to teach myself how to render, um, portraits from start, you know, uh, The whole foundation and everything like that. And then it went on to anatomy, all the meanwhile I was doing the illustrations on the side, cartoons find abstracts, all of that kind of stuff.

[00:12:09] Wesley: So yeah.

[00:12:19] Interesting. I like the fact that you did something in anatomy I think that’s very important.

[00:12:28] Um, and I guess one can see it in the work actually. Um, so, and the whole you keep bringing up graffiti, um, I actually got family in Port Elizabeth. Um, I guess I would say, um, I’m part from PE as well. Um, and I'm, I'm actually quite familiar with some of the graffiti, uh, especially around

[00:12:51] by the train station. Um, Uh, uh, there about, uh, and Richard Niel got some really cool stuff there

[00:13:02] so, um, yeah, I see it a little bit of, you know, I’m kind of familiar with some of the graffiti culture in PE

[00:13:13] It’s actually cool. You also made mention of like a children’s book, I want to get to that because I think that's pretty interesting as well. Um, and like your business. So you say you changed your name, not to it's changed from Jesse's Artscape to Jessica?

[00:13:44] Jess: Um, Jess Hallier’s Artworks. The original name was Jessie’s Artscape because it was like Jessica’s escape, escape place, you know, as an escape. So now the reason why I’ve changed that

[00:13:52] is because I found out some information from a family member

[00:13:58] Well, from my mom about a family member in our family, Michael Hallier he resided around. The Grahamstown area in Alice actually, um, he, he was my third cousin. Uh, he was an Eastern Cape oil painter, but he was also, uh, the professor of fine arts at the fort hare university in Alice. And he established the first art school to award black artists with a degree.

[00:14:31] His art school was internationally recognised. He had, has a BA, well master's in fine arts. And, um, the reason why I referred to him in the past tense is because he died of lung cancer in 2001, I didn't ever meet him. Um, he had several exhibitions and works. Uh, his works have been exhibited internationally, so.

[00:14:55] Um, I, um, he's, um, family of his, and I believe that this is a way to show people as well, that this is my bloodline.

[00:15:11] Yeah, because as I said, it’s a creative family, but now when I find out this information about him, I, it like set that foundation and I believe that I have to carry on my family name.

[00:15:26] I am the last

[00:15:32] that can actually bear children. Well I’m not actually going to have children and I don't have children. So that's, this is my way of leaving my name behind.

[00:15:46] Wesley: Um, yeah, I mean, let's jumping into the business now. Um, so, uh, but just like, just give some context everything's um, um, As artists. Um, I'm actually very interested to know, you know, I understand where the name comes from. I understand that that sort of consistency that's actually quite interesting as well.

[00:16:12] Most artists, um, you know, that, especially the artists from major centers or Johannesburg, Cape Town and so forth and even abroad, uh, entrepreneurial, you know, that not many are entrepreneurial, you know, most of them, as soon as they get signed by a gallery that’s pretty much it, you know, uh, yeah, sure. These days things have been changing. Absolutely. And I know, I mean, me personally I know of many artists who are entrepreneurial

[00:16:41] But yeah. Um, so. How did you, I mean, like it's a very, it's a very, uh, bold thing to do, um, especially from someone who's self-taught, um, because you sort of sketch your own reality in what you decide to teach yourself with and all of that. So clearly in that ecosystem that you created there was some form of entrepreneur, or being an entrepreneur come from somewhere.

[00:17:11] Um, um, but how did it get to that point, uh. Tell me how the, how your business is set up, you know, uh, the products you make, you know, the art and so on

[00:17:27] Jess: uh, well, well, I mean, I solely run my business from home, I, um, and I. I always believe that you are always learning. So you can’t stop and say, you know, now it's done. Yeah. Like you get a job. And if you don't have the skillset, you make this skillset, everything that you keep on learning and that, and, um, How, uh, I mean, if a customer orders something from me, I use PostNet to send it.

[00:18:08] I mean, I save on the fact that I don't have to go and rent a space. I did work with an art gallery before, but I walked out with less money after I sold an art piece. So, and now when I do it from home, I can spend um, more money on, on arts utensils. And I get the full amount when I sell the piece, I don't have to give a certain percentage to people and I don't have to pay to put my art in the place.

[00:18:38] And, and, and, and, and so, yeah, I mean, I. Just run it from home. And I think that it's even better to do it now in this new modern world, because in this modern world, that is where it's growing. I mean, everybody's working from home, everybody's starting their own business and doing it in their bedroom. I mean, you see these influences, they got the photo shoots happening.

[00:19:02] They got a wall that they use and, and you run your business, in your little house, in your, wherever you are. You, you, you got your phone. Or your tablet, you take it with you wherever you go. So you're always available for your customers or your clients or whatever. So it's pretty, it's pretty simple nowadays to run a art business, a hair dressing business and nail designing there's whatever you wanted.

[00:19:29] I mean, the, the way this modern world is going is making it simpler for us to make it, to make it from home. Think about the amounts of petrol you spend. When you drive to work every single day,

[00:19:51] you gotta pay that petrol to go from your house to the studio space. Whereas if you section off a piece of your house, turn it into a studio. Bob's your uncle. You saved. And now you just bring in the cash and stuff. And as I say, for me personally, working with galleries, I don't know if I will do it because it wasn't wasn't it wasn't 

[00:20:15] Wesley: uh,

[00:20:22] yeah. Yeah. Interesting point there about the cost saving

[00:20:27] Yeah, yeah, of course the bottom line is all about money

[00:20:37] um, uh, Uh, of not getting what you deserve from the, from the gallery, that's, uh, that's a problem.

[00:20:49] Um, we actually all do to some point not that I'm hating on any galleries. 

[00:20:56] Jess: I also work with standing gallery, whatever they can do whatever, but like for me, and a lot of people that I've seen. As they stick to the little house,

[00:21:15] Wesley: uh,

[00:21:22] Yeah, that's definitely part of this post COVID world. Um, ja sure. And, um, also I know that for artists, it might be easy because even myself, I kind of know a few things that are on and then making workspace. And it's quite, uh, it's quite interesting how different people are adapting to that.

[00:21:50] Our houses are designed pretty much to sleep, eat, and go to work. Um, it's not designed to work, so I'm actually giving quite a close eye on because I know artists who’ve been, as you say, even yourself, who’ve been doing that for years and there's many that does it.

[00:22:08] Um, I also understand the thing of saving costs. Um just a, uh, uh, a quick question

[00:22:14] um, have you done or rather, like, how do you get your work out there? Because one of the major roles of a gallery is to take the artist to the market and sell their work

[00:22:30] So how do you hustle?

[00:22:38] Jess: But galleries dont always do that. That was another issue that I had with them. But anyway, we won’t talk nonsense.

[00:22:45] I use the internet. I rely on my phone because my internet on my laptop is so slow. My phone is faster. So I get clients from Facebook is my number one and Instagram also. Upwork, uh, people per hour, glass door, deviant art and places like that platforms, but mostly Facebook and yeah, as I say, yeah, uh, websites, um, yeah, there's even art pages that they, what they do is they supply, um, They dedicated solely just to putting out, uh, art competitions and exhibitions that are available and stuff like that.

[00:23:38] You could, you go on there and that's our fine art competition. Like last year in the midst of COVID, uh, I decided to start the art competition enter an art competition. My first one, um, a prestigious one, uh, international. Before COVID hit us and then yeah, it hits. And that's also, I found on the internet. So everything is on the internet.

[00:24:09] Everybody's using the internet nowadays. 

[00:24:12] Wesley: Uh, uh, the thing that really sticks out is that, most of your clients are on Facebook. Um, you know, like this is something that I've been building up a lot over the years actually is how, uh, which social media platform, um, of the sort of more ideal to one’s work. For example Twitter is...]]>01341008-9f86-417b-8c5f-d7f21daf35eaFri, 17 Sep 2021 09:00:00 +020046:41falsefull6767Candice NolanTheatre of the OppressedTranscript

[00:00:00] Wesley: Greetings everybody, uh, Wesley Pepper here and you're tuned to my podcast Wesley Peppers art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Hi everybody. Uh, welcome to all my new and returning listeners from wherever you are on whatever device you listen to it, listening to it from whatever part of the world.

[00:00:29] Welcome. And, um, thanks for, yeah, man. Thanks for joining me for another week of podcasting. Uh, yeah. Uh, lots has been happening in the world, uh, especially on my side, but I'll get into that a bit later. Um, yeah, maybe just start off with, uh, Uh, recapping on last week's episode, big up to my brother Skosana for coming through.

[00:00:51] Um, I was really inspired by his, uh, or talking to him last week by his episode, man, like, um, not many artists, have clients backed up that far ahead already. And I think that's quite a level achievement and it should be celebrated for that. Um, so look, my bruh I'll definitely want to do a follow-up on him in a few but, like say, uh, probably early next year.

[00:01:15] Um, uh, given that, uh, Yeah, that's just that, that's just some part of the art that I'm really, really keeping my eye on. Um, I'm, I'm, I'm talking about, uh, murals of, of, um, specifically murals, uh, specifically at, um, businesses, because as we know, uh, you know, things is changing fast, man, and. That plus the fourth industrial revolution, you know, lots of things are becoming automated.

[00:01:38] So I'm very interested to know how businesses are adapting to that. Um, specifically arts, but, um, yeah, it's just a, it's just a theme or a topic, a subject that I'm keeping my eye open. Uh, that's why I seriously enjoyed speaking to my brother last week. Um, yeah man. Yeah. Um, and I said a lot has been happening to me, uh, but I I'm.

[00:01:58] Okay. You know, I'm, I'm okay. I'm a survivor. So, um, Today. Um, today I also got, like a seriously cool, um, guest. I'm talking to Delia, Meyer she's based in Cape town. Um, she works for, or she's one. She works for UCT. So she's actually involved in, uh, in theater and thats her whole, um, I mean theater of the oppressed.

[00:02:20] I know she works with a lot of marginalised communities. I know. From from, the Delia Meyer that I met because I met her like many years ago, um, many, many years ago. And, uh, I know she had her feet very grounded and she was always involved in community, uh, in the community arts and the community theater. And that's going to be really dope talking to her because we'll unpack a little bit of everything.

[00:02:41] We’re going to be unpacking her processes. So the processes behind her creativity. Um, so I'm actually kind of interested for that. I'm looking forward to that because, um, I haven’t yeah been talking to too many, uh, theater practitioners on this platform. Yeah. I, well, I guess it's just, this is one of those things, so, um, yeah, I've, I'm, I'm definitely looking forward to that.

[00:03:01] Um, so we’re going to be unpacking her processes, unpacking the work she’s been doing, because as we know, like, uh, with the ongoing pandemic, um, it has also not necessarily stopped, but it's definitely put the brakes on a lot of communities. Um, so it's gonna be very interesting to know how she's been adapting to that, you know, um, what project she's working on and, um, so forth man.

[00:03:21] Um, and of course the COVID thing, because that's just like such a huge thing, man. And, um, the whole VAX versus anti-vaccine is becoming such a. It's becoming such a, it's becoming a real social, uh, thing. So there's people on the one side is like, you know, the whole us versus them, rich versus poor. Yeah, man.

[00:03:40] It's absolutely absolutely crazy. So it's...]]>Transcript

[00:00:00] Wesley: Greetings everybody, uh, Wesley Pepper here and you're tuned to my podcast Wesley Peppers art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Hi everybody. Uh, welcome to all my new and returning listeners from wherever you are on whatever device you listen to it, listening to it from whatever part of the world.

[00:00:29] Welcome. And, um, thanks for, yeah, man. Thanks for joining me for another week of podcasting. Uh, yeah. Uh, lots has been happening in the world, uh, especially on my side, but I'll get into that a bit later. Um, yeah, maybe just start off with, uh, Uh, recapping on last week's episode, big up to my brother Skosana for coming through.

[00:00:51] Um, I was really inspired by his, uh, or talking to him last week by his episode, man, like, um, not many artists, have clients backed up that far ahead already. And I think that's quite a level achievement and it should be celebrated for that. Um, so look, my bruh I'll definitely want to do a follow-up on him in a few but, like say, uh, probably early next year.

[00:01:15] Um, uh, given that, uh, Yeah, that's just that, that's just some part of the art that I'm really, really keeping my eye on. Um, I'm, I'm, I'm talking about, uh, murals of, of, um, specifically murals, uh, specifically at, um, businesses, because as we know, uh, you know, things is changing fast, man, and. That plus the fourth industrial revolution, you know, lots of things are becoming automated.

[00:01:38] So I'm very interested to know how businesses are adapting to that. Um, specifically arts, but, um, yeah, it's just a, it's just a theme or a topic, a subject that I'm keeping my eye open. Uh, that's why I seriously enjoyed speaking to my brother last week. Um, yeah man. Yeah. Um, and I said a lot has been happening to me, uh, but I I'm.

[00:01:58] Okay. You know, I'm, I'm okay. I'm a survivor. So, um, Today. Um, today I also got, like a seriously cool, um, guest. I'm talking to Delia, Meyer she's based in Cape town. Um, she works for, or she's one. She works for UCT. So she's actually involved in, uh, in theater and thats her whole, um, I mean theater of the oppressed.

[00:02:20] I know she works with a lot of marginalised communities. I know. From from, the Delia Meyer that I met because I met her like many years ago, um, many, many years ago. And, uh, I know she had her feet very grounded and she was always involved in community, uh, in the community arts and the community theater. And that's going to be really dope talking to her because we'll unpack a little bit of everything.

[00:02:41] We’re going to be unpacking her processes. So the processes behind her creativity. Um, so I'm actually kind of interested for that. I'm looking forward to that because, um, I haven’t yeah been talking to too many, uh, theater practitioners on this platform. Yeah. I, well, I guess it's just, this is one of those things, so, um, yeah, I've, I'm, I'm definitely looking forward to that.

[00:03:01] Um, so we’re going to be unpacking her processes, unpacking the work she’s been doing, because as we know, like, uh, with the ongoing pandemic, um, it has also not necessarily stopped, but it's definitely put the brakes on a lot of communities. Um, so it's gonna be very interesting to know how she's been adapting to that, you know, um, what project she's working on and, um, so forth man.

[00:03:21] Um, and of course the COVID thing, because that's just like such a huge thing, man. And, um, the whole VAX versus anti-vaccine is becoming such a. It's becoming such a, it's becoming a real social, uh, thing. So there's people on the one side is like, you know, the whole us versus them, rich versus poor. Yeah, man.

[00:03:40] It's absolutely absolutely crazy. So it's really interesting to unpack that and see how it's unfolding in our society in real time. So definitely looking forward to her opinion on that, but most probably, but definitely her processes because I know Delia is quite incredible and she's also a good writer.

[00:03:55] I've read some of the stuff. Uh, yeah. Okay. Definitely looking forward to that. So yeah, well stay tuned for that. Um, I will chat to you as usual at the, after the, um, you know, after the interview and I'll tell you what what's happening, what's coming up and just giving a recap on a few other things. So yeah, stay tuned for that.

[00:04:16] And I will chat to you after this. 

[00:04:19] spudcaster: baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org. 

[00:04:37] Wesley: Okay. Delia Meyer Uh, all the way from UCT in Cape Town you say it’s very windy there? Uh, I believe you.

[00:04:45] Yeah. Um, thanks for coming. Um, just for starters just tell my listeners a little bit about yourself. So who is Delia meyer, uh, uh, what does she represent? What does she do, et cetera, et cetera. And we’ll unpick it bit by bit, uh, after that, 

[00:05:03] Delia: Woo. Nice to see you again, and hear you again, Wesley. Um, so yeah. Delia from UCT? Not exactly.

[00:05:11] My, my thing is I am a freelancer and it's very important to me because I have chosen to work on the margins. So what I do at UCT I work in, I work in the drama department, but in the applied theater department as a teacher and I get, you know, contracts, every single I'm lucky that I kinda have been blessed with those contracts every semester.

[00:05:36] Um, there's a, there's a place for me and it's not just in the applied, particularly with drama students. I also do some healing arts methodology teaching, and also recently some professional practice for the third years as freelancers as those that choose to be freelancers. Or I also do emerging artists training.

[00:05:56] So I think it's because I've chosen to kind of not be institutionalised as such. I find it important to the work I do, you know, um, as an applied theater practitioner, I specialise in theater of the oppressed. So it's important that I work in kind of what you would call oppressed communities, especially to try and find people's voices, what it is.

[00:06:20] They need to say previously silenced or unheard people. Um, yeah, so theater of the oppressed places, people in the social political context, always. And, um, therefore. Well, it's important, you know, hiring me and how I can give the space for people to be able to speak the truth to that, basically, to speak truth to power. Um, and 

[00:06:48] Wesley: Interesting.

[00:06:52] Yeah, a few questions there. Uh, interesting when you say theater of the oppressed like it actually sounds like a play

[00:07:00] to be honest, uh, it sounds like, uh, sounds like I could go to watch a production called theater of the oppressed. Um, um, is that a phrase that you coined yourself or is there a genre, what is that? Is that, uh, uh, was it a specific, you know, is it, is it something specific?

[00:07:24] Delia: No. So the methodology that was created, um, kind of coined by somebody called Augusto Boal he just passed away in 2011 and. You know, what happened for me is I studied, um, the practical, you know, I, I went to drama school as any other drama school person. I was going to be an actor and all that. That was the only thing I could do. You know, I was always in the school plays and so on.

[00:07:55] And, um, at that time being young, What my dream was to be an actor. I specialised in creative movement. I started realising that wait, mainstream stuff doesn't really work for me. I also struggled to be cast in mainstream stuff. I'm not sure if it had to do with my accent or not fitting into some kind of box.

[00:08:17] Remember I mean, I started varsity in 1990, so we were still in apartheid. Yeah, 

[00:08:23] Wesley: yeah, yeah, yeah. Things were a lot different back then

[00:08:27] Delia: Right. So through the years I started trying to see how theater itself can actually make a difference. It wasn't good enough for me, just to be a tool of the industry, a lot of dynamics in the industry, as well as being the voice of the script writer being directed by other people, I felt that it was too much agency and too much need to want to change something.

[00:08:49] Having also a mother who was an, uh, an anti-apartheid activist. And so, um, someone who had studied drama and education at Wits, a very close friend of mine Joe Hazelhurst needed somebody to join her in this workshop to create this piece called a piece of type of theater called forum theater. And she was more theater in education.

[00:09:12] And I was more on the creative side. So this creator and this creative and this facilitator came together to create. These workshops, based on theater of the oppressed, she had previously had some input from Boal himself who had been in South Africa and that's where the bug bit you see, so one of the main things that people might recognise from theater of the oppressed is something called forum theater.

[00:09:37] Where what it is is it's a piece of theater created by the actors obviously created and what they refer to it, a theater for community by community. So the, the, the theater is generally created from a theme within a community that is really important at the time and really needs processing. And that play will then be put on back to the community.

[00:10:03] So say we would be working in, uh, in about, say, say a GBV issue. The woman will, the women that maybe have created that piece or men and women will then go and find a way, whether it be in a stadium or a church and church hall and present it back to that community. Now, the thing about forum theater is that it has something called spect actors coming from spectator, meaning that the audience cannot be passive.

[00:10:36] We cannot this whole thing of top down. Right? So you go to an elitist theater well, theater is well known to be an elite space, Yup. You, you pay exorbitant prices, perhaps, maybe now, you know, the way it was and you sit, there, you go through a process. You experience a conflict, but most theater is created to leave you with a catharsis where you feel like, oh shoot, it's solved.

[00:11:04] So it doesn't matter what type of theater could be dealing with social change. Your audience still sits feeling like oh, you guys have solved it for me, Boal wants you to leave the audience feeling that I need to do something about this. So he then engages his audience as actors and those actors then can come and intervene in the piece of theater and can come up with the.

[00:11:31] What we call options, not solutions because we focusing on many perspectives of one problem. There is never just one solution. And that's one of the, you know, the design of the underlying foundations of it is that it's about many different answers and creating agency for oppressed people. People that may not, those audience members may never have had a voice and they are able to

[00:11:57] engage with the actors about the problem. One of the other very important parts of forum theater is what's called the Joker or facilitator. So that's my that's mainly my role, the joker, not only jokers, the actual piece of forum theater, the joker has worked with the actors previously to create this piece of theater.

[00:12:17] So, so facilitating in this form and well jokering in this form and, being a facilitator, I would say is a highly skilled, um, type of position. It, it requires a lot of inter and intra, personal intelligence. Understanding communication and feeling people, you know, around, you know, what is needed. And of course, improv techniques because the theater piece of theater starts without a script.

[00:12:46] So a lot of the work that I do is improv based and one of the other most important things is it's really important that it is process driven and process oriented. And as we know in a world, In the industry, everything is so product oriented and that's one of my major challenges.

[00:13:07] Wesley: You said a lot, a lot, a lot, a lot of things that I just got one point like, uh, the whole, I understand the concept about theater of the oppressed. I’ve got a similar

[00:13:18] I guess angle the way I view art as I said music is a weapon. You know, I always came from that. Uh, um, I wanted to use my art to actually physically do something interesting than like what you were saying is really super cool. I want to unpack that a bit. But let’s just take it back before you get to the actual product, what did you say it was

[00:13:40] uh, the joker? What was the word again

[00:13:54] Delia: The joker. So you may as well call it the facilitator in forum theater.

[00:14:02] Wesley: Okay. Interesting. Okay, man. So as a joker or if I must

[00:14:08] take it even a step back as a, as, as, as a creative person, you, um, said a few things that resonates that your parents were um

[00:14:15] you come from an activist background.

[00:14:24] Um, um, and I know, yeah, you actually have that. This is the platform for artists to talk about that type of thing.

[00:14:33] So, so, um, I get that. So explain to me, man. I want to get into a, how do you, how do you conceptualize this? How does it start firstly, where do you, do you follow like local trends

[00:14:48] now, this is happening in the world. Uh, you know, this is the relevant thing I must go to this community is it like that?

[00:14:56] or so I'd like to start there. So what influences the content. And then how does one create the content, how do you work? Um, yeah. Explain to me, explain to us that process. 

[00:15:11] Delia: Sure. So any important thing to know is that, um, you know, is, it's a very well thought out methodology and they literally refer to his work as an arsenal, an arsenal of methodologies

[00:15:31] Forum theater is just one he's invisible theater, newspaper theater, legislative theater, um, uh, you know, image theater and, um, The arsenal is, is made up of games. What, what he refers to as games. And some of these may even be familiar to people when you stand in a circle and you kind of warm up your body and it goes around the circle, then you ask people to say one word, then they say a sentence.

[00:16:00] Then they might break into song. So these, so it's really it's arts based

[00:16:08] Therefore applied theater which is the umbrella term that theater of the oppressed falls under, and I have a master's degree. In applied theater is, is that, um, it takes an art based drama based methodology, which, which requires the whole body to engage in the learning. That's why it's so process oriented. When you see that actor on stage doing the piece, they've already gone through a deep process of finding out who they are.

[00:16:37] It's there, it's there truth. It's there voice that’s attempted to be brought out. They are themselves empowered as a person. Before they get to present to other people. Um, so once we started those games and they know that this firstly it’s in a circle, it never happens in a, in a typically, you know, um, it doesn't, it's not a top-down approach.

[00:17:00] Um, I, I do own that. I am the facilitator. I'm taking you through this process. And so it's very much a case of you needing to be teachable, but you move through this. And then we, you know, we end up working in pairs. Um, really there's a lot of storytelling, especially if you consider that we dealing with oppression.

[00:17:20] So we would tell stories, well, previous experiences with oppression, and then those stories use drama techniques to get that onto the floor and also, um, being a specialist in improvisation techniques. So, so then we improvise. The eye of the joker is really important when it comes to finally putting this piece together and finding out what the main, you know, the, the main themes come from the group, and then those themes are then unpacked.

[00:17:50] And now the important part, which is really like the, those are the foundation. If I cannot come in with an agenda, so. As a facilitator, I previously worked with the sex workers theater group, um, or now I'm busy. Um, while I teach core skills, such as facilitation techniques to do the second chance parolee theater company.

[00:18:19] So I can’t come in there and say look here let’s deal with what it’s like to be outside of prison now, or let’s tell people why you were in prison, or let's tell people how not to end up in prison. I come to that group and I say, what do you want to talk about? I facilitate, that's why the word facilitator is so important. 

[00:18:40] Wesley: Interesting. That must take a hell of 

[00:18:42] a lot of discipline. I mean, it does sound like a, uh, quite a bit of discipline. And I know not, it's very difficult to work with people and not have an agenda. I think that is, that's pretty, that's pretty hard. So is there, is there, I mean, surely, surely you must have some form of you want the theater to say something or

[00:19:11] I mean or must you go into it completely neutral?

[00:19:17] Delia: no, no, no, Nope. Let's not say I’m neutral at all. The way I'm not neutral is who I choose to work with. Ah,

[00:19:28] The corporates that phone me and hire me, I would ask them, what do you want from me? Do you want to change your workers minds about something? Or do you truly want me to come and find out what your workers, want to say? You see that that's the thing. So, so, so therefore it can cut out certain work. I can basically take any training and facilitate it.

[00:19:53] Um, and I do know people who use theater of the oppressed for corporate education systems and so on.

[00:20:03] So therefore it does put the strain on me when it comes to do you need, do we have the grants? We have the funds who paying for this.

[00:20:16] Wesley: Because they have a big say in the content. In a way, I get you, I get you 

[00:20:20] Delia: Or even if I want to work with a certain group of people, there is no money for those people, you know? So, so it's, it's, it's working in collaboration with NPOs w you know, organizations already set up who see the value of the work I have to bring to that particular group. 

[00:20:38] Wesley: Um, Delia I just want to take a step back with the, um, uh, back to the processes because I understand how you conceptualise sort of how the, the system works, you know, um, where it starts, um, I'm interested in like, Well,...]]>07c66b7d-a0b6-4448-b029-9d6ffd68b156Fri, 10 Sep 2021 09:00:00 +020049:39falsefull6666Candice NolanBlessed Fashion BrandTranscript

[00:00:00] Wesley: Hey greetings everybody. Uh, Wesley pepper here And you're tuned into my podcast Wesley peppers art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Hi everybody. Um, yeah man, thanks to all my new and returning listeners. Welcome to you all. Thanks for coming through. Uh, From different parts of the world, listening to it on different devices.

[00:00:30] Yeah, man. Thanks, man. I really appreciate it. Um, yeah, I did. I love it, man. Thanks for coming through, man. Uh, just a quick recap on last week's episode, um, salute my brother Mpho Nkadimeng. Um, thanks for coming through king. Uh, I really enjoyed, um, Yeah, man. It was really interesting, especially talking about August house.

[00:00:50] Um, how they've um, yeah, I mean, they've cut down on the events and that stuff, that stuff. Um, yo man, the art world is really been given, uh, as, as really. Yeah, well, I've been talking about it consistently. So, you know, we've really been dealt a terrible hand in this pandemic, but, um, no worries like, there's some of us that is trying, we are evolving with the time.

[00:01:13] So it's not all that doom and gloom. It's not great, but yo man, there's a lot of us that's pushing really hard and trying to, and trying to come up with solutions. So the only way you're going to find out on what's happened, what solutions. And how artists are evolving in this post covid world is to tune into Wesley peppers, art lexica, because we feature the freshest dopest talent, across well, actually across the world, but with a special focus on, on, on, on the SADC countries, because.

[00:01:41] Well, we just the best. So that's just how it is. Yeah. Anyway, anyway, uh, moving on to today's episode up. Okay. Just before I get on, like we were actually, I was actually supposed to talk to, um, Skhosana, uh, another friend of mine today, but yo man, Telkom or Eskom there was load shedding and yeah. So we'll be talking to him next week, but I'll tell you a little bit about that in the outro.

[00:02:03] So moving on to today's episode, I'm talking to Banele Skosana he is a fashion designer. Based in Tembisa, and his brand is called blessed clothing. We're going to be unpacking everything. Um, we spoke, uh, on WhatsApp earlier in the week and he was really pumped and really amped to talk about how they been evolving over the, uh, you know, in this post COVID world.

[00:02:26] So definitely looking forward to that so we’re going to be touching on everything about the brand, how it got founded, uh, uh, you know, um, it's design, well, the processes behind its design, uh, and, and, and, and that type of thing, and its demographics. And of course, how, um, they've been evolving in this post covid world, because if there's something, um, I haven't, I haven't actually featured too many.

[00:02:47] Yeah, this is probably the first fashion designer I've got on the show. Um, I'm featuring on this platform, but, um, I mean, and I definitely got my eye on a few more and it's something I've been, I've been wanting to do actually, um, do something, you know, I'm also very, very interested in fashion and I do follow it quite closely.

[00:03:03] So yeah, man, this is going to be really cool for me as well. Just see what these guys are up to man. And, um, yeah man, if you want to know how artists, just another, uh, thing, I think I just need to say there. If you want to know how artists are adapting to this pandemic. There's only one place to listen to that.

[00:03:20] And that's Wesley Pepper’s art lexica. And because yeah, we feature the dopest freshest content in the world, but with a specific eye on the SADC countries. And we want to know, we want to tell the world, like we are not just all. Yeah, sure. COVID is gave us a heavy...]]>Transcript

[00:00:00] Wesley: Hey greetings everybody. Uh, Wesley pepper here And you're tuned into my podcast Wesley peppers art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Hi everybody. Um, yeah man, thanks to all my new and returning listeners. Welcome to you all. Thanks for coming through. Uh, From different parts of the world, listening to it on different devices.

[00:00:30] Yeah, man. Thanks, man. I really appreciate it. Um, yeah, I did. I love it, man. Thanks for coming through, man. Uh, just a quick recap on last week's episode, um, salute my brother Mpho Nkadimeng. Um, thanks for coming through king. Uh, I really enjoyed, um, Yeah, man. It was really interesting, especially talking about August house.

[00:00:50] Um, how they've um, yeah, I mean, they've cut down on the events and that stuff, that stuff. Um, yo man, the art world is really been given, uh, as, as really. Yeah, well, I've been talking about it consistently. So, you know, we've really been dealt a terrible hand in this pandemic, but, um, no worries like, there's some of us that is trying, we are evolving with the time.

[00:01:13] So it's not all that doom and gloom. It's not great, but yo man, there's a lot of us that's pushing really hard and trying to, and trying to come up with solutions. So the only way you're going to find out on what's happened, what solutions. And how artists are evolving in this post covid world is to tune into Wesley peppers, art lexica, because we feature the freshest dopest talent, across well, actually across the world, but with a special focus on, on, on, on the SADC countries, because.

[00:01:41] Well, we just the best. So that's just how it is. Yeah. Anyway, anyway, uh, moving on to today's episode up. Okay. Just before I get on, like we were actually, I was actually supposed to talk to, um, Skhosana, uh, another friend of mine today, but yo man, Telkom or Eskom there was load shedding and yeah. So we'll be talking to him next week, but I'll tell you a little bit about that in the outro.

[00:02:03] So moving on to today's episode, I'm talking to Banele Skosana he is a fashion designer. Based in Tembisa, and his brand is called blessed clothing. We're going to be unpacking everything. Um, we spoke, uh, on WhatsApp earlier in the week and he was really pumped and really amped to talk about how they been evolving over the, uh, you know, in this post COVID world.

[00:02:26] So definitely looking forward to that so we’re going to be touching on everything about the brand, how it got founded, uh, uh, you know, um, it's design, well, the processes behind its design, uh, and, and, and, and that type of thing, and its demographics. And of course, how, um, they've been evolving in this post covid world, because if there's something, um, I haven't, I haven't actually featured too many.

[00:02:47] Yeah, this is probably the first fashion designer I've got on the show. Um, I'm featuring on this platform, but, um, I mean, and I definitely got my eye on a few more and it's something I've been, I've been wanting to do actually, um, do something, you know, I'm also very, very interested in fashion and I do follow it quite closely.

[00:03:03] So yeah, man, this is going to be really cool for me as well. Just see what these guys are up to man. And, um, yeah man, if you want to know how artists, just another, uh, thing, I think I just need to say there. If you want to know how artists are adapting to this pandemic. There's only one place to listen to that.

[00:03:20] And that's Wesley Pepper’s art lexica. And because yeah, we feature the dopest freshest content in the world, but with a specific eye on the SADC countries. And we want to know, we want to tell the world, like we are not just all. Yeah, sure. COVID is gave us a heavy hand, but man, there's some of us that is, that is evolving and we trying man, and um, the only way to know what's happening is to tune into this podcast.

[00:03:41] So yeah, there we go. Good. Okay. So yeah, man, just another thing on the rain here it seems like a still, that's just not going to end, so yeah, just bear with, uh, with the drops in the background, I'm sure it's not too much of a problem for you and yeah. And I will speak to you right after this. 

[00:03:59] spudcaster: baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling.

[00:04:04] This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org. 

[00:04:19] Wesley: okay, man. yo man, uh, just to my listeners having a technical thing here trying to link up the sound but whatever, you know, we, uh, thanks my brother for coming through thanks for the patience man.

[00:04:35] It’s highly appreciated, dog. Let's start it from the beginning, man. Um, just to my listeners, uh, you’re based in Tembisa, but like just give us like a run around like, you know where you exactly. Yeah. Which side of Gauteng you’re from and, um, yeah. 

[00:04:50] Banele: Okay, cool. So, uh, hi everyone including you and the listeners and everyone, it's an honour to be here. So my name is Banele Skosana, I'm based in Tembisa, which is in Johannesburg, you know, so I was born in KwaTema which is Springs, but I was raised in tembisa, this is me.

[00:05:08] And then now, uh, we today, as we here we are gonna talk about the brand, right? Which is the blessed brand, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, so I, to give you a brief background of the Blessed how is started. Yeah, 

[00:05:21] Wesley: yeah, yeah.

[00:05:27] Banele: So we started, like, I started this thing as an idea, you know, it started around 2015. So around 2015, I had an idea of like, I would love to have a brand. So the purpose of me coming in with the word blessed was because of me. I mean, personally, if I can talk about myself, a painter, I'm an artist. Okay. So I'm in professional dancer.

[00:05:49] So I've worked with so many various artists, which are well known, like each year I've worked with, uh, Usher Raymond. We did a global citizen together. I've been to France. You know, I’ve been to France. I’ve been to Scotland. So around also, I've also performed with, uh, I've been a background dancer for PJ powers at UCT, even university, you know, I've also worked with the likes of Masoja Msiza, uh, you know?

[00:06:18] Wesley: Yeah, yeah, yeah, 

[00:06:22] Banele: yeah. On some other company, which I don't think it's. Talk about the company. 

[00:06:29] Wesley: Yeah. I mean, as long as you're not going to slander it and 

[00:06:33] Banele: then mention the name of the company's cost,

[00:06:42] because now it's something else. Yeah.

[00:06:47] Yeah. So it's the, it's the truck company also, you know, so we were working with him. He was in the MC there and we're working with him on that project. So I've, I've traveled around the South Africa. So, you know, I've been to Venda, I've been to Cape town. I've been everywhere. We also did a episode. I don't know if you know about, uh, uh, stumbo stomp amapantsula.

[00:07:09] Me and my crew, which we called fire crew. We won that thing four or five times. Yeah. We won that one, the thing five times, you know, in different episodes, you know, so it was also a good, good platform for us. And then also we did a red bull big battle which was in soweto, you know? And then yeah, we did that twice. Well, you know, so, yeah, so that is, uh, a piece of my background, you know?

[00:07:36] So the name, then I started noticing what's happening around where I'm from, you know, so where I'm from, it's like I'm from the hood. Like we don't have so much, you know, and everybody has a role model. So since I was doing all these great things, people were looking up to me, you know, as a role model, the young ones are coming after me, you know?

[00:07:55] So I've decided that since well, it's like this. People from where I'm from. They don't have so much money to buy certain international brands, if I may say, you know, so I've decided that look, they do want to look cool also, you know, but they don't have that amount to look cool with international brands. You know what I've decided that, okay, I'm going to start something because I'm also rolling, not rolling as such, but I'm also rubbing my shoulder with some of the things with people, you know, as I've mentioned earlier, you know, so if they see, they see some of those people wearing that thing, yeah.

[00:08:33] It's also an influence to them and they might think that thing is cool for them also, you know, because they like to. They like to wear something which has been worn by someone who's famous or something like, you know, so I've decided that I want everybody to feel, like appreciated. And also to know with you, everyone is placed, you know, like regardless of where you from or where you going, you need to appreciate where you are.

[00:09:00] Yeah. Well, first of all, for like, when you wake up one thing, which I've realised, like everyone is blessed even the one who is living on the street, you know, they could be grateful for whatever. Like they woke up in the morning, they breathing, you know, they, they, they have, you know, like they blessed with that, you know, regardless of what they have, they don't have actually, you know what, you have to be blessed and to be who you are, you know?

[00:09:23] So I decided that that, okay. No, since it's, it's going to be like that, then it's going to be happy for people to also have that type of a thing, which is also local, which is like, not far from them, you know, something which is made from someone that they know, you know, someone you can relate to someone you can instead of like wearing something, which is from someone you don't even know anything about who won't be able to even speak to you.

[00:09:49] I don't know if you understand what I mean.

[00:09:53] Wesley: Yeah. I know exactly what you’re saying

[00:09:56] Banele: Something which people could relate to something which is close to people, something which is going to make them inspired, that they all blessed regardless of what they're going through, regardless of what they do, they are also blessed, you know, 

[00:10:11] Wesley: Yeah, sure, sure.

[00:10:15] Um, just give me like, one second do you mind if I just pause this for one second, the recording, I just want to send this guy a text. Yeah, man. I'm just for my listeners sorry man I use my phone as a modem and, um, yeah, well, you know, I had a, um, yeah, sorry about that. But anyway, Banele, as soon as I started to take a step back, there’s actually two things that you spoke of.

[00:10:42] Well at the, especially you start off as a dancer, so the whole uh, a progression of moving from dancing into fashion. That's quite interesting. So, um, um, yeah, well actually I would like to discuss a little bit about that, where you, um, Because you said you regard yourself as an artist. Um, did you always feel, um, one thing I, one thing I know about, about, about artists and in fact, a lot of the people on this platform, um, speak quite and it’s something you either have or you don’t.

[00:11:13] So clearly you did. Was that difficult to, uh, to transition from, from performance-based art into fashion, because it's almost, you know, it's almost on different sides of the world. So, so, so just explain to us, you know, was it, did it come natural to you to, um, to make that transition again?

[00:11:32] Banele: Like okay.

[00:11:35] To be honest, you know, as an artist, you know, first of all, to me as a dancer, you know, when you’re a dancer, like you use like outfits for performing, you know, as an artist, you know, the typos, that type of stuff. So like as an artist, you also need to be aligned with fashion. For me art is aligned with fashion because fashion is, it's always changing.

[00:12:01] You know? So as an artist, you always need to look, look fresh, look presentable, and always like being on point. You know? So for me as an artist, I always did it. When you go to people, you go to perform, you need to look presentable. And when people knew me as a role model to others, when they see you, they need to see you being clean so that they get motivated also to look like you, you know what I mean?

[00:12:25] So for me, Yeah, it's also the same thing, you know, even if you can look, can I talk about what's going on recently now?

[00:12:33] Wesley: please. 

[00:12:34] Banele: For example, example, example, if you can look at, uh, now there's amapiano, right? Amapiano came with a different, different environment. If I can say, you know, it comes with the lifestyle, you know, if you can look the way we were ranked before and.

[00:12:51] How this new generation now they're wearing, it's totally different, you know, and also the artists, you know, before and the artists now they have adapted into this new, more amapiano vibe and how the outside and the lifestyle is being changed, you know? So, so much is changing as an artist. So fashion as an artist is something which is

[00:13:12] hand in hand with art, fashion and art I think it goes together for me and how you wear represents you, you know, it's so me. So my point is that for me, it's like, it's never been. Hard transition for me to translate from art to fashion. It was natural because from there I also had the way of dressing and people would like the way we are dressing

[00:13:38] me and my team, you know, they will be inspired by the way we dress. And there what made me to also be motivated because people, they would like to dress the way we dress, you know? So that also gave me an opinion or so I had influence. You know, without having a brand. So if I can have a brand yeah.

[00:14:01] So it made me to think if I can have a brand, it's going to be something which is going to be come more easier naturally for me, because I'm already into it. 

[00:14:09] Wesley: Yeah. Yeah. Interesting, interesting, interesting. Very, very interesting. So, um, I actually, I get that process out of being natural and like sort of international, you just, you just have to have this thing for fashion and.

[00:14:21] And, you know, as you were saying, hip hop dancers and well, basically every other dance as well. So that's, that's interesting. So, so the fact that you identify your demographic now, um, um, um, um, let's, um, let's go there because for me on all these international stages, I know I've, um, through, uh, through my career, one of the, uh, one of the things that I learned like years ago, man, Yeah, it's always as a creative coming from, coming from the continent, you know, coming from South Africa, is you it's much better, you feel, I guess, I guess more rounded, uh, standing on international stage with your own brand is, you know, as, as opposed to wearing like, you know, some international brand or something, it's, it's like, I guess, I guess it's actually needed more.

[00:15:09] So actually, um, how did you, how did you, uh, or rather what demographics, like, like, did you notice like, okay, yo, these people are looking and I want to design something for these guys. Um, so explain to us a little bit about them, you know, about your demographic. 

[00:15:26] Banele: Cool. So like also when we can, I'm going to speak about some international stuff a bit.

[00:15:34] Yeah. So when we went international, so first one was in France in 2017, you know, um, the experience was, was nice. You know, so all I can say is that I saw that all the prints, which we bought there, because by then the, the brand was still an idea, you know? All things which were wearing from this side and what they were wearing that side was the same one thing, you know?

[00:16:02] And they, there was no difference between us and them, you know? So I've seen a loophole that what if I bring something new to them or something different that could be something nice also to them so that we can also find the differentiation of their cultures and also the different of kind of countries, you know?

[00:16:21] So, and then that's when I've decided, when I come back from Scotland on 29th, January, you know? Yeah. So February that's, when I registered the company, I was serious about it. I was like, you know, because at first I was just doing my producting, producing all these items. Like t-shirts. Hoodies sweaters and everything, but the business was not registered yet, you know, because I was not fully like, convinced that I am really doing this thing, you know, but since I've saw people coming and buying and liking the brand, that's when I decided to, and since, while I was from Scotland, people from Scotland also were liking the thing.

[00:17:00] So they said to me like, yeah, this thing should be made like registered. Like you should take this thing seriously. Also I had like a mentor, like . He's like a mentor to me, and also like somebody who will look up to, so he’s supposed to be the one who helped me to start a business, you know? So for the demographic of that is like, It's really important for us to find our identity, you know, the south Africans for us to understand who we are instead of looking outside for validation, you know, like I believe in that we have great potential in this country.

[00:17:37] You know, we have so much more to offer into the world. . Because that's when I've seen also, including the arts, the way we, our food, everything is like, it's, it's, it's unique, but I, I'm sorry to say this, but we often look up to the people who are out there in other countries for what they doing. Yeah.

[00:18:03] So it's, it's really not nice, you know? And so if we are the leaders and the people who are upfront there and doing that, how about the ones, the young ones who are coming after us, you know, they think that's cool and they fall into that trap. Yeah. And so everyone, as we are going to end up looking into international stuff and not recognising how great we are as our, our countries, our own is our culture.

[00:18:28] You know, as who we are, because I think now it's time for us to embrace who we are, what we capable of, what we can show to the world. That's what I'm trying to do from now. You know, cause after this sprint for me, when I started out, it's like, uh, I wanted to, to do it from local people. You know, you know, it's going to grow national.

[00:18:48] Cause now it's national brand for now. You know, people from Cape Town are showing love. Maybe if we can do an research, you can see also. So people from Cape Town are also showing love people from...]]>f76a1510-219c-46f8-8fb4-d73ee7308248Fri, 03 Sep 2021 09:00:00 +020050:55falsefull6565Candice NolanAugust HouseTranscript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Hey everybody wesley pepper here. And you're tuned into my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yes. Hi everybody. Uh, to all my new and returning listeners. Thank you for everyone for tuning in, you know, Everybody from tuning in, from all over the world on whatever device you're listening to this, uh, broadcast for.

[00:00:29] I'm thinking, man, I highly appreciated, you know, and it's kind of humbling too. Um, yeah, man. So yeah, let's get straight into it, man. Um, recap on last week’s episode, uh, big up thank you so much, so much, to siza nkosi for coming through, um, I really enjoyed speaking to her and I thought we really touched on some.

[00:00:47] Pretty relevant, um, issue, uh, issues, man, and topics. And, um, if you guys wanna know more about it, please, um, um, you can, you can go check out episode 63. It was really, really cool, man. And, um, remember to, um, if you guys want more information on, on, on any of my previous guests, you know, um, and just remember to give me a shout out.

[00:01:06] You know, um, yeah. And I can forward you the information, because I think the artists that we featured on this platform are really speaking to the times that we are living in. You know, I think that's really important from a content creating, uh, from a content creating perspective and, um, yeah, man. So moving on to today's episode today, I'm talking to.

[00:01:28] Uh, an artist based in Pretoria, I'm talking to Mpho Nkadimeng, uh, he's a visual artist. Uh, so he paints he draws, et cetera. Um, we were talking about his processes. Um, he's got some really interesting work, man. He's got a really crazy technique. And we're going to be unpacking that, bit by bit, but then talking about how he's been adapting, you know, to the current climate we're living in, because yeah, I mean guys, and as you know, you know, I've been covering this, uh, uh, topic consistently throughout the whole year and it's becoming a real thing, man.

[00:02:00] It's now woven into our social fabric. Uh, people now, uh, I've actually heard of some crazy shit, man. I've actually heard this week that in the Northern Cape, um, there's a group, there's a church group or group of people that, um, I don't, I can't verify how they got information, but it was either, probably was probably through WhatsApp that these people are drinking.

[00:02:23] Fucking hair peroxide, you know, uh, um, uh, you know, to cure COVID yo man, and, but they won't take the jab in the arm so crazy times, man. Um, yeah, I just, I, to put that on this platform, cause that was the most. Outlandish news. I've heard all year. And it is the 2021. Um, so I'm want to be, so I'm going to be asking you a little bit about that.

[00:02:50] Maybe he added some old, crazy stories and finding out what your perspective is on that, because I think it's very important. Uh, because it's becoming a better, real, a real major, um, major thing. And, um, yeah, man. So look forward to that guys. Um, and I'll talk to you at the end of the, um, you know, in the outro and I'll tell you about future episodes.

[00:03:09] Cause it's really cool stuff coming your way, you know? Um, yeah. So look forward to that and um, yeah guys, um, just don't take hair peroxide, you know, rather get a jab and I'll speak to you, uh, after this. 

[00:03:22] Spudcaster: [00:03:22] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org.

[00:03:40] Wesley: [00:03:40] Okay. Uh, yeah, let's go, man. How you doing? 

[00:03:46]...]]>Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Hey everybody wesley pepper here. And you're tuned into my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yes. Hi everybody. Uh, to all my new and returning listeners. Thank you for everyone for tuning in, you know, Everybody from tuning in, from all over the world on whatever device you're listening to this, uh, broadcast for.

[00:00:29] I'm thinking, man, I highly appreciated, you know, and it's kind of humbling too. Um, yeah, man. So yeah, let's get straight into it, man. Um, recap on last week’s episode, uh, big up thank you so much, so much, to siza nkosi for coming through, um, I really enjoyed speaking to her and I thought we really touched on some.

[00:00:47] Pretty relevant, um, issue, uh, issues, man, and topics. And, um, if you guys wanna know more about it, please, um, um, you can, you can go check out episode 63. It was really, really cool, man. And, um, remember to, um, if you guys want more information on, on, on any of my previous guests, you know, um, and just remember to give me a shout out.

[00:01:06] You know, um, yeah. And I can forward you the information, because I think the artists that we featured on this platform are really speaking to the times that we are living in. You know, I think that's really important from a content creating, uh, from a content creating perspective and, um, yeah, man. So moving on to today's episode today, I'm talking to.

[00:01:28] Uh, an artist based in Pretoria, I'm talking to Mpho Nkadimeng, uh, he's a visual artist. Uh, so he paints he draws, et cetera. Um, we were talking about his processes. Um, he's got some really interesting work, man. He's got a really crazy technique. And we're going to be unpacking that, bit by bit, but then talking about how he's been adapting, you know, to the current climate we're living in, because yeah, I mean guys, and as you know, you know, I've been covering this, uh, uh, topic consistently throughout the whole year and it's becoming a real thing, man.

[00:02:00] It's now woven into our social fabric. Uh, people now, uh, I've actually heard of some crazy shit, man. I've actually heard this week that in the Northern Cape, um, there's a group, there's a church group or group of people that, um, I don't, I can't verify how they got information, but it was either, probably was probably through WhatsApp that these people are drinking.

[00:02:23] Fucking hair peroxide, you know, uh, um, uh, you know, to cure COVID yo man, and, but they won't take the jab in the arm so crazy times, man. Um, yeah, I just, I, to put that on this platform, cause that was the most. Outlandish news. I've heard all year. And it is the 2021. Um, so I'm want to be, so I'm going to be asking you a little bit about that.

[00:02:50] Maybe he added some old, crazy stories and finding out what your perspective is on that, because I think it's very important. Uh, because it's becoming a better, real, a real major, um, major thing. And, um, yeah, man. So look forward to that guys. Um, and I'll talk to you at the end of the, um, you know, in the outro and I'll tell you about future episodes.

[00:03:09] Cause it's really cool stuff coming your way, you know? Um, yeah. So look forward to that and um, yeah guys, um, just don't take hair peroxide, you know, rather get a jab and I'll speak to you, uh, after this. 

[00:03:22] Spudcaster: [00:03:22] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org.

[00:03:40] Wesley: [00:03:40] Okay. Uh, yeah, let's go, man. How you doing? 

[00:03:46] Mpho: [00:03:46] I'm good, bro. How’s it?

[00:03:48] Wesley: [00:03:48] Yeah, man. Uh, I always tell my listeners it's never a black and white line with me.

[00:04:02] I’m okay but I’m not really okay. Just a little bit of both. Um, and I’ve been having actually an absolutely crazy, um, anyway, uh, so let's just jump into, uh, like it's just, COVID COVID-19 stories is blowing my mind. I'm getting more everyday. I'm getting one more crazy, like really fucking crazy stories. And, um, Yeah. And then I'm also, I'm also making art as well. So I'm working on this new technique man and it’s not coming together

[00:04:31] every time I think it is. You know? Um, so, um, yeah,

[00:04:46] but anyway, uh, my brother, um, tell us a little bit about your background. Um, and I know you can like you and your studio there, so, uh, yeah. Tell my listeners a little bit about, uh, you know, where did you start off art and that type of thing and we'll take it from there.

[00:05:08] Mpho: [00:05:08] Um,

[00:05:12] how I started with art basically I went to school in PTA. Um, , that's basically the first time I’d actually been in contact with artists. Before then I was just drawing and I was just doing all that stuff, um, when I was at home. That was in Mpumalanga, uh, but the reason why I thought. Is because I was always in isolation, isolated myself because, well, there were social situation that really couldn’t 

[00:05:59] allow me to be part of the younger kids growing up. So I just, um, found, um, consolation in art. I just found a friend, um, So after matric, um, I started by passing university and 2012

[00:06:27] that's when I left and I had a two man show in the Pretoria Art Museum. Um, it was okay. Um, in 2013 and 2014 and 2015 it was really tough, um, that was actually when my life was upside down,

[00:06:57] I had to go ask for a place to live

[00:07:03] from a few friends. So basically I've been squatting in different. Um, So like 2014 and 2015. 2016 I got a job at a retail store. Um, but from, uh, from 2014, from 2016, up until 2020 when I was working at, uh, that retail store, but then I never actually stopped producing art each and every time when I come back from work. I start off with art I just continue working basically up until three or four in the morning.

[00:07:45] I have to be at work again. Yeah. 

[00:07:50] Wesley: [00:07:50] Yeah, man. Um, just a few things that I've picked up on what you said. Um, and I think it resonates with, um, that resonates with all my guests. Um, Yeah. Um, there was just a bit of a break now in, um, in what, uh, in what we're doing, um, 

[00:08:10] Mpho

[00:08:10] Wesley: [00:08:10] actually is based in his studio he actually had people coming in asking

[00:08:15] to have his work in one of their music videos or in a music video is actually quite interesting. So that's actually something I'm active. Yes. Talking about a little bit later to see where is the studio based? Because you know, like at like an August house, there's so many other of our studios, that's kind of the setup,

[00:08:39] you know, we'll talk about that later, but it's really cool. Yeah, man. That was, that was pretty. That was exciting.

[00:08:54] Yeah. Like, uh, want to touch base on that. So that's like where you are, like, where's your studio and that type of thing. But before we get there and let's just take a few steps back then you were saying earlier, How about you? Um, sort of being very isolated growing up. Um, that's a narrative. I mean, basically every one of my guests has a very similar upbringing, um, I think it’s really interesting that most creatives I know I think myself included

[00:09:29] that, um, isolation or feeling isolated, you know, that our energy just doesn't resonates with, with people. That's just a consistent thing, bro. Like, uh, and I think. You know, the more and more, especially that I’ve been talking about it more and more on this platform I think one must actually look into that man

[00:09:50] from a different perspective, from a possibly a psychological perspective. Just other academic perspective. Because I think it resonates with every dope ass artist man. That feeling of

[00:10:03] you just don't resonate with everybody. You just don't.

[00:10:15] Yeah.

[00:10:21] Mpho: [00:10:21] Okay. A lot of my friends, um, and all of them, they've got like different stories to tell about their upbringing. I just find that their stories and my story, they are similar, um, in sort of a way. Um, most of them that grew up either in isolation or they grew up, um, you know, problematic, um, environment and a way to run away from it.

[00:10:53] Um, so yeah, I just found it quite um, interesting. That they face problems

[00:11:01] And they run away from, they don't actually run away. They, they find solace in art. 

[00:11:11] Wesley: [00:11:11] Yeah, no, that's true. And that also musicians and everybody, um, you were saying early on, like eventually, like you got this, you know, this part time job

[00:11:32] like you were drawing in your spare time. That’s also something that I find very interesting because I know to do that is actually. I think that's actually a talent on its own because once you’re sucked up into a job, you know, the reason why its 9-5 is to sort of stop any creativity from manifesting after work because you’re tired

[00:11:51] And you've got other things to do so in order to so like switch it on and switch it off, I think that's also something. So, um, just, just, um, do you think that that system of you being able to, uh, To balance. I think all of that, you know, you could work for something that is not creative at all

[00:12:16] so it had its own politics to come home to sort of centre yourself and then get back into the, can you just explain to me that process over there. Do you still use a similar discipline

[00:12:28] in your work today?

[00:12:29] Mpho: [00:12:29] Yeah. I still use that discipline, although, um, back then it wasn’t a matter of balance

[00:12:39] um, It was just havoc like emotionally mentally, everything was just a mess

[00:12:51] and I could not sleep without, or I could not feel better without creating art. Well in a way for me to find conflict. So, um, I would wake up at seven. I wake up, I take a bus and then I have to be at work at seven and I knock off at 4. Probably sometimes I knock off at seven o’clock. And my ju I walk to work. So when I get back, you know I’m just so stressed, Um, I’m just you know, drowning in a whole lot of emotions and all I want to do create is create an art work.

[00:13:41] Um, cause I know like, um,

[00:13:46] it was like, I have a friend that I can tell how I'm feeling too, you know? So,

[00:14:03] so, yeah. Um, that's 

[00:14:09] Wesley: [00:14:09] Interesting

[00:14:12] Mpho: [00:14:12] what happened in that process was because I got used to working at night. Um, even today that I'm not, I'm no longer working at that retail store. Uh, I can only work from 9 o’clock or 7 o’clock until, um, in the morning or until 5 or 6 in the morning but during the day I can’t do, you know, my work.

[00:14:42] Wesley: [00:14:42] That's interesting. That's super interesting. Um, um, just before I actually want to take that point a little bit further, uh, but just before we get there, what, what, what type of art will you be creating? So I would assume they were drawings right or mixed media. And what was the subject matter

[00:15:07] Mpho: [00:15:07] The subject matter was basically depression

[00:15:12] Finding solace in the work. So I would, create an artwork that actually, that I can have a conversation with the canvass and every time it leaves me whole

[00:15:23] dealing with me. Um, So, um, yeah, there were times where I just create pretty artworks beautiful artworks, but

[00:15:38] in most cases I’m about what I am going through, what I am facing, because sometimes my, my palms just come crashing down my brain, you know? Have all those emotions. I need to talk to someone about them and I just use my artworks. So in most case it’s all about uplifting myself. Or uplifting other people cause it’s tough out there

[00:16:14] unemployment,

[00:16:19] you know, everything though. People are just having a tough time. They've got nothing. They've got no one to talk to about all those. Yeah. So everyone is just in the same situation

[00:16:39] Wesley: [00:16:39] interesting stuff that you're saying there, man. And I want to. Yo, uh, firstly, firstly, I started,

[00:16:49] um, off sort of working out. I think that's actually quite a, that's a, that's a possibly I know, I know it's a skill. I'm not sure what but I know its a hectic skill. Myself I can I can relate to that myself as well. Um, especially in my early twenties. I, I did, uh, I did a similar thing where all the shit in my head and making sure that I feel so, um, that's actually quite beautiful, and I know, with other artists.

[00:17:23] And I know, I know there's a saying that goes, you know, you can only make art through pain or something like that. I know a lot of. You know, even, even though it's a heavy topic and it's very personal, which is another layer to it. But like I know there's also a lot of beauty, a lot of beauty can come out of that more as an aesthetic and just how other people see it because people also love seeing inside an artist’s soul.

[00:17:51] They, they, they get some form of comfort out of it. So that actually has another process, which is very interesting. But, um, I don't want to dwell too much on that because there’s a bunch of other things, That's a beautiful,

[00:18:07] um, you were saying like, um, which I also find interesting is that like you work at night, so I know of many creatives that can be the opposite.

[00:18:27] Yeah, I’m productive in the day. Day time is my time

[00:18:32] Mpho: [00:18:32] I think it's about how you, um, you know, how you got your system to be, to get you to a certain method or a certain schedule or routine

[00:18:52] Yeah, because where my studio is

[00:18:58] it's two people. Wow. Okay. Can you hold on a bit?

[00:19:09] Wesley: [00:19:09] Yeah.

[00:19:12] Mpho: [00:19:12] I’m sorry about that. So, um,

[00:19:16] It's me and others who actually work at night. And I know that, you know, when we meet somewhere around seven or eight at night, Like on the hallway, um, go like ja, the nightshift is starting now and, you know,

[00:19:42] four or five o'clock in the, um, in the morning I see his lights go off or he's

[00:19:51] knocking off time. Um, time to rest and then from there 10 o’clock or so we wake up, we go about,

[00:20:03] Wesley: [00:20:03] uh, your sound

[00:20:07] Um, yeah, yeah.

[00:20:11] Uh, just for my listeners tell me where is your studio based? 

[00:20:13] Mpho: [00:20:13] August House in Johannesburg.

[00:20:35] Wesley: [00:20:35] Oh August House! Mmm, Mmm. Mmm. Yeah. I've collaborated with artists there. Um,

[00:20:55] yeah. Yeah. I know August House well. Let's talk a little bit about that. Um, Yeah, as I say it’s in the Joburg CBD, um, it's, uh, it's an artist studio sort of hub and the set up these artists can live and work or sleep in their studios around the city and like what happened. You know, people walk in and out of artist studios while they work and stuff like that.

[00:21:32] So it's also as a commercial element to it. So, um, yeah. Tell us about your experience there bro, How long have you been at August House?

[00:21:41] yeah.

[00:21:50] Mpho: [00:21:50] Being at August House is it’s okay. Having a studio is one of the greatest achievements of my art career basically.

[00:21:56] Um,

[00:22:00] because I think when you've got, when you're not working from home, when you're not working from your room, you get the freedom to explore, however you want. You've got no limits. Um, so when I got here, uh, I just realised that my mindset actually changed. I'm more open, you know, I can just think of something and do it, or I can just try to do something while I'm doing it.

[00:22:36] Um, I see a loophole

[00:22:43] to something, and then from there I run with it as well

[00:22:52] and my artworks have drastically changed since I got here. 

[00:22:54] Wesley: [00:22:54] how long have you been at August House?

[00:23:03] Mpho: [00:23:03] Yeah, I've got a year. I've got a year now. 

[00:23:08] Wesley: [00:23:08] Okay. Um, what part of the building are your studios are you at the bottom are you at the top?

[00:23:22] Mpho: [00:23:22] um, it’s the north wing and it’s third floor, um, studio number is studio 10.

[00:23:34] Wesley: [00:23:34] Okay. Um, so, um, like that’s interesting you say you’ve been there since July that’s since the pandemic started because

[00:23:46] one of the, one of the, one of the things that, um, agh that these developers did with August House and with other

[00:23:57] art studios there in theory me I’m very critical about it but I don’t think I’ll express those views because other cats from august house will most probably listen to this.

[00:24:10] Uh, yeah. Yeah. Anyway. Um, but I know that the developers wanted well

[00:24:20] in theory, it was for artists and their potential market or their demographic. To actually physically meet and have this energy

[00:24:29] You know, so, um, I know that, um, so I think I explained to my listeners, so yeah.

[00:24:50] Like, how has the COVID protocol changed that? So like these guests that came in earlier on,  were they wearing masks, let’s start off there

[00:25:00] Mpho: [00:25:00] yeah, no one entered the building without a mask, and, um, there’s a sanitiser near the elevator. So basically when you enter through the door, you are faced with an elevator, and you will see a sanitiser over there before you even, press the button or do anything you're going to have to sanitise first. And there's, um, there's a guy called Calvin he’s always downstairs and make sure that it’s safe basically, um,

[00:25:41] say if from whatever. 

[00:25:43] Wesley: [00:25:43] Has there been, has there been,...]]>921469d1-f627-4dd3-bb0f-a7e1a4242d31Tue, 31 Aug 2021 09:00:00 +020045:51falsefull6464Candice NolanHouse of SizaTranscript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Hey, greeting everybody. Uh  and you're tuned into my podcast Wesley peppers, art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Uh, before we get started, um, just a big up to Jowahri Hlophe for coming through last week. Thanks my sister. It was really fun speaking to her. Uh, we'll definitely be keeping in touch with regards to, botaki magazine, um, is a really interesting initiative.

[00:00:30] Um, and you know, like I said, let's, it's pretty interesting. And then we'll see how it goes, man. We'll definitely be having her on in possibly two months time or so. Um, so keep your ears out for that. Uh, remember the art giveaway is up for grabs. Uh, remember it's still only available for my south African based listeners and it’s a money thing, it's a money thing.

[00:00:51] Uh, I, yeah, I say that every week, but remember all you have to do is like, subscriber or comment on this kind of episode and you can win yourself an original artwork done by myself. And, yeah. So moving on to today's episode. We're talking to the beautiful Siza Nkosi. We are recording live in her offices in her office

[00:01:08] here at the Sol Plaatjie university in Kimberley. And, um, she's very excited, so I'm glad to have her, uh, here, with me today. Um, so we're gonna be talking about, um, well, three things in general. Um, we were talking about her writing, of course. Um, I know she's involved with the Poetry Africa coming up pretty soon. Um, and, um, she's like creative or she's a lecturer at the university.

[00:01:29] So we touched base a little bit about it's about the academic side of. The writing world, I guess, post COVID. Um, talk about, um, there's a, there's also a touching thing for people coming in to Kimberly about the Sol Plaatjie brand. So it's kind of a, I don't want to give too much away. So I'm just going to ask her that straight up before we start or rather, when we start.

[00:01:48] So, and we, you're talking a little bit about, uh, uh, uh, her company house of siza and her projects and what she's up to and all of that. So look forward to, that's going to be really cool, man. Uh, and like I said, we are recording live. Um, so its actually my second one in 63 episodes, so that's really cool.

[00:02:05] Um, yeah. So anyway, um, remember, I'll speak to you after this. 

[00:02:11] spudcaster: [00:02:11] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcast your life with baobulb.org. 

[00:02:29] Wesley: [00:02:29] Okay. Uh, Siza Nkosi. Uh, welcome.

[00:02:32] Siza: [00:02:32] Thank you for having me Wesley. Hello everybody

[00:02:36] Wesley: [00:02:36] Yeah. Thanks for coming through, man. Yeah, let's get, let's get straight into it, man. Um, so just to everybody, just to create a scene, um, we are sitting in your office at the sol plaatjie, uh, university, university of Sol Plaatjie. Um, we spoke a little bit of a, um, actually you, um, oh, was, do you want to do the poem now?

[00:03:00] Siza: [00:03:00] I don't know. Um, let’s talk. 

[00:03:04] Wesley: [00:03:04] Yeah, absolutely. Listeners like she actually, just read, like a very, very beautiful piece just before we started. I just thought it would be really cool to have it on the show too. So yeah. Anyway, uh, now as, as we spoke, like a bit of air man, which is something.

[00:03:19] So my parents is from here. I grew up here. Um, you know, it's very much I still regard this place as home. Um, Those, um, the names sol plaatjie, I think as a...]]>Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Hey, greeting everybody. Uh  and you're tuned into my podcast Wesley peppers, art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Uh, before we get started, um, just a big up to Jowahri Hlophe for coming through last week. Thanks my sister. It was really fun speaking to her. Uh, we'll definitely be keeping in touch with regards to, botaki magazine, um, is a really interesting initiative.

[00:00:30] Um, and you know, like I said, let's, it's pretty interesting. And then we'll see how it goes, man. We'll definitely be having her on in possibly two months time or so. Um, so keep your ears out for that. Uh, remember the art giveaway is up for grabs. Uh, remember it's still only available for my south African based listeners and it’s a money thing, it's a money thing.

[00:00:51] Uh, I, yeah, I say that every week, but remember all you have to do is like, subscriber or comment on this kind of episode and you can win yourself an original artwork done by myself. And, yeah. So moving on to today's episode. We're talking to the beautiful Siza Nkosi. We are recording live in her offices in her office

[00:01:08] here at the Sol Plaatjie university in Kimberley. And, um, she's very excited, so I'm glad to have her, uh, here, with me today. Um, so we're gonna be talking about, um, well, three things in general. Um, we were talking about her writing, of course. Um, I know she's involved with the Poetry Africa coming up pretty soon. Um, and, um, she's like creative or she's a lecturer at the university.

[00:01:29] So we touched base a little bit about it's about the academic side of. The writing world, I guess, post COVID. Um, talk about, um, there's a, there's also a touching thing for people coming in to Kimberly about the Sol Plaatjie brand. So it's kind of a, I don't want to give too much away. So I'm just going to ask her that straight up before we start or rather, when we start.

[00:01:48] So, and we, you're talking a little bit about, uh, uh, uh, her company house of siza and her projects and what she's up to and all of that. So look forward to, that's going to be really cool, man. Uh, and like I said, we are recording live. Um, so its actually my second one in 63 episodes, so that's really cool.

[00:02:05] Um, yeah. So anyway, um, remember, I'll speak to you after this. 

[00:02:11] spudcaster: [00:02:11] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcast your life with baobulb.org. 

[00:02:29] Wesley: [00:02:29] Okay. Uh, Siza Nkosi. Uh, welcome.

[00:02:32] Siza: [00:02:32] Thank you for having me Wesley. Hello everybody

[00:02:36] Wesley: [00:02:36] Yeah. Thanks for coming through, man. Yeah, let's get, let's get straight into it, man. Um, so just to everybody, just to create a scene, um, we are sitting in your office at the sol plaatjie, uh, university, university of Sol Plaatjie. Um, we spoke a little bit of a, um, actually you, um, oh, was, do you want to do the poem now?

[00:03:00] Siza: [00:03:00] I don't know. Um, let’s talk. 

[00:03:04] Wesley: [00:03:04] Yeah, absolutely. Listeners like she actually, just read, like a very, very beautiful piece just before we started. I just thought it would be really cool to have it on the show too. So yeah. Anyway, uh, now as, as we spoke, like a bit of air man, which is something.

[00:03:19] So my parents is from here. I grew up here. Um, you know, it's very much I still regard this place as home. Um, Those, um, the names sol plaatjie, I think as a brand, as I, if you look at the brand as, as, as, as what it represents, I think it’s taken a real bit of a dip of late, um, that's fine. Enough. The university is directly opposite to the municipality, which bears the same name and.

[00:03:46] I mean it's bad. Potholes, water cuts uh, people in, in, in the sol plaatjie municipality, uh, don't associate sol plaatjie with the man with the writer. Uh, yeah. What's your thoughts on that, man?

[00:04:01] Siza: [00:04:01] Well, I think it's, it all has to do with the history, the wrong history that people were given, because I find that people don't even know who sol plaatjie was.

[00:04:12] Because those are things that are not taught in school, for example, because it would mean that people learn about, you know, who they are and where they come from and how great they are. So it, and it's very ironic, ironic then that all those heroes, I mean, even Robert Sobukwe he's, his office is supposed to be a museum.

[00:04:33] Like you would cry if you were to see this, as opposed to, as opposed to maybe Cecil John Rhodes down the road, you know, even the statue it’s nicely protected, sol plaatjie statue is right there, but it is vandalized. It is not looking clean. So I think it has to do a lot with that history, a very set history.

[00:04:53] Wesley: [00:04:53] Yeah. Yeah. That one actually it cuts deep man. Um, it that's, it that's the, but I don't want to talk about service delivery. I think. Um, yeah, like I said, it cuts deep, uh, because currently there's actually no water in certain parts of Kimberley and. Yeah. Anyway. So to note, service delivery is nightmare, I think, is really messing up the brand.

[00:05:14] Siza: [00:05:14] And, you know, it’s so ironic also wes, if you don't mind me saying that this place is where we find the biggest diamond, the biggest man hole is found here in the big hole in kimberley. But trust me with all that gold and mineral and wealth. Kimberly can’t even afford to have streets that don't have potholes. It feels like the city in a, you know, hole because we have the biggest hole in the world.

[00:05:43] here everything is just sunk in. They can imagine the poverty drug abuse etcetra, which is, it is what it is, you know? Yeah. 

[00:05:56] Wesley: [00:05:56] It cuts deep actually, um, yeah, and this has a lot of great talent to come from this part, including myself. Of course dammit 

[00:06:07] Siza: [00:06:07] Including sol plaatjie by the way, the guy who wrote an English novel, you know, an activist, the founder, of the ANC.

[00:06:16] A language activist. He was an international guy. He setswana fashionable, you know, globally in England and London and America, he spoke, you know, and we don't know that. 

[00:06:30] Wesley: [00:06:30] Yeah. And the cycil John rhodes statue and queen Victoria, uh, which is directly opposite him, is still standing and nobody touches them.

[00:06:37] So. That type of thing actually.

[00:06:47] um, I know that you are a, uh, at the university and you're doing creative writing. Um, we spoke a little bit off, air, and in our private time about certain things to do with the creative, right. We, as we, as, as we know, we're sitting in a post, a COVID world, um, I know that from a visual art perspective, uh, artists, work hasn’t, really taken a sombre tone, but there's definitely more serious tones reflected in, in, in, in, in work produced, especially in 20, uh, 2021, uh, and galleries.

[00:07:17] I know my gallery, we had a bit of a debate about it, about that same thing. Tell me about a little bit about the writing. What are the students writing about?  what, what are you students writing about? uh, what are they, what is the influences? Why are they coming here and what are you teaching them?

[00:07:32] Siza: [00:07:32] No, honestly, I haven't taught creative writing yet.

[00:07:36] I've been teaching the, the, the English literature. I've been teaching English for the past two years, two to three years. And so what I can say from that perspective that the students are shocked. We decided to make the curriculum very black full of pride, you know, like very south African, very relatable in terms of language and backgrounds, you know?

[00:08:02] So we chose a kind of authors, like Don Matera, we chose black authors, we chose white authors, um, antjie krog for example, Who cause we wanted to embrace diversity, but bring the literature back home so that the students can relate. But when you bring up issues or books like Sello duiker’s thirteen cents, you know, it's quite graphic.

[00:08:29] It's very reflective of even their society because also in Kimberly, we are surrounded by street kids and the book is about them. I don't know, it was very heavy to the students. They couldn't really handle it. So it was very uncomfortable. And remember, there's no reading culture in general, there's not really culture.

[00:08:54] So the literature shocked them. Others took it very personally. Like the breathing was intense at some point, but yeah. That's what the role of literature is. That's why writers write to reflect, to make you see what you don't want to accept and what you see. And, you know, Oblivious to it. It's just like a shock, but in terms of what they are interested in, I'm not sure yet I won't be that person, but like after our classes, we, we get to understand why a decolonization is important.

[00:09:27] Why, you know, black pride is important because we want them to see themselves to see themselves and just be themselves so that they can contribute to the world. And that's the only way. 

[00:09:40] Wesley: [00:09:40] Hmm. Interesting. Um, I actually want to unpack the whole black pride, uh, but more on your writing, but we'll get to that.

[00:09:48] Uh, another question about the, about the students here. So, you know, we sitting in a very, you know, I know the education system has taken a bit of a knock . I know a lot of institutions have restructured the. Everything. Um, yeah, how's that? How's that impacted you and the university? 

[00:10:09] Siza: [00:10:09] Sjoe. Ja no it's been hectic because. Uh, with that and remembering the dynamics of this province in particular, you, of accessibility.

[00:10:19] And then we don't have water you were just saying. Imagine then having to make sure you have data. Oh, wow.  it. It's like, it's been a very strange thing, but the university made sure that most of the, all the students as much as possible. Had access to data and laptops to work from home, but then still with that, the challenges that we got were like now the students are not at a institution.

[00:10:49] They're at home and home is its own dynamics. The screaming in the background, the baby crying. So the challenge is, which is what we are trying. And I think students are also doing their things. 

[00:11:02] Wesley: [00:11:02] How has that reflected in the, in the, in the, in the students results in the academic results for last year?

[00:11:13] Siza: [00:11:13] Um, I'm not sure of the stats, I don't want to lie. I don't like to lie, but what I can say through my observations, the students who improve are the ones that really want to, because you do find a student who is in their worst situation. Like, you know, who's going through the most in life, really coming out really strong.

[00:11:34] Some of us have to, there's no library in my community. So I can't even ask anyone English is so difficult, my God. But at the end of the year, they, they. They, they do. Great. It's amazing. 

[00:11:49] Wesley: [00:11:49] I don't know if you good to answer this question because I think it's maybe let me just give it some perspective.

[00:11:56] Uh, so a lot of my guests on the show and I, and I, and I, and I repeat that, or I try to repeat it in most episodes. Is that creative people like nobody, nobody says, yo, I'm going to be an artist one day. And I’m going to make so much money. You know, you either are one or you’re not one, they have it.

[00:12:11] It's it's, it's been black and white. There's no gray. So I mean like, um, if, uh, if, if, if, if, if a student is coming as you say from, from, from, from, from an area that might not always have a library. And if they do have a library, the library's usually very poorly managed and the catalog is usually outdated.

[00:12:28] It's uh, so do you think that the. In a post COVID world that this is going to be more or less of these writers, because it's interesting. How, in the past few months, how people have been viewing creative work or creative people work in the industry, has there been, can you comment on that? 

[00:12:47] Siza: [00:12:47] You know, for me, I actually hope that, uh, creative writing will be even more.

[00:12:52] Embraced in this hybrid system of things, physical and spending time online. I think I see this also as an opportunity for growth in that space, in terms of how do I also support present my work, like in a, in a three minute video or whatever these things that they do with the visuals online to sell the products.

[00:13:14] How do I then make my work accessible? You know, and also just still keeping to the integrity of the work and how I’d like it in a book. Of course, I think that. Both worlds can exist post COVID. Um, and yeah, and it shouldn't be done that way, 

[00:13:33] Wesley: [00:13:33] uh, we just had a mini interruption here. But anyways, yes like, you can continue, 

[00:13:38] Siza: [00:13:38] but, but like, I think that both worlds can definitely co-exist because like, for example, since I moved to the Northern Cape from Gauteng, I've been a doing these collaborations with a band in Joburg, Soweto

[00:13:52] And we have been doing, you know, gigs online and physically as well, so that the art grows. And actually this is an opportunity to even make your work, known to a writer already. 

[00:14:06] Wesley: [00:14:06] That's interesting. Um, From from everybody who I've been speaking to is, definitely. Uh, one of the most consistent themes across all my guests has been that, especially with the, the, the, the, the, the first part of last year.

[00:14:19] So, so between March, April, May before it started getting really cold. Uh, was actually quite a productive period for a lot of artists because they went back into the studios. Um, everything was quiet, they could reflect, and they've been producing a hell of a lot of work

[00:14:32] Siza: [00:14:32] and, and, and, and like beautiful work, deep, Joh cos COVID made you think about yourself.

[00:14:40] Like you, you had to just rediscover yourself in a new light, when you forced into a corner to really reflect and. That's the goal, right. When you're able to create your art from the truest part of yourself, whether it's painful or glorious or happy or sexual sensual. 

[00:15:01] Wesley: [00:15:01] Yeah. All of the above. All of the above, for sure. Uh, I've definitely noticed that, uh, this was a trend that I noticed towards the end of last year.

[00:15:11] Um, and. Yeah, coming into the beginning. Part of the year, on that productive element, a lot of artists have also is able to be sort of more reflective and having more just time to think and to centre oneself. Uh, there's also been a shift towards sort of a spirituality or a deeper understanding of spirituality.

[00:15:32] Um, I've picked it up in poetry, more so than music and visual art. Um, I in fact, yeah. Anyway, I wanted to give you an example, but I've picked up that themes. Yeah. What, what do you have to say about that? 

[00:15:49] Siza: [00:15:49] I just think that, um, a lot of people are like, they've woken up from a lot, a lot, you know, like I think this is the time when people want to find out who they are.

[00:16:03] And obviously that means that. Means that they will experience all of these emotions. You know, they will hear they are calling if they come. I don't know, but I just think that it's that time of, of being alive, where people are just going back to their centre. And that is a very hectic project.

[00:16:22] Yeah. It's brings out a whole lot of issues, you know, um, mentally, emotionally. 

[00:16:29] Wesley: [00:16:29] Sometimes those issues are not the nicest. They, yeah. It's it's it's it's 

[00:16:38] Siza: [00:16:38] but also you asked me about like the role, like the trend in poetry, right? Yeah. I can tell you that just on what we talking about now, the improvement.

[00:16:48] Like, I think this generation of writers has got a very strong voice and a unique voice in poetry in poetry right now. I mean, there are a lot of sites and people like Tim house, uh, smo, vangi, gangi you know? Yeah. Voices. I think, they are very hectic

[00:17:10] Wesley: [00:17:10] yeah,

[00:17:15] Siza: [00:17:15] people like. Yeah. 

[00:17:18] Wesley: [00:17:18] Just for the listeners like in South Africa, when we say hectic, it's not necessarily a bad thing, it's usually a good thing, but not always a good thing. It's a little bit of both, but mostly a good thing. 

[00:17:29] Siza: [00:17:29] And speaking on that, let me share this poem, please. Um, it has a Zulu title thought it's Buhle Tula which translates

[00:17:37] It's good to keep quiet. my mom didn't sleep. My mom and I didn't sleep at all last night, we sang at.  decided to guide the prayer meeting. Both my brothers were out there only, God knows their phones were switched off. We calmed our spirits down mum. And I showed me a way in a new way of kneading the scones dough.

[00:18:09] My first born managed the oven while we went out hunting for sharp knives. I found an ou Kapi sharpened it by the kitchen steps. my last born looked miserable. Mama. Did you see that? There's a goat in the bathroom? Yes. Love. Do you need to use the toilet? Are you scared of the goat? No, mama. It's just that the poor goats didn't make a mess, but here you are you and Gogo are busy sharpening your knives.

[00:18:40] I chuckled and said something in response and went on with my life fetched a bowl to place the heart and liver. The men arrived after midnight, after the wind allowed the fire to burn just as we've got off our knees. Oh, I hands red with animal blood. Yeah. I think that's what it is Wes also the spirituality thing.

[00:19:07] I think now we have the freedom to really express. Cause remember here I’m talking about slaughtering your goats for example, as part of the ceremony with this, this narrative takes takes, you know, it's not shameful, I'm...]]>9531a725-cd13-4366-a243-053374a9e842Fri, 13 Aug 2021 08:00:00 +020045:22falsefull6363Candice NolanBotaki MagazineIn this week's Art Lexica, Wesley sits down with multi-disciplined creative director and curator, Jowahri Hlophe. Wesley focusses in on her networks in South Africa, Botaki magazine and creative work in general.

Transcript

Wesley Pepper: [00:00:00] Hey greetings everybody, uh, Wesley Pepper, uh, and you’re tuned into my podcast Wesley Pepper’s Art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Greetings, everybody, uh, to all my new and returning listeners. Welcome. Welcome. Welcome one. Welcome all thanks for tuning into today's episode. Uh, lets just start with a recap on last week.

[00:00:29] Uh, thanks to my brother Zama for coming through. It was really a blessing, it was really cool speaking to him and, uh, Yeah. And it's really cool. Talking about is a, about water and lights I hope you guys support the brother. You know, if you are interested in knowing more about the book on how to get hold of it, I mean, you can always see it on the social media pages, or you can just give me a shout and I will definitely forward you, his details.

[00:00:53] Yeah, man, big up to that, man. Um, so it's really exciting talking about, about a poet that actually put a physical book together because, you know, as in last week’s episode I mentioned, you know, that doesn't happen too much over the past or pretty much since the pandemic has started. Yeah. I mean, I just remember that the art giveaway is still up for grabs, you know, just like subscribe or comment to this current episode and you can win an artwork done by yours truly.

[00:01:13] And remember. Still only available for, uh, subscribers based in South Africa and that's as a, well, this is a money thing. So yeah. Anyway, uh, moving on, um, today's episode, I'm talking to a really, really cool lady. We're talking to Jowahri Hlophe. Uh, uh, California she's actually based from, or, uh, she's from California in, uh, in the United States, but she's actually now finally, uh, made a full-on move to South Africa.

[00:01:40] So welcome to South Africa, my sister. Um, so Jowahri is a very, very interesting, uh, sister and she's a, uh, a creative director. A curator, a real, just creative entrepreneur. I think that's quite a, I think that pretty much captures everything. Um, and she's done and she worked with a whole host of, uh, artists, uh, both locally and abroad.

[00:02:04] And I know that. Uh, being based here she's, uh, looking to start a magazine and we're definitely gonna be talking about that. Um, about Botaki magazine? Uh, what's it about Android is also very well networked, uh, across Africa. So we talk about a network, um, some of the cool artists, you know, You know, the people she knows and work with, et cetera.

[00:02:26] And we we'll find this a little bit about them. And, um, I think she's quite an interesting lady, you know? And, um, yeah, I mean, I'm very excited about, uh, about the Botaki magazine to see, you know, given that in South Africa, we don't really have. A large variety of art magazine. So I'm always willing to, uh, to support anybody who is willing to, um, add on to that.

[00:02:47] So, yeah, I mean, that's going to be really exciting. I hope you guys enjoy the episode and as always, you know, our talk to you straight after this. 

[00:02:54] Spudcaster: [00:02:54] Baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts. podcast, your life with baobulb.org

[00:03:12] Wesley Pepper: [00:03:12] Okay. Jowahri Hlophe Uh  uh, firstly, um, I know that. Are you a South African citizen yet. Now that we’re on that, or are you still a us citizen? Jowahri Hlophe: Soon I’ll be...]]>In this week's Art Lexica, Wesley sits down with multi-disciplined creative director and curator, Jowahri Hlophe. Wesley focusses in on her networks in South Africa, Botaki magazine and creative work in general.

Transcript

Wesley Pepper: [00:00:00] Hey greetings everybody, uh, Wesley Pepper, uh, and you’re tuned into my podcast Wesley Pepper’s Art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Greetings, everybody, uh, to all my new and returning listeners. Welcome. Welcome. Welcome one. Welcome all thanks for tuning into today's episode. Uh, lets just start with a recap on last week.

[00:00:29] Uh, thanks to my brother Zama for coming through. It was really a blessing, it was really cool speaking to him and, uh, Yeah. And it's really cool. Talking about is a, about water and lights I hope you guys support the brother. You know, if you are interested in knowing more about the book on how to get hold of it, I mean, you can always see it on the social media pages, or you can just give me a shout and I will definitely forward you, his details.

[00:00:53] Yeah, man, big up to that, man. Um, so it's really exciting talking about, about a poet that actually put a physical book together because, you know, as in last week’s episode I mentioned, you know, that doesn't happen too much over the past or pretty much since the pandemic has started. Yeah. I mean, I just remember that the art giveaway is still up for grabs, you know, just like subscribe or comment to this current episode and you can win an artwork done by yours truly.

[00:01:13] And remember. Still only available for, uh, subscribers based in South Africa and that's as a, well, this is a money thing. So yeah. Anyway, uh, moving on, um, today's episode, I'm talking to a really, really cool lady. We're talking to Jowahri Hlophe. Uh, uh, California she's actually based from, or, uh, she's from California in, uh, in the United States, but she's actually now finally, uh, made a full-on move to South Africa.

[00:01:40] So welcome to South Africa, my sister. Um, so Jowahri is a very, very interesting, uh, sister and she's a, uh, a creative director. A curator, a real, just creative entrepreneur. I think that's quite a, I think that pretty much captures everything. Um, and she's done and she worked with a whole host of, uh, artists, uh, both locally and abroad.

[00:02:04] And I know that. Uh, being based here she's, uh, looking to start a magazine and we're definitely gonna be talking about that. Um, about Botaki magazine? Uh, what's it about Android is also very well networked, uh, across Africa. So we talk about a network, um, some of the cool artists, you know, You know, the people she knows and work with, et cetera.

[00:02:26] And we we'll find this a little bit about them. And, um, I think she's quite an interesting lady, you know? And, um, yeah, I mean, I'm very excited about, uh, about the Botaki magazine to see, you know, given that in South Africa, we don't really have. A large variety of art magazine. So I'm always willing to, uh, to support anybody who is willing to, um, add on to that.

[00:02:47] So, yeah, I mean, that's going to be really exciting. I hope you guys enjoy the episode and as always, you know, our talk to you straight after this. 

[00:02:54] Spudcaster: [00:02:54] Baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts. podcast, your life with baobulb.org

[00:03:12] Wesley Pepper: [00:03:12] Okay. Jowahri Hlophe Uh  uh, firstly, um, I know that. Are you a South African citizen yet. Now that we’re on that, or are you still a us citizen? Jowahri Hlophe: Soon I’ll be one.

[00:03:30] Wesley Pepper: Congratulations. I think you, uh, part of the 60 million now. Uh, now you definitely look like one of us,

[00:03:43] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:03:43] Try to fit in where I can but it's fine. 

[00:03:45] Wesley Pepper: [00:03:45] So let's start from the beginning. Um, you are married now let’s just say you are a

[00:03:52] South African citizen, but we all know you from the states. You've been back and forth to South Africa for, I met you in 2015. So that's like what? Six years ago? Uh, so you've been back and forth quite a bit then, you know, everybody. So let's just start of there man, tell me, where did the love for South Africa come from? You know why?

[00:04:12] I mean, we've got 54 countries on the continent. Why South Africa? 

[00:04:18] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:04:18] So, you know, we were, we were invited here, um, for the writers festival, the national writers festival. Um, so that was my introduction. Um, we came here, we saw, we, we taught we'd live the art life I fell in love. With the country

[00:04:42] and continue to build the network that I have. Right. And so, as it, as it developed as it matured, I began to come back every few months. Every you know, I think first it was like every six months, then it was every other month that I was here for months. And working the network and seeing the vision, because the vision that I have is, is international.

[00:05:05] Right. And so why not, when you're creating footprints, you gotta walk in them. bottom line.

[00:05:11] Wesley Pepper: [00:05:11] Yeah. Interesting. When, so that festival was 6 years ago or so South Africa actually came a long way. A lot has happened in those six years. Some people that's left us a lot of political. It's changed. It's changed. So, um, you actually came in a very interesting you know, your introduction to SA, was in quite an interesting part of the country.

[00:05:35] So let's unpack that bit by bit and let’s look at your networks and also your projects, you know, and also we have to touch on COVID. So, um, you’ve been here for the past six years or so. Uh, I guess like what, you know, even I'm always interested in know when, um, when, um, when, when African American’s say they, they falling in love with something about South Africa.

[00:05:58] Can you be a little bit specific is it the weather? Is it the landscape is the people, is the culture, the music, the what is it? What was it for you? 

[00:06:04] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:06:04] so it's everything. So there is a bit of this disconnect being, being an African-American. What we, what we don't have is the language, the culture, right. We don't have, we don't have any of that.

[00:06:19] Because of slavery. Right? So that whole transatlantic thing, um, separate separated us from, uh, from who we are. So then to come somewhere and even, even though I wasn't yeah. In a search for finding my, my, my, my being or finding my roots, as they say to come where you feel like it's some people go to Ghana, some people go to Nigeria.

[00:06:43] I was, I was fortunate enough to come here and was all the right people here

[00:06:57] to be connected with all the right people in their lives and mine to cultivate the proper relationships where it was, it was alive.

[00:07:11] Wesley Pepper: [00:07:11] Okay. There was just a bit of a delay there.

[00:07:13] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:07:13] Well, as an American, we don't have any, we have

[00:07:20] Thanksgiving and Christmas, all the holidays that they gave us. We have the, the family traditions that we do, whether it's Sunday, dinner or family reunions that are annual. So that's it. And there's a whole lot of things that happen here that create who the people are here, whether they're Zulu or, you know, whatever.

[00:07:42] Right. But being able to be acquire that 17, 18 different languages at 17, 18 different ways of doing things. Um, and then to see that even in the diversity, there's unity.

[00:07:57] Wesley Pepper: [00:07:57] That's interesting. That's interesting. Uh, just, just a point on that. Sometimes our diversity actually is a point of conflict because when the apartheid government did so very well was to say that there's difference, you know, through diversity, but there is another level I know because you know, I'm a visual artist.

[00:08:18] I'm an artist like from like the creative level, there's a definitely. I’ve really enjoyed that. If you're brainstorming with artists from different cultures and stuff like that, there's a real rich sense of culture. And, uh, yeah, I can say, well, it doesn't matter. I'm actually glad you pointed that out. I think that's actually one of our strongest point.

[00:08:41] Oh, the government actually tried to use against us. I'm actually quite excited. You started, uh, you brought up that point, so, uh, let's get into, let's get him to who’s Jowahri Hlophe, man. And so you are, I know that when we spoke some years ago, you were telling me and this thing really excited me. When you were saying you had these. Uh, one of the projects you were doing with was these, uh, exhibitions in, uh, uh, in, uh, like these mannequins in shops where you, you have a whole line of, you know, a fashion designer that was exciting, and that was a while ago.

[00:09:22] And, um, Hindsight is quite a thing. If you look back that’s a trend, which is actually supposed to be picking up right now because of the fourth industrial revolution and took over and, uh, yeah. So, um, let's just start there man. And so, uh, as a creative director as an entrepreneur as a curator, uh, which one is your, I guess your primary, you know, which one is the main talent or the main thing so to speak?

[00:09:50] You understand what I'm asking?

[00:09:54] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:09:54] I don't think, I don't think we can separate them. They're all, they're all one. Right? Because, um, creativity is the movement. So whether I'm curating an exhibit. Or curating a, um, a fashion show or providing a platform for independent artists. I'm still able to one network to tap into what I feel the need is through, through creativity.

[00:10:24] Some people are able to do it through business and proper setups and infrastructures in that way. I’m not.

[00:10:32] Wesley Pepper: [00:10:32] Interesting. 

[00:10:35] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:10:35] Through communication, um, and, and, and to provide platforms and for people. So I don't know if I could separate them. Sometimes I'm the artistic director. Sometimes I'm the director. Sometimes I'm the art curator. Sometimes I'm the artist just, I’m me.

[00:10:55] Wesley Pepper: [00:10:55] yeah, no, I get you. I get you. I get you. And I, I, I agree.

[00:10:59] I agree.

[00:11:07] Yeah. I hear you on that. So, uh, for my listeners, man, tell us a little bit about, um, how did you work as a, in the states, you know? Um, and, um, yeah, I sorta want to, pick up on the similarities between the work you're doing there and the work you wanna do over here. Let’s just start off with what you were doing

[00:11:27] on that side. 

[00:11:31] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:11:31] So. On in, in the, in the art field, in the art field, um, I was doing exactly that like curating exhibits, networking with artists, showing artists the proper way to get paid, because you know, that that's another part of it, right. Like have to be able to do the art, but then you have to also get paid.

[00:11:54] So the art business had been my focus on the outside. Yeah. Um, not related to art, but I was able to create, um, a relationship through mental health. Right? So look, my background in sociology, my background, I focused sociology work working with, um, adults with mental and physical disabilities, adult dealing with mental health issues, children, um, within the, the autism spectrum.

[00:12:22] Right. And getting them to communicate. Who they are, whether it was through music, whether it was through dance, whether it was through visual arts, um, using it as a, as a tool, but also as a strength for independence. 

[00:12:36] Wesley Pepper: [00:12:36] Mm Hmm. One of the you know, I've worked and collaborated with artists, I guess, creative people in the states.

[00:12:44] Um, and, uh, one thing I've noticed the, one of the major differences between us versus them was that in South Africa, you have to do everything on your own. So you have to be your own marketer. Your own everything. You've got to make the art. You've got to set up meetings you’ve gotta attend the meetings, make the art and you have to market, that thing, whereas in the states, the market and the, I guess the way things are set up there, you know, there's this people. For example as a writer

[00:13:09] Like in South Africa, It's very difficult to get an agent because the market is just not good enough for that. And you know, there's not a lot of money in it. And I know in the states an agent, um, they just literally do the writing. Um, is that a good thing or bad thing in South Africa or what’s your take on that? Do you think, well, yeah, let me not get ahead of myself 

[00:13:35] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:13:35] I actually think it’s the other way around

[00:13:38] And I don't think, I think so there's difficulty everywhere, but I think here what’s more accessible is help than at home. And so I've had these conversations with the people we know, I remember a few years ago, it was me, Motete, Sabelo we were all sitting in Soweto. And I'm talking and drinking and crying and saying, you gotta, you gotta do it for yourself.

[00:14:05] Yeah, you can't wait on government, right? It's sometimes it's easier to leave your backyard to come back, to see how much you've grown. If you stay in the same area, you don't, you're not able to see your growth. Are you following me in regards to what I’m saying? The networks are there, but sometimes it means be the writer somewhere else.

[00:14:32] Right. And create a connection. Create the platform and get the network and get the people who are excited about you and then come back for your acknowledgement. You get it. You might not, you might not directly get the knowledge when you're here because you're from here. And so there's so many people that say, I remember Wesley, when dot dot dot right, where I could take you home, I could take you to California and they meet with what's been introduced to them.

[00:15:06] Wesley Pepper: [00:15:06] Interesting.

[00:15:09] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:15:09] And, um, I don't think that, uh, it's, I don't think it's much easier in the states than it is here. 

[00:15:20] Wesley Pepper: [00:15:20] Interesting. That's an interesting point. That's a very interesting point. And I hear you on that, uh, before we, um, you spoke about like, you also involved with teaching artists how to make money and that's a real big deal. Okay.

[00:15:33] Um, because as you know, COVID is also more complicated, especially for artists who rely on gigs. You know, musicians, theatre practitioners, et cetera. Poets to a degree, uh, how has that changing? How is Jay, how is the strategy or how is the thing on making money have changed? Um, how do you think where do you think artists should look, how do you think artists should change their approach do they change their art? 

[00:16:04] You know, um, one of the, just, uh, just a last point on that. Uh, I think it was more last year. I spoke to a whole host of musicians. There were, they were really struggling with, uh, you know, shows being closed and the platforms that we have you can’t really monetize or to monetize. It is quite tricky. Um, so what's your, what's your, what's your take on all of that?

[00:16:28] Where do you think we should start?

[00:16:33] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:16:33] Um I think that we first need to get away from the starving artist's way of thinking. Right.

[00:16:43] I think that once there’s consensus on that. Do away with that, those derogatory terms of a starving artist, um, I think the movement and people, people then will appreciate the movement different, like, and only it only seems to affect the visual artists because you don't really have starving musicians.

[00:17:07] You expect them to have right. Then you know that you have to pay them. Right. But when it comes to the visual artists, I think so. So often is it that, um, and we know, we know, I know those people I've been those people, Hey, what can you give me? Because this is due. Um, and as, as it's a reality, that should not be either way that we go, right.

[00:17:35] It also goes back to network, place yourself amongst the people. Who are the clients that you want, who are the art collectors that you want who are the galleries that you want to show in. position yourself. We have to position ourselves. We position ourselves when we see the girl or the guy that we like, right.

[00:17:56] We position ourselves when we have an interview, we position ourselves. When we go meet the parents for the first time, positioning yourself in your creativity, the same way.

[00:18:11] Then those who have positioned they move that way. Those who, those that we know who, who have positioned themselves, they move that way. And we know we can’t call them, ask them to come and do anything for free. We know the ones we can call and then we know the ones we can’t call.

[00:18:32] Wesley Pepper: [00:18:32] Yeah. I agree with you there. I know a lot of guys who will just say yes to free gigs because they quote unquote, want exposure and that bullshit must come to an end

[00:18:40] I always believe that artists should know their worth.

[00:18:45] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:18:45] We’ve been those artists right. And we're not in that place anymore, we have to also tell them, Hey, you don't have to it's okay. Like brand yourself, brand yourself a certain way. You move in that capacity. We all, we all buy bottled water. You understand? That was branding. That was, 

[00:19:08] Wesley Pepper: [00:19:08] yeah.

[00:19:13] Jowahri Hlophe: [00:19:13] But it's the branding. And so when you move a certain way and you position yourself properly, then there is a, there, there is a space for the art world because artists, like, I think that, um, artists together, we need to have an Alliance and, and, and like, like a union, not like a union union, but in a way and say, this is what's going on because there's some artists that have gotten the government money, right.

[00:19:39] Right. And they're programs forecasted for 2023 paid for in full. And then there's some, that's just like, Hey, I'm an artist. And...]]>e6a872a5-309b-4601-88b0-d0396f782de5Fri, 06 Aug 2021 08:00:00 +020053:44falsefull6262Candice NolanWater and LightsWesley talks to Zama Madinana a poet based in Johannesburg. We will look at his latest anthology titled ' Water and Lights ' and talk about his journey in the Joburg poetry scene and how he has evolved during the pandemic. Art Lexica is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Uh, yes. Uh, greetings everybody. Uh, Wesley Pepper here. And you are tuned into my podcast wesley peppers art Lexia, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Thanks everybody. Uh, to all the new and returning listeners. Welcome, welcome, greetings to you all. Um, clearly you’s know where the top ranking arts-based podcast is.

[00:00:32] So thanks all for coming through. Uh, yeah, my fingers and my hands is pretty cold today. It’s very chilly where I’m sitting today. Uh, but it's all good, man. So, um, just as brief, uh, to start off with, um, last week's, uh, touch base on last week's episode. Thanks for Mike for coming through. It's always really cool to talk to him as you could tell through last week’s episode

[00:00:52] I've got a longish relationship with him and his poetry, and it's always cool to, um, I guess just being active again. That was really cool. So thanks Mike, for coming through. I hope you guys enjoyed that episode. Um, uh, today's episode. Yeah, we are on that same sort of poetry. Today's episode is also a poetry based episode.

[00:01:12] I'm talking to. Uh, poets based in Johannesburg, Zama, Madinana. Um, he's an old school cat, man. I actually know of him when I used to run with reunited siblings that was in the early two thousands. And I know he was self-published back then already. So I know the brother's got a serious foothold, um, in the.

[00:01:30] Publishing self publishing a poetry scene, and we'd definitely be touching base on that because he's also released he's. Uh, um, he's also, um, just published a recently, recently published a book called water and lights, and we're definitely gonna be talking about that. It's really, it's really got me excited when I started to see him post that on social media.

[00:01:51] Because to be honest with you, I don't really know many poets who has released a anthologies over the past since basically since COVID not that I'm in touch with every single poet in South Africa, but like I keep my eye on. I keep my finger on everything. And, um, it was really exciting to see, um, to see that.

[00:02:10] And I was really excited to get hold of him and, uh, to talk about it. And I'm really looking forward to that thing today. Um, so stay tuned for that. So remember the art, um, giveaway. Well, it'll always be up for grabs. Um, um, it's it's um, it's, uh, it's not a one-time thing. Uh, remember if you want to win yourself an original artwork done by yours, truly remember to like subscribe and comment on this episode and I shall choose a

[00:02:35] name randomly and you’ll win an art, uh, an artwork done by, um, yours truly. And just remember that this, uh, giveaway is only based, uh, for now, for us only for artists based in South Africa and that's only for now. Um, so yeah, man, um, there's also a lot of exciting things and not so many exciting things that have been happening, um, over the past few weeks, you know, one being, um, what's happening in the Eswatini, um, with, uh, Yeah, I was I'm I'm I'm, I'm actually thinking and seeing how I can go about doing a full episode on that, uh, feature on, um, what was happening in Eswatini but

[00:03:14] wow, man. Um, that plus the third wave here in South Africa. Things us are getting tougher and tougher and tougher. Uh, nothing is getting easier, but, um, yeah man, whatever, man, you know, we move on, you know, we soldier on, uh, And we definitely don't quit. We keep producing, we keep making art, we keep writing...]]>Wesley talks to Zama Madinana a poet based in Johannesburg. We will look at his latest anthology titled ' Water and Lights ' and talk about his journey in the Joburg poetry scene and how he has evolved during the pandemic. Art Lexica is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Uh, yes. Uh, greetings everybody. Uh, Wesley Pepper here. And you are tuned into my podcast wesley peppers art Lexia, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Thanks everybody. Uh, to all the new and returning listeners. Welcome, welcome, greetings to you all. Um, clearly you’s know where the top ranking arts-based podcast is.

[00:00:32] So thanks all for coming through. Uh, yeah, my fingers and my hands is pretty cold today. It’s very chilly where I’m sitting today. Uh, but it's all good, man. So, um, just as brief, uh, to start off with, um, last week's, uh, touch base on last week's episode. Thanks for Mike for coming through. It's always really cool to talk to him as you could tell through last week’s episode

[00:00:52] I've got a longish relationship with him and his poetry, and it's always cool to, um, I guess just being active again. That was really cool. So thanks Mike, for coming through. I hope you guys enjoyed that episode. Um, uh, today's episode. Yeah, we are on that same sort of poetry. Today's episode is also a poetry based episode.

[00:01:12] I'm talking to. Uh, poets based in Johannesburg, Zama, Madinana. Um, he's an old school cat, man. I actually know of him when I used to run with reunited siblings that was in the early two thousands. And I know he was self-published back then already. So I know the brother's got a serious foothold, um, in the.

[00:01:30] Publishing self publishing a poetry scene, and we'd definitely be touching base on that because he's also released he's. Uh, um, he's also, um, just published a recently, recently published a book called water and lights, and we're definitely gonna be talking about that. It's really, it's really got me excited when I started to see him post that on social media.

[00:01:51] Because to be honest with you, I don't really know many poets who has released a anthologies over the past since basically since COVID not that I'm in touch with every single poet in South Africa, but like I keep my eye on. I keep my finger on everything. And, um, it was really exciting to see, um, to see that.

[00:02:10] And I was really excited to get hold of him and, uh, to talk about it. And I'm really looking forward to that thing today. Um, so stay tuned for that. So remember the art, um, giveaway. Well, it'll always be up for grabs. Um, um, it's it's um, it's, uh, it's not a one-time thing. Uh, remember if you want to win yourself an original artwork done by yours, truly remember to like subscribe and comment on this episode and I shall choose a

[00:02:35] name randomly and you’ll win an art, uh, an artwork done by, um, yours truly. And just remember that this, uh, giveaway is only based, uh, for now, for us only for artists based in South Africa and that's only for now. Um, so yeah, man, um, there's also a lot of exciting things and not so many exciting things that have been happening, um, over the past few weeks, you know, one being, um, what's happening in the Eswatini, um, with, uh, Yeah, I was I'm I'm I'm, I'm actually thinking and seeing how I can go about doing a full episode on that, uh, feature on, um, what was happening in Eswatini but

[00:03:14] wow, man. Um, that plus the third wave here in South Africa. Things us are getting tougher and tougher and tougher. Uh, nothing is getting easier, but, um, yeah man, whatever, man, you know, we move on, you know, we soldier on, uh, And we definitely don't quit. We keep producing, we keep making art, we keep writing books.

[00:03:33] Um, I think that's, what's, um, that's shit, man. That's all we can do really. You know, or at least that's from my side. I mean, I've been, I've been really grinding the creative engine over the past few. Yeah. I've yeah. Anyway, but don't worry about I'll. I'll ask you to be telling you guys a little bit of more about what I've been up to, uh, next week's episode.

[00:03:56] And I'll tell a little bit more about that towards the end of this, so yeah, I hope you guys are, uh, warm and safe, wherever you are, and uh, hope you guys enjoyed today's episode. And remember as always I'll chat to you after this. 

[00:04:08] Spudcaster: [00:04:08] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcast, your life with baobulb.org

[00:04:27] Wesley: [00:04:27] All right, here we go. Uh, Zama uh, I see. And, uh, zoom you a Zamokile, right?

[00:04:42] Zama: [00:04:42] Zamokuhle 

[00:04:44] Wesley: [00:04:44] that's okay. Yeah. Sorry I messed up the pronunciation. Zama: Just call me Zama Wesley: Um, yeah, I mean, um, my brother, thanks for coming through let’s just start off right in the beginning. I mean

[00:04:55] um, a bit chilly where I’m sitting.

[00:05:03] here.

[00:05:10] I was telling my, um, my listeners in my intro. And we spoke briefly, I guess like, like, you published a book during

[00:05:19] uh, the lockdown and that's like really stood out, but I'm also, but I also know I’m. But let’s just take it back like a few years you know just to give my listeners some perspective about your writing about your

[00:05:30] publishing, um, and I want to start off with a story which, which when I saw water and lights I was like Yo, man I must really get hold of this brother because I remember I think it was 2004/5 I was still running with reunited siblings busy putting together our first book. And you had already self published

[00:05:51] Um, and I remember you printed at uh, in Melville and we actually followed suite.

[00:06:04] so tell us a little bit about that book

[00:06:08] and what happened.

[00:06:21] Zama: [00:06:21] No. Yeah, it was a while ago. Yeah. But to be honest, man, my first book, like, uh, when I, when I look back man, like it was, it was a bit terrible because. Cause uh, I was still young, you know, 

[00:06:36] and uh, uh, most of 

[00:06:38] the poems like were like, were written in my teen years, you know, so yeah, man,

[00:06:53] it wasn't that strong, you know, and like, uh, compared actually to the poetry that I’m writing now, but I've tried like to work and polish my work over the years. 

[00:07:12] Wesley: [00:07:12] Yeah, sure. I'm sure you did. Uh, do you remember the title of that book? 

[00:07:16] Zama: [00:07:16] Yeah. It was called God and Kasi children. I remember, 

[00:07:20] Wesley: [00:07:20] um, just like two or three questions on that because I sort of, want to give what are we doing now perspective, man

[00:07:28] So to show my listeners growth and so forth and so forth. So. I remember one of the, one of the major things that I remember happening back then was there was very few self published cats,

[00:07:43] um, I think Napa is also self-published, but there was like one or two or three, you know, it wasn't so much, um, how did you get into, I mean, it was a pretty brave move. Because you say you were still pretty young back then. Pretty braver for, you know, a young guy just to say I’m going to self publish,

[00:08:03] How did you get to that stage and just tell us a little bit about like your, I guess your frame of mind, not so much the poetry because we’ll get to that I’m talking more in terms of the self publishing for now.

[00:08:15] Zama: [00:08:15] Yeah. Like, uh, I started writing at a very young age you know. I think I was 13/14, right. 

[00:08:24] But it only got serious like when I got to Joburg 

[00:08:29] around 2004 when I came to study at RAU

[00:08:35] Wesley: [00:08:35] RAU tjo, that’s old school,

[00:08:45] Zama: [00:08:45] but, uh, it only got serious when like when, uh, I came to Joburg. And I met like cats, like who were very active bit like, uh, I remember like meeting Flo for the first time at wits tech, that guy made me like perform like in an empty hall

[00:09:08] and then invited me to his like poetry shows, like he used to host these poetry shows like at horror cafe in newtown. Yeah. And then from there, and like, I never looked back like attended, like it's an, every single show at horror and around joburg. Uh, and I remember also, also, first met you at unitary gallery

[00:09:34] yeah, so I started like, attended like, uh, all the poetry shows like around joburg Yfm and

[00:09:42] yeah. I was hungry man. Hungry for the mic. Hungry for the page. And then I decide, I like to put like my poetry, like together that, uh, in that, uh, book that way. So I was just having to get my, my work out there. 

[00:10:03] Wesley: [00:10:03] Um, were you, um, were you like, did you design it yourself?

[00:10:10] Zama: [00:10:10] Yes. Yeah. With the help of there was a lecturer at UJ, uh, professor Ashraf Docrat who also like helped me with writing and stuff. Then just took it like to the printers and printed a few copies 

[00:10:23] Wesley: [00:10:23] that's like, uh, that was something else when I came across the book I was like woah

[00:10:32] this guy’s out there doing it.

[00:10:42] It just seem like such a long time ago. But, I mean, like the book was out there, just like, um, tell us a little bit about, how did you sell the book because um just for my listeners

[00:10:59] um, now since Covid happened

[00:11:11] things seem even further back but it seems so but back then we used to have sessions poets used to go and recite their poetry and then used to sell their work afterwards, um, was that the formula you used. 

[00:11:18] Zama: [00:11:18] Yeah. Like, uh, so like most of my books like in poetry show, I was always carrying my book in my backpack, you know, and some of them like in, uh, independent bookstores, but like I prefer like selling it, like in poetry shows because that's where like, uh, I'll interact like with my audience and after maybe a performance will come to me.

[00:11:44] So it was a bit easier selling it hand to hand

[00:11:51] rather than like leaving it in a bookshop. Like nobody knows you there, 

[00:11:56] Wesley: [00:11:56] you know,

[00:12:14] Ok let’s jump straight into the detail, you were studying at RAU it’s UJ now, what were you studying back then? 

[00:12:19] Zama: [00:12:19] I was studying B com. uh, it's only now that, uh, also like enrolled for creative writing with UNISA. 

[00:12:26] Wesley: [00:12:26] So, um, so where did the writing bug start right so who were your

[00:12:31] influences. you say you were writing since 14/15, Um, you know, that's a fairly young age so clearly there was strong influences you tell us a little bit about that, man. Who was the writers who you were reading back then

[00:12:46] and what did you start writing about at a young age

[00:12:53] Zama: [00:12:53] Um,

[00:12:58] there's a book that I read. It was, I can't remember it’s title but it was like an anthology of

[00:13:05] African uh, poetry and, and that, and in that anthology, you know, there was a poem by Mafika Gwala, uh, 

[00:13:12] uh, called, uh, 

[00:13:19] Uh, the children of Nonti Nzimande. That poem like touched me, you know, like he was speaking about the thing that I could relate to, you know, then I started like, uh, digging, like more of his stuff. So like when I got to, uh, uh, to, to UJ, Like I was exposed to a lot of, uh, African literature, like, like in the library, there's a lot of African African literature, you know, like

[00:14:01] Eg Sello Duiker. So I started like reading a lot of like, uh, African material, you know, and then. I also like, started like to, to find my own poems, you know? Uh, so I'll say like, I mostly like, uh, inspired by like African African writers, whether they are poets or, or novelist, or just a great African thing.

[00:14:32] Cause you know, like Steve Biko.

[00:14:36] Wesley: [00:14:36] Interesting man. So, um, just another question on that, uh, rewriting for the stage or the page. Well, which came first

[00:14:54] Zama: [00:14:54] uh, I think I started like just writing just for myself, you know, and then when I got exposed to stage 

[00:15:06] I think 

[00:15:06] I started 

[00:15:06] writing for the stage. 

[00:15:09] And then there was a time when like the, the, the poetry scene had slowed down, I think that’s where, like, uh, I made a decision that, focus more on writing, you know, like on writing, like as an art form, you know, that's when like, uh, I managed like to polish my, you know work, And that's where, like I saw my work, like evolving from just simple to metaphoric, you know, that's when I started like send, sending a lot of my poetry like to different poetry journals

[00:15:51] poetry, poet magazines. Okay. At first I was rejected. But I never gave up, like, I kept like sending my stuff, you know? And then eventually they started like, uh, accepting my stuff, my stuff got published to different journals. Yeah.

[00:16:23] Yeah. That's where, like I started, I started 

[00:16:25] like, uh, 

[00:16:26] to take like the art of writing seriously. 

[00:16:30] Wesley: [00:16:30] Hmm. Um, yes, this, uh, here’s just a question that I’d like to know

[00:16:36] so, um, I remember like in the early 2000’s cats were also very experimental onstage. So, um, in other words, they'll come with music, visual, visual arts. Um, so there was always that, uh, visual and musical element, um, element to the stage. I know a lot of cats were influencing each other by doing that. They can sort of creating their own identity through that.

[00:17:04] Um, were you influenced by any of that because you were referencing I'm I'm specifically referencing like the likes of the sessions in the Melville and so on and so on.

[00:17:19] Zama: [00:17:19] Uh,

[00:17:23] um,

[00:17:27] Not really, but I liked what the guys were doing back then, you know, like fusing poetry with music. But I don't know, like, 

[00:17:39] uh, maybe, uh, 

[00:17:43] I would love, like to do like, something like that, maybe like to fuse uh, poetry and music. Maybe it's just that, like, I haven't, uh, found, uh, the sound that will match my poetry

[00:17:58] Wesley: [00:17:58] Like my I'm asking you specifically, because like, I've been talking to a few guys,

[00:18:11] a lot of people influencing each other without them even doing it consciously. And, uh, like that was close to 20 years ago and if you fast forward the clock you see some of that 

[00:18:23] influences like manifesting in their work, you know? And especially like in, I want to get to that because we, this geewhizz this abstract times, you know, since last year when the pandemic hit that artists have now in some cases relook at their art relook at what people are reading,

[00:18:43] consuming and so on and so on. So usually, you know, people draw from past experiences and so on and so on, but it's interesting to know that this is where I am. This is what I'm willing to take to learn everything. So, um, you were mentioning early on that. So, this is still like, so we moving on now more to the 2010’s and so on,

[00:19:11] um, you were saying that you were published in a few other journals. Can you tell us a little bit more. You said Botsotso

[00:19:22] Zama: [00:19:22] yeah. It's like, uh, I started like submitting, like my, my poet, like to different literary journals, uh, uh, like your Botsotso

[00:19:31] at a pace. 

[00:19:33] Uh, new coin, uh, poetry potion. 

[00:19:43] Wesley: [00:19:43] So yeah, was it just poetry that you published in there or was it

[00:19:50] Zama: [00:19:50] no, it was just poetry 

[00:19:54] And I also got long listed for Sol Plaatjie poetry award in 2018.  

[00:20:05] And again this year I’ve been long listed again.

[00:20:08] Wesley: [00:20:08] Tell us a little bit about that, 

[00:20:13] Zama: [00:20:13] uh, 

[00:20:15] Wesley: [00:20:15] that could 

[00:20:16] Zama: [00:20:16] like, it's a, it's a, it's an annual poetry award it like each and every year. Yeah. So you just submit your poetry. And then they will like long list. And then from there they'll short list, like, uh, three poets and then obviously. 

[00:20:38] Wesley: [00:20:38] Um, explain to me this, um, like, um, I've actually had an, an episode with a writer from Zim about, um, awards, um, um, you know, the episode was sort of themed around what

[00:20:52] awards do to writers, excuse me. Um, did that award open up doors for you? Was it worth winningit?

[00:21:06] Zama: [00:21:06] I didn’t win it.

[00:21:10] Wesley: [00:21:10] Ja, but still being, being long listed, like,

[00:21:18] yeah. Anyway. 

[00:21:21] Zama: [00:21:21] Yeah. I think that it does have an impact, like on one’s career you know.

[00:21:29] Wesley: [00:21:29] Do you think that, um, writers will um not writer’s sorry that readers will

[00:21:36] you know, that they’ll be more open to read your work if they see your name up in 

[00:21:43] shortlisted and so forth, do you think it works? I mean, I'm talking specifically to you.

[00:21:53] Zama: [00:21:53] Yeah, it does. It does. I think it does have a positive, like, uh, influence. Yeah. 

[00:21:59] Wesley:...]]>ddec02b8-f175-4de9-a0db-6279e56faac2Fri, 30 Jul 2021 08:00:00 +020053:55falsefull6161Candice NolanThese Dark Dark Days of DeathIn todays episode I'll unpack the poetry of Colorado based poet Mike Stuller. We look back at our collaboration in 2011, medicinal marijuana which he uses to manage brain trauma, his current body of work and the politicking behind covid 19 both in the US and South Africa.

Art Lexica is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Hey, greetings everybody Wesley Pepper here, and you're tuned to my podcast wesley peppers art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah, I think there are many new listeners and returning listeners. Welcome everybody. Uh, we have. Just to start off with last week’s episode, thanks to Gen for coming through, I had lots of fun talking to her was really cool.

[00:00:30] Having a guest, uh, having a live guests was really fun. Um, I hope I'm having more of that. The irony is, is that we are under this new lockdown and anyway, uh, yeah, she was a lot of fun to be able to check out her work at genn art, uh, 25 or just genn art on all social media platforms. Um, I, and moving on to today, um, I'm talking.

[00:00:54] I've got a really interesting, guest today. Uh, I'm talking to Mike Stuller all the way through Pueblo, Colorado in the USA. Um, yeah, I know him for quite a while now. We've done a, uh, a very interesting collaboration in 2011. Um, he's a poet, uh, Mike’s a poet. And, um, he writes these really interesting poems and I know over time he's poetry took a really dark turn and then we'll definitely touch on that.

[00:01:22] And I know he's also dealing with, um, he's got some mental question. I honestly, I can't remember exactly what it was, but we'll talk about it. And I know that's impacted he's writing and while he's he's his livelihood in general, so we'll touch on it. Uh, but on that, and I'm talking about is, um, how is, uh, Mike’s writing as, um, how it has grown and because he's got some new stuff you'll, um, hopefully you'll be reciting some of that.

[00:01:48] I hope so. Um, I hope he's not too shy. Um, so yeah, I hope you guys look forward to that. Um, remember the, uh, Our giveaways is still up for grabs. So it's just like comment or, um, like comment subscribe to this episode and you can win yourself an original artwork. And, um, I'll talk to you guys at the end of the

[00:02:10] At the end of all of this with regards to the future episodes and everything. So yeah, I hope you guys stay tuned and enjoy today's episode 

[00:02:22] Spudcaster: [00:02:22] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org.

[00:02:36] Wesley: [00:02:36] Come on. There you go. Okay. Here we go. Uh, Mike Stuller all the way from Pueblo, Colorado, uh, there all the way America, the U S. Uh, I know it's like noon your side. How you doing my brother? 

[00:02:54] Mike: [00:02:54] I'm good, Wes. How are you? 

[00:02:57] Wesley: [00:02:57] Um, yeah, I mean, like being an African there’s never a straight answer, like I should just tell you I’m doing okay.

[00:03:05] I'm doing okay but, but I'm doing this, but I've been productive. I'm in good spirits. You know, things are moving. Um, I'm pretty good, man. So yeah, man, I just jumped right into it then. So, uh, could you give us, uh, give us a brief about like your background and I know you were theater practitioner, you retired, um, and, uh, but just give us a background in you, uh, what you did in theater background.

[00:03:35] Mike: [00:03:35] So I started, I started in theater when I was nine years old. And...]]>In todays episode I'll unpack the poetry of Colorado based poet Mike Stuller. We look back at our collaboration in 2011, medicinal marijuana which he uses to manage brain trauma, his current body of work and the politicking behind covid 19 both in the US and South Africa.

Art Lexica is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Hey, greetings everybody Wesley Pepper here, and you're tuned to my podcast wesley peppers art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah, I think there are many new listeners and returning listeners. Welcome everybody. Uh, we have. Just to start off with last week’s episode, thanks to Gen for coming through, I had lots of fun talking to her was really cool.

[00:00:30] Having a guest, uh, having a live guests was really fun. Um, I hope I'm having more of that. The irony is, is that we are under this new lockdown and anyway, uh, yeah, she was a lot of fun to be able to check out her work at genn art, uh, 25 or just genn art on all social media platforms. Um, I, and moving on to today, um, I'm talking.

[00:00:54] I've got a really interesting, guest today. Uh, I'm talking to Mike Stuller all the way through Pueblo, Colorado in the USA. Um, yeah, I know him for quite a while now. We've done a, uh, a very interesting collaboration in 2011. Um, he's a poet, uh, Mike’s a poet. And, um, he writes these really interesting poems and I know over time he's poetry took a really dark turn and then we'll definitely touch on that.

[00:01:22] And I know he's also dealing with, um, he's got some mental question. I honestly, I can't remember exactly what it was, but we'll talk about it. And I know that's impacted he's writing and while he's he's his livelihood in general, so we'll touch on it. Uh, but on that, and I'm talking about is, um, how is, uh, Mike’s writing as, um, how it has grown and because he's got some new stuff you'll, um, hopefully you'll be reciting some of that.

[00:01:48] I hope so. Um, I hope he's not too shy. Um, so yeah, I hope you guys look forward to that. Um, remember the, uh, Our giveaways is still up for grabs. So it's just like comment or, um, like comment subscribe to this episode and you can win yourself an original artwork. And, um, I'll talk to you guys at the end of the

[00:02:10] At the end of all of this with regards to the future episodes and everything. So yeah, I hope you guys stay tuned and enjoy today's episode 

[00:02:22] Spudcaster: [00:02:22] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org.

[00:02:36] Wesley: [00:02:36] Come on. There you go. Okay. Here we go. Uh, Mike Stuller all the way from Pueblo, Colorado, uh, there all the way America, the U S. Uh, I know it's like noon your side. How you doing my brother? 

[00:02:54] Mike: [00:02:54] I'm good, Wes. How are you? 

[00:02:57] Wesley: [00:02:57] Um, yeah, I mean, like being an African there’s never a straight answer, like I should just tell you I’m doing okay.

[00:03:05] I'm doing okay but, but I'm doing this, but I've been productive. I'm in good spirits. You know, things are moving. Um, I'm pretty good, man. So yeah, man, I just jumped right into it then. So, uh, could you give us, uh, give us a brief about like your background and I know you were theater practitioner, you retired, um, and, uh, but just give us a background in you, uh, what you did in theater background.

[00:03:35] Mike: [00:03:35] So I started, I started in theater when I was nine years old. And performed on and off through school and college and then toured until I was 24. And, um, yeah, then I suffered burnout. I didn't go the route that I should have to become more of a professional with it. And when I went the burnout route, um,

[00:04:12] And started writing when I was 15 more, more poetry, um, and, and dabbled in it and dabbled in it in my twenties and, and wrote songs. And then when I, I hit my thirties, I met, uh, a guy by the name of Phil Dearborn. And. He kind of took me under his wing. He had been writing and he was in his, oh goodness. He was probably in his late sixties at the time.

[00:04:49] And I felt like I was a kindergartener who, uh, writing, uh, when I read his stuff. And, um, it just took me to a different level. And in my writing. And, and so I've just kind of dabbled on and off with it. Um, since then. 

[00:05:14] Wesley: [00:05:14] Yeah. Yeah. A little bit about your influences, man. Um, besides your mentor

[00:05:29] and so forth.

[00:05:35] Mike: [00:05:35] Uh, writing wise, um, poetry wise, uh, Edgar Allen Poe. Maya Angelou, uh, literary wise people like, uh, John Irving, Steven Kane. Um, I, I read a lot of. Okay, now I draw a blank I should have written it all down.

[00:06:14] Wesley: [00:06:14] Um, it’s all good its just to give my listeners like perspective on like where your writings coming from you know

[00:06:20] I always find that artists influences really shape the narrative.

[00:06:26] Pretty much more I would say the backbone of the example, like myself, like Jean-Michel Basquiat was a huge influence in my work, especially, um, especially in my twenties and my thirties. Yeah. So I know a lot of artists, you know, um, 

[00:06:51] Mike: [00:06:51] and it also comes from songwriters that, you know, and I, as I listened to music.

[00:06:59] Yeah, 

[00:06:59] Wesley: [00:06:59] yeah, yeah.

[00:07:03] Mike: [00:07:03] Bruce Springsteen, Bob Dylan, you know, the poets that perform the singer songwriters. Uh, I love listening to them. Uh, and I find that I'll cure a lot of ideas from things that they’e been learning. Um,

[00:07:21] Yeah. 

[00:07:22] Wesley: [00:07:22] Yeah. It's interesting. You mentioned both Springsteen and it's interesting because they were also both revolutionary, really strong, um, did that sort of side.

[00:07:38] Um, you know, like Springsteen and Dylan’s lyrics were also pretty hardcore they wrote about the social issues did that, um, did that side appeal to you?

[00:07:50] Mike: [00:07:50] absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I, um, you know, it just, it moves me. Um, you know, when, when songs, when songs catch, catch, you like that, um, And, and I, I know that you've, you've read a lot of my previous work and you, you see things that I've, I've posted and you know, how, how music is, is so very much a part of my life.

[00:08:18] And, and so, um, when a song catches you and lyrically and musically, you know, but, but more so lyrically when a.

[00:08:34] That just cure something, you know, from inside, uh, you know, it's like, wow, how did they experienced that exact same thing that I did. And I love to be able to be able to relate that and ha have somebody experienced that in my writing as well. Yeah. 

[00:08:57] Wesley: [00:08:57] Yeah, I can. I use it as a, almost as a drug, so to speak.

[00:09:07] I’m always listening to it. I'm always plugged into something and I'm, I'm always. Yeah. Like, um, I'm also very influenced by a really good, really strong lyrics because I know that

[00:09:23] yeah. Um, it resonates, it resonates big actually. So that's actually quite interesting because, um, As I was telling my listeners in the, in the intro I think we met

[00:09:37] was probably no, it was probably 2011. And, um, at that time, um, funny enough, I'll just, I'll just give you some perspective on my side. Um, and that collaboration that we did, um, at that site at, um, at that time

[00:09:57] I was publishing for the longest time I just left it, um, and I was sort of finding a very weird part of  my life because for a few months I didn’t really know what direction I must take

[00:10:09] uh, yeah. So forth and so forth. And, um, I remember us chatting and you send me your work and I was really really enjoying it man, 

[00:10:19] I sort of like, I always interpret poetry visually for whatever reason, I always look for very strong metaphors and

[00:10:28] to me, my mind sort of blows, because like, with, with, uh, with each line, I sort of. You know, I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm, I'm getting a sense of the things that my mind thinks visually and so on and so on and I really connected with your work at the time and um

[00:10:44] just for my listeners we did, I think three or four mixed media pieces. You know, actually I've actually copied that poem. I actually don't have it in front of me, but I remember the, but I remember the work very well and I remember it had eventually ended up in a, we had a group show in Melville somewhere,

[00:11:06] so it's been, it's been, it's been quite. And, um, I really enjoyed your writing, and also your blog from time to time over the years and, um, and I sort of get that. So, um, yeah, man. So tell me. Well, my listeners 2011,

[00:11:33] what was influencing you? And so on. 

[00:11:41] Mike: [00:11:41] So a while ago it was, it was, I was, uh, I was an entirely different person back then too. I was, I was writing, I was, I was writing. I was writing. I was really productive during that time. Um,

[00:12:01] I, oddly enough, uh, at that time had just become acquaintance, um, with a band from your region. Uh, the Parlotones.

[00:12:18] Yeah, I believe it or not. I'm still in touch with those guys. Uh, I isn't that crazy after all these years.

[00:12:30] Well, we get old.

[00:12:37] Yeah, no kidding. Um, but, uh, And so I had started exploring, uh, you know, the arts and, and things that were going on in that region. And so I had come across you and I saw your art and I was like, wow, that's, that's just phenomenal stuff.

[00:13:04] And, and we did, we started chatting and you said you were interested in poetry and I, I sent you some and at the time I was, uh, I know I was writing some, some pretty edgy stuff and it was, I really enjoyed what I was writing at the time. It was, I thought it was pretty cool. And, uh, uh, you took to it as well.

[00:13:26] You thought, you know, I could, I could visually I could, I could put some stuff to this. I could work with this. And I thought, you know what nobody's ever, nobody has ever offered to do that. And I was like, you know what, go for it, do what you will with it. And you did. And it just, it took off. And then. Um, about that time too.

[00:13:49] I think even before that you actually published me in the, in a magazine down there. Yeah. He took some of my columns. You’ve done more for my career than I have, Wes.

[00:14:06] Wesley: [00:14:06] Um, I'll tell you, uh, let me give you more perspective on that time. I published you on Consciousness and the website is very much live we just don’t

[00:14:19] Yeah, both Karabo and my life has gotten totally different directions. We still comrades and we still chat and so on and so on but especially now with covid things have just really changed, but um

[00:14:31] we still get, we still get hits and the website you can still access your work there. But I remember between 2011 say 2009, till about 2012/2011 there. We were, we were pretty cool

[00:14:52] because we could focus a lot on poetry versus like, what else, what else we were publishing. Um, and also the content, like what you were writing about, because, you know, we were more a pan africanist based writing and a lot of the stuff had this revolution element, and I thought, you know try something different for a change, and people took to it. Yeah.

[00:15:26] Mike: [00:15:26] That’s very cool. Thank you very much. 

[00:15:29] Wesley: [00:15:29] okay. Yeah, man. Uh, yeah, the, um, the body of work that we do just to give my listeners some, uh, I guess like, sort of a sketch at that time was also when I started to experiment using poetry in my artwork text, um, like that was 10 years ago. Now it's a completely different level. Yeah, and I use all these, but. There was a, this is sort of where I want to go into your work, because I remember specifically one artwork really really closely and I’ll tell you the image that they used

[00:16:08] um, it was the guy sitting, uh, the guy with a, with a hat, against a wall, and the, the, the, the work was really fucking depressing. It was dark. And I was actually referencing an old photo of a very Um, well know South African artist called Dumile Feni. He died in the USA in about 1919. And I can talk about Feni’s work for a long, long time, but he was really one of my

[00:16:41] Influence in my life. And he was also kind of misunderstood and a bit of a crazy guy. And I, and I, and, and you know, that photo that George Hale took of him and, uh, I use your work on top of it because I remember you were writing really that piece that I was referring to it wasn’t just lonely, but it gave loneliness like, uh, I would say different perspective. Um, do you recall the piece I’m talking about?

[00:17:18] Mike: [00:17:18] I can, I can recall all the, I can recall the art piece, but I can't recall. Pull them off the top of my head wes. I'm. When you tell me how you drew the inspiration to take the poem and wow. I’m floored

[00:17:40] Wesley: [00:17:40] As I looking for, I, I was looking for a long time. I left my fucking job, so to speak.

[00:17:56] Um, I, um, yeah, I mean, I could, I could relate to that piece. Um, yeah,

[00:18:10] but, um, yeah, man, um, that was, uh, that was a lot of fun. 

[00:18:16] Mike: [00:18:16] It was, I, that was a blast. I was so proud of that. I, I was, I was, I was so proud of that. That was. Yeah, that was the highlight. 

[00:18:28] Wesley: [00:18:28] It was absolutely. 

[00:18:30] Mike: [00:18:30] Go take the deepest, darkest pits of my fucking misery, you know, and, and have it out there for everybody to see 

[00:18:40] Wesley: [00:18:40] your work is your work.

[00:18:41] As you said, you sent me a few, a few pieces. Definitely. Probably not last year or the year before that, but I know it was, it was recent enough and you were touching some really dark, really dark places and you were

[00:19:01] Yeah, without like without being over dramatic tell us tell my listeners about that because I know you also suffer from a mental condition, correct?

[00:19:11] Mike: [00:19:11] I have a traumatic brain injury and we're also still trying to figure out  everything else that goes along with that. My brain injury stems from a car accident. Almost 15 years ago. And so, you know, well, everything else that goes along with, with brain injuries, that the emotions, the instability, the anxiety, you know, just trying to learn to channel it.

[00:19:58] Um, yeah, there for a while. Um, I was, I was writing some, some really dark stuff and it got some, I got some pretty good reaction. Um, and then, uh, I found medical marijuana and it's not quite as dark anymore.

[00:20:26] It's a little more, it's a little more out there.

[00:20:34] I'm still out there creating. I don't know what I'm creating, but I'm creating. Wesley: Let me just jump in there because I find that fascinating. Mike: Why not? Wesley: Because I remember at the time Colorado was busy legalising weed, correct?

[00:21:00] Mike: [00:21:00] Colorado was one of the first two states to legalise in America.

[00:21:11] Time at the time. Well, no, this is, this is actually the weed cough.

[00:21:18] Just I had, I had me a good bowl before I came on. Hey, it's legal, you know, what can I say? And it’s my medicine.

[00:21:30] Actually it is, it is.

[00:21:36] Wesley: [00:21:36] yeah tell us about that because I’m fascinated, as I said, um, one thing, one thing I'm very interested in sort of like, you know, nosy work for a little while, because a few of the pieces, as I said was really dark shit and um , I don’t get offended very easily but I was like yo this guy is going there.

[00:21:57] Mike: [00:21:57] So here’s the thing. So I worked in, I worked in law enforcement for 12 years. Right. Um, prior to which now I'm just fucking ashamed of seriously, you know, we'll get into that later. But so, you know, I was, I was taking 15 pills a day.

[00:22:22] Yeah, uh, there for a while. And so my wife and two doctors had to convince me to try medical marijuana, and I finally did, and I'm down to six pills a day.

[00:22:47] Fucking fantastic. You know, all things considered, well, all things considered you know.

[00:22:51] Wesley: [00:22:51] And there’s no side effects?

[00:22:55] Mike: [00:22:55] Well, not as far as I’m concerned

[00:23:10] Wesley: [00:23:10] But I mean if you should weigh your options versus pharmaceuticals versus medical marijuana I think it’s kind of a no brainer. Mike: absolutely.

[00:23:16] I take naps. And I, you know, I still have my down days, you know, I still have days where I feel like shit and I have to, I have to rest, but you know, it's not like before where I was sleeping for, you know, two to three hours every single day, you know, on top of sleeping for, for, you know, 10 to 11 hours at night, you know, I was just, I was not functioning.

[00:23:42] Yeah. So right now I feel fantastic

[00:23:48] Wesley: [00:23:48] Um, do you have, um, I guess

[00:23:54] because you say you were in like that dark place, did it, did it, uh, Does your perception on life change?

[00:24:06] There was a, there was a lot going on man. So how is your outlook on life

[00:24:13] at the moment before we get into the poetry again,

[00:24:19] Mike: [00:24:19] so the day that I got my first COVID shot. Was March 10th and I got a message request on Facebook and you, you know, usually, and you know, as well as I do, it's usually like a spam, hot stuff, you know?

[00:24:49] And I, I look at it and of course it's a female and I'm like, oh boy. And I open it up. Then it's like, hi, Michael. You know,]]>c241050a-d9ac-421f-a084-a35610e33c12Fri, 23 Jul 2021 08:00:00 +020047:49falsefull6060Candice NolanPhoto Realism and SurrealismWe talk photo realism and surrealism with Kimberley based art Genn Art. Wesley unpacks her process , technique and methodology behind surrealism. This is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley Pepper: [00:00:00] Thanks everybody, uh, wesley pepper and you're tuned into my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexia, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Uh, Yeah, man. Just on last week's episode. Um, I was flying solo last week, um, and if you remember correctly, um, there was a bit of a scheduling nightmare. The poets I was going to feature feature had all.

[00:00:31] Yeah. It was a bit of a scheduling thing is I couldn't get hold of them on time. So just to recap what I spoke about last week, I told you guys about the action research project that I'm working on. I will still do an episode on that probably towards the end of the year, because as we know the recording of this episode, the 29th of

[00:00:48] June, you know, we had another hard lockdown, so everything is postponed or put back. So it really makes it really difficult to do a follow up on that side. I don't even know when I'll be able to do that, but, um, I'll be keeping guys up to speed on my social media pages and all of that. So yeah, moving on to today's episode today

[00:01:03] we are gonna make another episode on with a, with an artist based in Kimberley. Um, she's a photo or her technique is very reminiscent of photo realism. And she also works with, uh, surrealism themes. So when a matter of unpacking, um, getting arts, um, we're going to be unpacking processes when I went back in how she works, how she conceptualizes the work and a little bit about art, because as you know, I'm based in Kimberly or other from ya, and I've been based in it for since COVID.

[00:01:35] So it's really cool to meet creators from, from, from Kimberley. And this will also be a live recording. In other words, we're not using zoom today. So she's sitting with me in the studio today. So that's just going to be. Actually I'm looking forward to that. Um, so yeah, we were unpacking all of that. Um, remember my art giveaway is still up for grabs, uh, like, subscribe and comment.

[00:01:54] On this episode, you could have an artwork done by yours truly. Remember. Um, I forgot to mention last week that the art giveaway is only available for artists in South Africa, because I just can’t afford to send art abroad, uh, coming from my own pocket. Um, so yeah, just remember like subscribe and comment on this episode, you can win artwork done by yours truly.

[00:02:13] And, um, I'll tell you, I'll speak to guys at the end of the episode about future episodes. We've got some really cool things coming up. Um, some really cool, exciting guests coming up and I'll explain that to you guys. You know this at the end of the episode. So now, um, I hope you guys enjoy, uh, Again, Jen, out 

[00:02:33] Genn Art: [00:02:33] of my full leg.

[00:02:36] Wesley Pepper: [00:02:36] Okay. So I hope you guys enjoy today's episode with Genevieve . After this 

[00:02:44] spudcaster: [00:02:44] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts. Podcast your life with baobulb.org. 

[00:03:03] Wesley Pepper: [00:03:03] Alrighty, here we go. Uh, Genevieve, Genevieve, Genevieve Clarke.

[00:03:09] Welcome. Uh, yeah man, let's get straight into it. So like I said, we were talking offline. Um, I was telling you how I saw it work. And the themes you're working on some really interesting stuff. So just for my guests, since you are new to the platform, um, tell us like where you come from, um, and your journey in the arts.

[00:03:31]...]]>We talk photo realism and surrealism with Kimberley based art Genn Art. Wesley unpacks her process , technique and methodology behind surrealism. This is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley Pepper: [00:00:00] Thanks everybody, uh, wesley pepper and you're tuned into my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexia, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Uh, Yeah, man. Just on last week's episode. Um, I was flying solo last week, um, and if you remember correctly, um, there was a bit of a scheduling nightmare. The poets I was going to feature feature had all.

[00:00:31] Yeah. It was a bit of a scheduling thing is I couldn't get hold of them on time. So just to recap what I spoke about last week, I told you guys about the action research project that I'm working on. I will still do an episode on that probably towards the end of the year, because as we know the recording of this episode, the 29th of

[00:00:48] June, you know, we had another hard lockdown, so everything is postponed or put back. So it really makes it really difficult to do a follow up on that side. I don't even know when I'll be able to do that, but, um, I'll be keeping guys up to speed on my social media pages and all of that. So yeah, moving on to today's episode today

[00:01:03] we are gonna make another episode on with a, with an artist based in Kimberley. Um, she's a photo or her technique is very reminiscent of photo realism. And she also works with, uh, surrealism themes. So when a matter of unpacking, um, getting arts, um, we're going to be unpacking processes when I went back in how she works, how she conceptualizes the work and a little bit about art, because as you know, I'm based in Kimberly or other from ya, and I've been based in it for since COVID.

[00:01:35] So it's really cool to meet creators from, from, from Kimberley. And this will also be a live recording. In other words, we're not using zoom today. So she's sitting with me in the studio today. So that's just going to be. Actually I'm looking forward to that. Um, so yeah, we were unpacking all of that. Um, remember my art giveaway is still up for grabs, uh, like, subscribe and comment.

[00:01:54] On this episode, you could have an artwork done by yours truly. Remember. Um, I forgot to mention last week that the art giveaway is only available for artists in South Africa, because I just can’t afford to send art abroad, uh, coming from my own pocket. Um, so yeah, just remember like subscribe and comment on this episode, you can win artwork done by yours truly.

[00:02:13] And, um, I'll tell you, I'll speak to guys at the end of the episode about future episodes. We've got some really cool things coming up. Um, some really cool, exciting guests coming up and I'll explain that to you guys. You know this at the end of the episode. So now, um, I hope you guys enjoy, uh, Again, Jen, out 

[00:02:33] Genn Art: [00:02:33] of my full leg.

[00:02:36] Wesley Pepper: [00:02:36] Okay. So I hope you guys enjoy today's episode with Genevieve . After this 

[00:02:44] spudcaster: [00:02:44] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts. Podcast your life with baobulb.org. 

[00:03:03] Wesley Pepper: [00:03:03] Alrighty, here we go. Uh, Genevieve, Genevieve, Genevieve Clarke.

[00:03:09] Welcome. Uh, yeah man, let's get straight into it. So like I said, we were talking offline. Um, I was telling you how I saw it work. And the themes you're working on some really interesting stuff. So just for my guests, since you are new to the platform, um, tell us like where you come from, um, and your journey in the arts.

[00:03:31] Genn Art: [00:03:31] Well, um, my full name is Genevieve Clarke. I am from Welkom the Free State originally born and bred halfway there, and then moved to Kimberly 2010. And finished school year 2012, studied in the university of Free State 2013 till 2016. And I've just been working under my alias or brand Genn Art since then. 

[00:03:56] Wesley Pepper: [00:03:56] Yeah, tell us a little bit about the name.

[00:03:57] How did you come up with the name and as Genn ge double n, 

[00:04:00] Genn Art: [00:04:00] right? Yes. G E double N A R T. Um, if you break up the name, actually it's people call me Genna. So it's G E double N A and then the other side is the art. So I just put that together. Yeah. And the A in the middle with my logo, I actually replaced it with an eye.

[00:04:20] Um, based on concepts I've followed, interested, or in love with supposing I could, I, all those types of things, um, with a pen, pencil, and a paintbrush. But actually frames the eyes. That's the art part of it. Yeah. 

[00:04:38] Wesley Pepper: [00:04:38] So you were saying that, um, you mean, um, you've been drawing for what? Since? 

[00:04:44] Genn Art: [00:04:44] No. I've actually been drawing since I've been drawing since 2009.

[00:04:53] I was in primary school man. Primary school. It was, it was, it started as an outlet. And it was just something I did at home. I was always just drawing random stuff, sketching things I saw or thought of, um, And then as I got better at it, and my friends actually started seeing it, they were like, could you draw me in that?

[00:05:15] At that time, they were like, oh, this person can do looking back now. It's like, uh, but okay. We all have to start somewhere. You check. So, um, yeah, I've been drawing since primary school, actually. I just never published or showed anyone. It was just that. Well, so I was never a person who would speak about my emotions.

[00:05:34] I was always the bubbly one, so it was never like I would go to someone and be like, your friend, I need support about this or whatever. I just, I channeled into drawing instinctively. 

[00:05:47] Wesley Pepper: [00:05:47] Like I said offline. Um, I'm interested about the technique, um, just for the guests. Um, like one of the reasons why I remember, um, we did, uh, we did a two part series with, uh, Wilson Ngoni and he was he to you also was, a photo realist.

[00:06:02] Um, that technique is everywhere now. It's all over social media. Um, and also brands like bic pen. I know, um, white star, uh, the, the pap brand, I know they also commission, uh, Agh there’s a few others if I must think hard enough that does that. It does. Does commission artists to do, uh, uh, use that technique to paint various, uh, popular dinges and all of that.

[00:06:26] So it's a very popular thing. Right. So let's just put that aside. So explain to me. How did you, uh, where does your, where does your creativity come from? Where's your, where, so where does your art skills come from? Um, and how did you sort of hone your techniques? So we know, yeah. Explain to me a little bit about that.

[00:06:45] Genn Art: [00:06:45] I think it was, I was cultured and I was, my culture was nurtured by my surroundings and the people in my life. Um, I was always surrounded with people who loved creating content. And when it came to photographs, I was always exposed to either people being photographers or people, you know, being involved with photographs like photographic things or whatever the case may be.

[00:07:12] Um, we love taking photographs, um, as a household. So we also had that end was always that crazy thing of my dad liked drawing like cartoons in ways that you'd never know. He was going to end up there like nowadays, it’s like trick forms. It's easy to trick anyone, but back then it was like, goddamn, you know, it, he didn't know it was going to be Pinocchio or whatever the case may be, you know?

[00:07:38] Or that Dollar signed, we all first started with those three, the three lines of the top three lines of the bottom. And you just connect all of those lines on of the dollar sign that you see. I like drawing. I like taking photos and then every time I started drawing, like my things just started becoming more realistic regardless of whether I try to strive for the realism or not.

[00:08:02] I actually never thought of myself as, um, yeah, I, I can’t say that I've planned to even be an artist. I didn't even know you could formally study to be one. Um, I never, I was never exposed to art. Visual art, fine art. Yeah. I was never exposed to that. I was, I was more exposed to music. Um, like I say, photography, that type of thing in terms of my schooling, my schooling was actually the one thing that it saved me in a sense where exposed me.

[00:08:39] Yes. Exposed me to something that I didn't know. Anything about, and as soon as I got a taste of it, it was like every opportunity that jumped up, I was like, I want to try that. I want to do that. I want to do this. I want to do that. And then somewhere along the line, like I had. Arts and crafts things. I realised like as much as I didn't believe that I would want to become an artist, I loved creating.

[00:09:02] So when they were like, okay, for the first time we're going to have arts and crafts, it's going to be between half past two and half past four, you got to come this time, do that, and whatever. Put your name out for the schedule and it's going to be for the term and whatever the case may be.

[00:09:18] I was just excited. Are you going to be creating stuff? You know, when you at home, you don't have all the material. When you're at school, they give you the opportunity whether you have to pay for it or not. So I was just like, I'm going to go to these classes. 

[00:09:30] Wesley Pepper: [00:09:30] That's interesting. That's interesting.

[00:09:31] Uh, what stuck out there was the fact that there was no, um, like formal art education background. That's interesting. Um, and the only creative expression you really, uh, open towards music. And that's also pretty interesting. What type of music just before we go on. Genre’s music musicians.

[00:09:52] Genn Art: [00:09:52] Genre’s. The golden oldies was my parents. Definitely, but my dad is very different. Everyone knows that. So he, he also listens to reggae music and he doesn't look like he's that strict person, you know?

[00:10:08] you know, not even topics afterwards or whatever, but when you listen to his type of music, you like, you never think he listens to this. Um, my uncles that listened to Eminem, but they lawyers and you just like put them together. And it's just like that total contrast and opposite. And it's like, when people see me, they're like you listen to a lot of rock and art.

[00:10:26] And I was like, if you look at my playlist, nothing makes sense because I've been exposed to so many different I've learned to like adapt and also teach and learn. So now I feel like I'm just like this whole Pandora's box, filled with all these interesting things 

[00:10:42] Wesley Pepper: [00:10:42] Interesting. I was actually reading, uh, last night, um, that the brain actually, um, it's actually it rewrites or re routes or rewrites itself.

[00:10:50] Um, um, um, if the person has to do multiple genres of music and it actually, you actually become smarter over long-term. me to I also listen to multiple genres of music. Um, So, so that, so that's that, that, that's, that's pretty interesting. That's pretty interesting. So, um, um, let's jump into the actual processes, right?

[00:11:10] So, um, as you know, and we also spoke off air of the whole shift these days is, uh, celebrities, drawing celebrities, and that's kind of easy to, uh, to figure out why, because, uh, Pop culture, social media, that pans out. Well, you look at the ex American president, he was a celebrity, the, you look at our current politicians there’s a bunch of celebrities.

[00:11:34] They're so

[00:11:39] it's, it's, it's really next level type of thing. So it makes sense why people person, I don't really like it, but that's not the topic. What subject matter? How did you or uh, what subject method did you use to, uh, to grow your technique? What were you drawing and why? Um, 

[00:11:56] Genn Art: [00:11:56] I use a lot of, okay. First and foremost, like ever since I started like drawing people really well, it became this thing of Genna, will you please draw me?

[00:12:06] And at first it was fun. It was fun. You know, it really is friend. And so like, you have to like sit for days with this face and you realize, look, my body's not going to. This is going to take a toll. So we have to find a sustainable way of being able to create shit. So I had to actually get to the part where, um, I used my sister and my mom only as my portfolio for my models as my models for my portfolio, whether they wanted it or not, because I actually now am the person that takes most of the photographs for families.

[00:12:43] Whether they ask me or not random ones prepared ones scheduled ones, when we're together. It's like photos. When we're not together, I'd take photos. So, um, I use a lot of photographs that I either take to go into intentionally, as in I knew actually I wanted to use this photograph or something, or I see something and I'm just like, oh, I could use this for that purpose.

[00:13:06] So it starts with. I started with my mom and my sister while my friends, actually my friends and my family. And then it's just now my mom and my sister and I experiment with a lot of techniques. Um, a lot of concepts. Uh, I just experiment a lot, but it will always be my mom's sister and myself, uh, graphite pencil. Yeah. So far,

[00:13:34] Wesley Pepper: [00:13:34] how long does it take for you to complete a portrait? 

[00:13:37] Genn Art: [00:13:37] It depends actually because every single day so different. And if I dedicate a specific amount of hours, I can finish it probably in two days, maximum two days maximum, but I do so much other stuff that I break down the hours for myself.

[00:13:53] So it would take at least a week maximum now, because I look at things now at a way more finer detail before my eyes trained a bit more. Now that takes time. Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:14:07] Wesley Pepper: [00:14:07] Um, um, just, just, just, just, just, just to add on that, um, I know that, um, with artists, your eye, your eye get sharp, uh, uh, your perception and the way your brain remembers, um, out, remember there was this, uh, they said that, uh, If you look at an object, um, your brain remembers everything I think is for five seconds.

[00:14:28] And after that you start drawing what you think you've seen. Um, and I know, uh, guys who got really strong attention to detail, their memory is pretty sharp. Um, so your artwork, do you use colour?

[00:14:41] Genn Art: [00:14:41] I, I rarely use colour for drawing, but I'm not only a sketch or drawer per se or whatever they like to call it.

[00:14:50] I do paintings as well. Um, so I do Gouache paintings, oil paintings and acrylic paintings. Yeah. So that's the only time or most of the time that I'd be using colour actually.

[00:15:04] Wesley Pepper: [00:15:04] So tell me about your subject matter. So you, okay. Hold on. Um, before you get there, uh, How I see if you starting off with family members.

[00:15:12] So there's that personal aspect, uh, you know, emotionally, you know, them spiritually. Um, so to look at them and to conceptualise that I understand that, uh, Uh, other, what other subject matter outside that, do you, um, because I kind of want to move into your, into the, into the surrealist theme, but I want to get down.

[00:15:33] So I don't want to build up to that. Um, because, um, what I know, um, when I was, uh, I was, when I was a young fellow, when I was in my teens, um, I'd draw lots and lots of self-portraits. Um, that was my thing. I used to sit in front of a mirror and. Um, what I, um, what are I used to do? I think every two years I have to do a self portrait of myself.

[00:15:56] Yeah. I stopped some years ago for a bunch of reasons, but, uh, uh, it was, it was the digital, the personal subject matter. That was very, very, very, very personal. And it made me once I was comfortable with my technique, it made it that made it easier to, to, to, to, to sort of venture into other, uh, uh, Uh, genres and other subject matters and stuff.

[00:16:17] So explain to me your approach. Uh, so you started off with your sister and your mom. I understand that. So yeah. How did it move from there? Yeah. 

[00:16:25] Genn Art: [00:16:25] With, with them, it's more of experimenting with techniques when I use them as subject matter. But when I convey specific messages, I use my sister and myself only because my sister and I are growing up in a different time in comparison to my mom.

[00:16:41] So I feel like we have a lot of messages or stuff that I would like to address. So I usually use that as my platform to convey a message or something. So for example, body positivity or even negativity, um, I would really. Portraits or photographs of my sister and myself, and like our stretch marks and stuff like that, you know?

[00:17:04] So it's, it's, it's not even any more about who I'm using. I've just found a sense of comfort in being able to transpire my message, but using it either through my sister or myself or my mom as a subject matter. Yeah. Respective of what the concept may be. So if I speak about my personality or if I speak about, um, stuff that I feel negative, or I have doubts or stuff, and people think like, oh, now this person is like always happy and shit.

[00:17:36] And then you do artworks and you read the captionings like. Like I also go through that. I'm a human being at the end of the day. And then I tell them, they're like, who's this? And I'm like, that's actually me. So like my WhatsApp photo at the Mo at the, at the moment is an oil painting I did of myself before I actually locked my hair.

[00:17:56] So, um, I dyed my hair orange back then. I'm very experimental with my hair. And then I was thinking of a lot of things recently. Um, Yeah, a lot has been happening this year. And it was just, it got to that point where, because I was so stuck in my head, I felt like my own head was a prison, regardless of whether I spoke to people or not.

[00:18:21] So I drew like a prison in my head. 

[00:18:25] Wesley Pepper: [00:18:25] Interesting. Um, you and your sister, you've got a very close relationship. Um, older or younger 

[00:18:30] Genn Art: [00:18:30] younger. She is, I think seven years younger than me. She's turning 20 this year. 

[00:18:37] Wesley Pepper: [00:18:37] Um, okay. So I like the, that's a very interesting point about how you conceptualise what's going on in your head and the photo that you used on WhatsApp.

[00:18:47] That's a seamless, uh, image. Um, did you read up on surrealism before? Did you, uh, you know, did you have. I guess, did you like...]]>cf06154b-375e-4be9-9cbd-6f5767cf8970Fri, 16 Jul 2021 08:00:00 +020050:05falsefull5959Candice NolanFlying SoloI'm flying solo today to give an update on the ' pro or anti vaxx' question /project and a run down on the Action research (Youth Street Parliament) project I'm currently working on. This is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Everybody Wesley Pepper here and you’re tuned into my podcast, Wesley Pepper’s, art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Thanks everybody for tuning in, uh, greetings to all my new and existing listeners. Thank you for coming. I mean that, I think. Um, yeah. Thanks for coming in. Thanks for tuning in, man.

[00:00:28] Yeah. Um, let's start off with, um, a recap on last week's episode. Thanks. Thanks to Ikaye for coming through, my brother. Really enjoyed your, uh, your energy. I really enjoyed the energy guys, a very passionate guy. Um, I'm sure you could have heard and really cool coolest insight, I thought it was really insightful how we described, you know, the behind the scenes, side of documentary making the technical side.

[00:00:50] I really enjoyed that. I also enjoyed his opinion on COVID cause he was really honest and I like the way he said it'll change. So I took, I understand you. I, and I understand what you're saying. Yeah, man. Um, moving on to today's episode, uh, I had 

[00:01:07] I had to move this episode up by two weeks. 

[00:01:12] Actually I was going to do it in a roundabout, uh, round about the 9th of July, but, um, My guests, my originally scheduled guests, um, there was a bit of a scheduling problem, you know, Blessed.

[00:01:25] I mean, he's, he's son, you know, his lady gave birth to his son and Zama also had a bit of a. Yeah. A bit of a scheduling thing, so I had to move things around a bit, but no stress, man. Um, I'll be. Yeah, those, those are two episodes I'm really looking forward to because they're all going to be based all around poetry, which is, I actually never done an episode, which is just about poetry.

[00:01:48] So definitely looking forward to talking to those brothers. Um, and I'll be giving you guys like, you know, I'll be telling you guys when. You know, when they'll be coming up, um, on my social media pages in those handles, I'll give to you at the end of this episode. 

[00:02:02] Um, so today's episode I’m flying 

[00:02:05] solo and, um, I'm actually going to talk to you about two things.

[00:02:08] Uh, firstly is a project, a really cool, uh, Action research project that I was part of last year with south Africans city network, and Ebukhosini solutions with Baba Buntu. 

[00:02:21] It was really, really dope, man. I'm going to explain to you guys why, 

[00:02:24] um, also a lot about, um, being by being part of this, um, research project also gave me a lot of insight to, uh, You know what I wanted to invite on this platform because we came up with some really, really intresting data and I would explain it to you guys, but about my, um, my role in it, you know, um, I was a creative coordinator.

[00:02:44] Um, it was really interesting. It was really interesting. So I would unpack that a bit, but, and I will also tell you is, um, give us a bit of a recap, which I think is kind of necessary because as you know, I've been asking my guests every single week about their opinion on, um, COVID-19 so I will give you guys a bit of a recap because I think it's really.

[00:02:59] And it's really something that I'm 

[00:03:01] really glad that 

[00:03:02] I started, uh, monitoring from the beginning of the year, because I just see it just growing and growing. So, yeah, man, that's, what's, that's, what's going to happen today. Um, I hope you guys will find today's...]]>I'm flying solo today to give an update on the ' pro or anti vaxx' question /project and a run down on the Action research (Youth Street Parliament) project I'm currently working on. This is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Everybody Wesley Pepper here and you’re tuned into my podcast, Wesley Pepper’s, art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Thanks everybody for tuning in, uh, greetings to all my new and existing listeners. Thank you for coming. I mean that, I think. Um, yeah. Thanks for coming in. Thanks for tuning in, man.

[00:00:28] Yeah. Um, let's start off with, um, a recap on last week's episode. Thanks. Thanks to Ikaye for coming through, my brother. Really enjoyed your, uh, your energy. I really enjoyed the energy guys, a very passionate guy. Um, I'm sure you could have heard and really cool coolest insight, I thought it was really insightful how we described, you know, the behind the scenes, side of documentary making the technical side.

[00:00:50] I really enjoyed that. I also enjoyed his opinion on COVID cause he was really honest and I like the way he said it'll change. So I took, I understand you. I, and I understand what you're saying. Yeah, man. Um, moving on to today's episode, uh, I had 

[00:01:07] I had to move this episode up by two weeks. 

[00:01:12] Actually I was going to do it in a roundabout, uh, round about the 9th of July, but, um, My guests, my originally scheduled guests, um, there was a bit of a scheduling problem, you know, Blessed.

[00:01:25] I mean, he's, he's son, you know, his lady gave birth to his son and Zama also had a bit of a. Yeah. A bit of a scheduling thing, so I had to move things around a bit, but no stress, man. Um, I'll be. Yeah, those, those are two episodes I'm really looking forward to because they're all going to be based all around poetry, which is, I actually never done an episode, which is just about poetry.

[00:01:48] So definitely looking forward to talking to those brothers. Um, and I'll be giving you guys like, you know, I'll be telling you guys when. You know, when they'll be coming up, um, on my social media pages in those handles, I'll give to you at the end of this episode. 

[00:02:02] Um, so today's episode I’m flying 

[00:02:05] solo and, um, I'm actually going to talk to you about two things.

[00:02:08] Uh, firstly is a project, a really cool, uh, Action research project that I was part of last year with south Africans city network, and Ebukhosini solutions with Baba Buntu. 

[00:02:21] It was really, really dope, man. I'm going to explain to you guys why, 

[00:02:24] um, also a lot about, um, being by being part of this, um, research project also gave me a lot of insight to, uh, You know what I wanted to invite on this platform because we came up with some really, really intresting data and I would explain it to you guys, but about my, um, my role in it, you know, um, I was a creative coordinator.

[00:02:44] Um, it was really interesting. It was really interesting. So I would unpack that a bit, but, and I will also tell you is, um, give us a bit of a recap, which I think is kind of necessary because as you know, I've been asking my guests every single week about their opinion on, um, COVID-19 so I will give you guys a bit of a recap because I think it's really.

[00:02:59] And it's really something that I'm 

[00:03:01] really glad that 

[00:03:02] I started, uh, monitoring from the beginning of the year, because I just see it just growing and growing. So, yeah, man, that's, what's, that's, what's going to happen today. Um, I hope you guys will find today's episode kind of interesting. I hope you do, uh, I’ll be doing my best.

[00:03:16] Uh, yeah. So I'll talk to you straight after this. 

[00:03:21] spudcaster: [00:03:21] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcasts, your life with baobulb.org, 

[00:03:39] Wesley: [00:03:39] Hey everybody. Yes. Wesley Pepper here again. Uh, yeah, let's get straight into it.

[00:03:43] Um, as I said in the intro, I'm going to be talking about two topics in particular, the first being the. The data that I collected so far on, um, on, uh, 

[00:03:54] the pro versus anti-vax, 

[00:03:57] um, top, um, theme that I've been asking all my guests. So just to recap very quickly, I've been doing that since the, uh, since the first episode this year.

[00:04:06] Um, and, uh, I've been asking all my guests right towards the end of the, uh, uh, of the interview, um, reason for doing that is because by that time we were a bit more comfortable and a bit more easier talking to each other. And I will sort of get an honest, um, answer, which is what I was looking for. And the information I've been getting was was, was a lot, um, that's the right word to say, but it was substantial.

[00:04:31] And, um, I've got, um, I categorise it sort of in three. Um, and the first one being the guys who was like, hell no, the, the, the guys in the middle who says, like, we don't really have a choice and the other 

[00:04:41] guys were like, nah, or like, well, yes, 

[00:04:44] but, uh, You know, there's always a bit of a, but, um, and I guess the, but there at the end of the day is

[00:04:51] I don't think anybody really 

[00:04:53] was like too keen to get like that jab in there. 

[00:04:57] Um, you know, I can't pick that up. I don't know. I think if, if, if anybody had a choice, they would have probably just said no, but you know, circumstance 

[00:05:05] has it that we don't really do. And that's part 

[00:05:08] of the reason why. You know, I’m doing this.

[00:05:10] And, um, most of the guys, what I, what I've noticed that the overwhelming majority, um, of my guests are working class people, you know, artists 

[00:05:21] who are working, 

[00:05:22] they've got responsibilities, et cetera, et cetera. And, uh, You know, we have careers and the career usually comes first. And in order to, I guess, to have a career, you don't really have, have a choice.

[00:05:35] So, um, most of them, um, um, well, we don't really have a choice and that's, that is, that is the vast majority actually, uh, 

[00:05:45] of that. I would say 

[00:05:46] they, they, they, in about the plus 40% of, uh, you know, uh, just over, let’s say under 50%, definitely. Um, but of that 40 let's just give it a round figures, a lot 45% of them, of those 45%.

[00:06:05] Some of them and don't have the, uh, well, some of them, especially 

[00:06:08] the south Africans, uh, I don't have an exact number, which I 

[00:06:12] was what I was trying to say. I like, like, we don't really have a choice and some of them are like, yes, we believe in the science, 

[00:06:21] but that's like, no, I don't really have a choice.

[00:06:22] I just got to work. And I don't really have a choice. The guys who were 

[00:06:22] I just got to work. And I don't really have a choice. The guys who were 

[00:06:25] saying no. Um, like, hell no, like 

[00:06:28] keep that shit away from me. Um, these are the guys, uh, who's mostly coming from a Pan Africanist, uh, black consciousness train of thought. And, um, these are the guys who are like, who's using 

[00:06:42] there history to 

[00:06:43] justify those because as you know, black people, black bodies has been used as experimental things for everything.

[00:06:50] It's not, you know, it’s for everything for years. So that's 

[00:06:54] just like, I get them, I get them. But, um, 

[00:06:58] Well, geez. I guess time will tell 

[00:07:00] a and then the last 

[00:07:01] group, 

[00:07:02] the ones who are like, yes, yes, yes, 

[00:07:04] yes. We believe in science and everything. That's like really the smallest, the smallest group. Um, and, um, I'm part of that group.

[00:07:11] I'll add actually two of my, uh, guests as I, um, you know, w when I was interviewing them already, um, were vaccinated or, um, One was and one was in the process of doing that. So that was also pretty interesting given that here in South Africa, the, uh, the vaccination drive has been, uh, very slow and it was just too many politics around that, but it is very interesting because what I'm going to do with all of this data is, um, till the end of the year I'm going to see, um, how people's perceptions and perspectives has, um, has changed.

[00:07:46] If they have, and I'm going to be sort of conceptualise the artwork around that. It'll definitely be a public. Okay. Maybe not definitely, but. It'll definitely have a interactive nature of audit because I think that's kind of important. Yeah. Uh, given that it is so important and like just my last and closing point on where I am so far in this experiment is that everyone is very opinionated about it.

[00:08:13] Um, everybody has an opinion out of all my guests. I can only recall. Yeah, no, actually only one. Now that I'm looking at his name that was like, you know, I never really 

[00:08:24] thought about it. 

[00:08:25] And the reason is, because I challenged them on that, was that they were never really, you know, confronted like, okay, I need to travel.

[00:08:32] I need to move. I need to, they were like, ah, I'm okay for now where I am. So I won't think of it. And it's going to be interesting to see how those guys perspectives change over time. So yeah, that's regarding the, uh, let's just call it the project that I'm running. 

[00:08:50] Um, the 

[00:08:51] anti versus Pro-vax project that I'm running.

[00:08:54] And, um, I asked a whole bunch of people, um, and they were from all over the world, really from, from Europe, from the us, from them, from SA, um, from Botswana. So a little bit from everywhere from . So, uh, I would say I've got a, yeah, let’s just cost the net and say I've got a good. Yeah. Pool of people I'm getting all those data from.

[00:09:19] So, but we'll see how far I get towards the end of the year. That's going to be really interesting. And I'm going to be asking, um, yeah, we're going to see how they're going to change and, um, 

[00:09:28] actually that's actually a good point to end off on, um, and moving 

[00:09:32] into my, um, Into the next thing I want to talk about today, um, is my, uh, the, the project that I was involved in with south African city network and Ebukhosini solutions.

[00:09:43] Um, so it was a, um, I was drafted. I don’t know if that’s the right word, 

[00:09:49] but I became part 

[00:09:51] of this project. Because of the work that I've been doing as a street artist in Johannesburg, 

[00:09:57] um, I worked. I was more active as a 

[00:10:00] street around about between 2013 to about 2016, 2017. After that, like, you know, things just change.

[00:10:10] And I mean, I definitely the last, uh, mural, uh, or it wasn't well it was a mural, but it was a mixed media mural was in 2018 that I did. Um, and that was there in Newtown and Andrew and I were still collaborating with on, um, on that, uh, 

[00:10:27] And, uh, yeah, 

[00:10:28] that one should still be there, but I know all my other murals around the inner city, I know that, or being worked over or just sort of like disappeared within the inner city, you know, like pollution and dirt, you know, eventually people paste all these posters over.

[00:10:43] And so they sort of like, just become part of the city's landscape eventually, which is sort of part of the, you know, the idea behind it. But yeah, I mean, I got pulled into that, um, because of the, uh, Because all the projects that I used to do on the street was to do with interactive was having people interact, physically interact with art and, um, sort of, you know, that was the experience.

[00:11:05] That was what we were doing was, was what was allowing people to come into the sort of creative space and enjoying the art and then 

[00:11:14] leaving and not ask them to buy anything. 

[00:11:17] So, yeah, it's with that, that I've got that I got pulled in and. Just to give you guys just a recap on what the project was. So it was a, it's a research project, um, that are trying to document the experiences of young people in urban areas with the aim of understanding their concerns, that South Africans, uh, You know what, trying to understand their concerns.

[00:11:41] Um, 

[00:11:42] and so you, why, or sort of understand why there's this gap between the youth and like the rest of us, 

[00:11:48] because as we know, um, and what we understood from the research there was that there's this huge gap because the, the, the youth and the youth are, uh, to, to be specific or. Well people from the age of 14 and 35.

[00:12:03] And, um, our research was based only in Gauteng. Um, it was on the east and the west rand, we asked, um, quote unquote, predominantly poor neighbourhoods. Um, but because of COVID-19 because the project was going to be hands-on and we're going to have like actual physical events, but then COVID, you know, the lockdown hit and we had to restructure everything and it was quite stressful, um, and exciting because all of a sudden.

[00:12:29] It's not like, you know, this, this virtual world 

[00:12:32] was, was, was, was, was, was foreign to us, but now it was our only way of communicating. And at that time, you know, I still left my apartment in Johannesburg, come back to Kimberly. And, uh, so I physically wasn't there 

[00:12:45] and, uh, most of the other, so yeah, there was all 

[00:12:49] of those complications at first, but then secondly, um, What I really enjoyed as I, everybody just came together teams.

[00:12:56] Okay. This is what we dealt with. How are we going to work with it? And what happened was that Ebukhosini and Baba Buntu. They got six uh co-researchers and these guys physically went out into these respective, um, neighbourhoods and, um, They, uh, they were in touch with the area's youth groups, uh, organisations and stuff like that, youth organisations and stuff like that.

[00:13:19] And, um, they literally went there and they asked, uh, you know, a bunch of kids between the age of 14 and 35. Well, I don't think there was anybody who was in their 30’s Um, not to my knowledge at least. And, um, but yeah, you kind of get to the bracket and, um, we will asking them a whole bunch of questions, but it was mostly around like, what, you know, what would they 

[00:13:41] change in the neighbourhood?

[00:13:42] What do they need? And. Just before I explained to the, the, the 

[00:13:47] data and how we collected that, because that was really key to this project was why we did that. And this is why I was so passionate about it. And, um, I was really, it was just very, very cool working on it and it’s, still ongoing is the fact that, um, we unfortunately live in a society where 

[00:14:05] the, the distance between the, 

[00:14:08] what the youth, um, You know, you know, between the youth parents.

[00:14:12] Oh, let me just say youth in government. Most of these kids have no, are actually quite, um, woke to the idea that their let's call it plight, for lack of a better word will never be heard by government. And they are, it's not like they okay with it. They actually quite angry about it, but that gap is huge.

[00:14:34] Right. So part of this was to understand why and how can, uh, a decision-making bodies sort of come down to their level. And that's where we use the creative or the creative let’s just call it application for now. And that's sort of where I came in. So as part of asking, because if you have researchers going, ask, going out and asking people questions about like, what do you think about government.

[00:14:56] I mean, it’s kind of boring and, um, young people got lots more energy than 

[00:15:02] not all old 

[00:15:04] people. I like to believe I've got more than most, but you get what I'm saying 

[00:15:08] and, um, So, yeah. So when these 

[00:15:12] researchers went out, um, we asked them, or  to sort of, um, give us feedback on how they see their neighbourhood.

[00:15:21] What do they think needs to be changed? You know, and things like that. But, and they did all that is, um, as artwork. So some people wrote poems. Very beautiful poems. Some people performed it on, um, um, like videos. Some people 

[00:15:34] took photos or 

[00:15:35] they say like, these are the problem areas. And this is what we think can be changed.

[00:15:38] Um, some people did a mosaic and they arrange a bunch of images, um, which represents sort of the ideal utopian 

[00:15:50] um, world or 

[00:15:52] that, that they sort of looking for. Some people did very interesting artwork as well, and somewhat quite graphic in terms of like what they say. And, um, it was under those categories that I looked at all of that and I had to catalog them and, um, we came up, there was three main, uh, Topics that the youth was looking for.

[00:16:11] And the first one, which I thought was really blew me away, which was also, I tried to carry that same energy through the podcast was a lot of the youth was looking for was gatvol of government just coming in and having parties in these neighbourhoods, which something, and that blew me away because 

[00:16:29] the level is, you know, whenever there's an, any event in the neighbourhood, it'll always be a party 

[00:16:34] a bash or whatever.

[00:16:36] And these guys wanted, 

[00:16:37] uh, 

[00:16:40] you know, they, they, they, they, they wanted events with this entrepreneurs where they can be 

[00:16:44] inspired. And then how can I start my own business? Who do I go and speak to? How do I access funding? Um, how do I get...]]>d5461f4b-d914-46bb-87a8-2addff546fb3Fri, 09 Jul 2021 08:00:00 +020029:42falsefull5858Candice NolanFilm and Documentary MakingWesley Pepper chats to award winning Filmmaker, Documentarian and Editor, Ikaye Masisi. This is a podcast where we talk art and art processes. Masisi also looks at the impact of COVID-19 on the film industry.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Everybody Wesley pepper and you're tuned into my podcast. Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Thanks everybody for tuning in. Uh, welcome to all my new and returning. Listeners, uh, greetings to you all, you know, I hope you guys enjoyed last week's or the last two episodes we had.

[00:00:29] Um, I thought that was really insightful. Thanks to Wilson Ngoni for coming through and blessing us with these time. You know, we really uncovered his entire, uh, Really covered his entire story. As an artist, you look at his work, his processes, and even his book. Uh, and just to recap, you guys are still interested in purchasing his book.

[00:00:49] Remember you can find it on his Facebook page or use WhatsApp number. Um, I don't have the number in front of me, but I know it's on last week's episode, so yeah, you can have a. Or, I mean, if you really, if you can't find that, just holler at me and I'll, you know, I'll forward it through to you. Yeah. I mean, uh, my thanks again to Wilson once again, man.

[00:01:07] Um, as I said I really enjoyed that man. And, um, today's episode. Um, we taking another. Rather, I'm talking to another very, very interesting brother. I'm talking to Ikaye Masisi. He is an editor and a filmmaker. Um, he also does a lot of documentaries. He works on a whole host of, uh, projects, you know, uh, shows that I'm sure some of you are probably are familiar with his work.

[00:01:29] You just didn't know that he was behind the editing of it. He's also quite a, uh, award-winning brother, um, as recently. Um, well, early on this year, he actually won another editing, um, award. Um, and, uh, we definitely gonna be covering that. We're gonna be covering, we're gonna be talking about these processes.

[00:01:46] Of course, you know, how we choose his subject matter, because if you know something about Ikaye’s work, you know, um, he does documentaries on really the, on and he does projects on things that personally, that I'm very, very interested in, you know, um, I remember watching one of these documentaries called I’m a Poet not too long ago and I loved it and I really loved it.

[00:02:05] I loved his approach. I loved his technique and everything. And as you guys know, like I'm really, really passionate and I've got an interesting history where the, um, with the spoken word. Um, so we're going to be covering a bit of all of that today, you know, Talk about these awards and his current and future projects.

[00:02:22] So stay tuned for that. That should be on about, uh, that should be a lot of fun. Um, let's just remember that the art giveaway is well, it's actually always up for grabs, you know, even though, um, um, somebody might win it. I'll just create another one because the thing is, I just want to attract more listeners and I do want to give away more art so that you have a, so if you want an art to receive any of the artwork, you know, just like, and subscribe to this, um, um, Episode, you know, and I'll choose a name at random and you will win yourself, original artwork done by yours truly.

[00:02:51] And, uh, stay tuned for that. Um, or rather I'll talk to you at the end of the interview, um, with regards to future episodes and a bunch of other things brewing on the horizon, you know, there's always, it's always a lot of that. Yeah, man. And, um, I'll chat to you at the end of today's episode with regards to that, but for now, you know, guys, uh, enjoy today's episode, with Ikaye, um, I've actually been looking to get hold of him for some time.

[00:03:16] Now it's just a]]>Wesley Pepper chats to award winning Filmmaker, Documentarian and Editor, Ikaye Masisi. This is a podcast where we talk art and art processes. Masisi also looks at the impact of COVID-19 on the film industry.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Everybody Wesley pepper and you're tuned into my podcast. Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Thanks everybody for tuning in. Uh, welcome to all my new and returning. Listeners, uh, greetings to you all, you know, I hope you guys enjoyed last week's or the last two episodes we had.

[00:00:29] Um, I thought that was really insightful. Thanks to Wilson Ngoni for coming through and blessing us with these time. You know, we really uncovered his entire, uh, Really covered his entire story. As an artist, you look at his work, his processes, and even his book. Uh, and just to recap, you guys are still interested in purchasing his book.

[00:00:49] Remember you can find it on his Facebook page or use WhatsApp number. Um, I don't have the number in front of me, but I know it's on last week's episode, so yeah, you can have a. Or, I mean, if you really, if you can't find that, just holler at me and I'll, you know, I'll forward it through to you. Yeah. I mean, uh, my thanks again to Wilson once again, man.

[00:01:07] Um, as I said I really enjoyed that man. And, um, today's episode. Um, we taking another. Rather, I'm talking to another very, very interesting brother. I'm talking to Ikaye Masisi. He is an editor and a filmmaker. Um, he also does a lot of documentaries. He works on a whole host of, uh, projects, you know, uh, shows that I'm sure some of you are probably are familiar with his work.

[00:01:29] You just didn't know that he was behind the editing of it. He's also quite a, uh, award-winning brother, um, as recently. Um, well, early on this year, he actually won another editing, um, award. Um, and, uh, we definitely gonna be covering that. We're gonna be covering, we're gonna be talking about these processes.

[00:01:46] Of course, you know, how we choose his subject matter, because if you know something about Ikaye’s work, you know, um, he does documentaries on really the, on and he does projects on things that personally, that I'm very, very interested in, you know, um, I remember watching one of these documentaries called I’m a Poet not too long ago and I loved it and I really loved it.

[00:02:05] I loved his approach. I loved his technique and everything. And as you guys know, like I'm really, really passionate and I've got an interesting history where the, um, with the spoken word. Um, so we're going to be covering a bit of all of that today, you know, Talk about these awards and his current and future projects.

[00:02:22] So stay tuned for that. That should be on about, uh, that should be a lot of fun. Um, let's just remember that the art giveaway is well, it's actually always up for grabs, you know, even though, um, um, somebody might win it. I'll just create another one because the thing is, I just want to attract more listeners and I do want to give away more art so that you have a, so if you want an art to receive any of the artwork, you know, just like, and subscribe to this, um, um, Episode, you know, and I'll choose a name at random and you will win yourself, original artwork done by yours truly.

[00:02:51] And, uh, stay tuned for that. Um, or rather I'll talk to you at the end of the interview, um, with regards to future episodes and a bunch of other things brewing on the horizon, you know, there's always, it's always a lot of that. Yeah, man. And, um, I'll chat to you at the end of today's episode with regards to that, but for now, you know, guys, uh, enjoy today's episode, with Ikaye, um, I've actually been looking to get hold of him for some time.

[00:03:16] Now it's just a matter of scheduling and timing and those types of things, but we finally got a hold of him and, um, we looking forward to talking today, so hope you guys enjoy today's episode. Yeah, man. And I'll chat to you’s right after this. 

[00:03:29] spudcaster: [00:03:29] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling.

[00:03:35] This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org. 

[00:03:47] Wesley: [00:03:47] We good, man. How are you doing Ikaye? Thanks for coming through. Um, Ikaye: I'm blessed, dog. Wesley: Yeah. Yeah. You always got a very laid back vibe to you. You know so

[00:04:04] yeah, you always come back as like it’s just water off a ducks back, um, but I liked that. Uh, it's um, I can feed off it,

[00:04:17] my brother,

[00:04:25] Let’s start off in the beginning, man. So you’re an editor and a filmmaker right. I know you from more the documentary side of everything.

[00:04:30] And as we were saying off air, um, um, we, you know, I read this article which says we actually in the golden area of documentaries which is waar man,

[00:04:38] um, I mean, Filmmakers switching to that medium. And I know there's many other uses and I want to pick your brain about that. But before we get into that, because I know you just recently won an award as well. Um, so let's unpick the elephant bit for bit, and then, uh, let’s just start off for my listeners and then just tell us, uh, where you from that type of thing and how did you get into film making, bra?

[00:05:08] Ikaye: [00:05:08] Okay. That award thing I got nominated at the SAFTAS, I didn't get an award.

[00:05:11] Wesley: [00:05:11] Um,

[00:05:17] uh, I don’t want to get ahead of myself. Sure um, we we'll get to that bit, um, but let's just talk about like, how did you get into filmmaking, bro? 

[00:05:26] Ikaye: [00:05:26] Um, filmmaking, right? Um, dog, so like, The first film that I saw that kind of inspired me was like a pair of boots and a bicycle. Right. That vibe, dog, so it was like a pair of boots and a bicycle.

[00:05:46] And then there was that show that, um, it was like a reality, extra reality show, Scoop Makhathini and then kind of was that show. But that show was so hot like, um, One of those two shows those two shows inspired. Right. But then the real, the real, th th the actual documentary that inspired me was this one pair of boots and a bicycle, because like, it was done by black editors, black directors, black producers, like, so, because like, when you watch this, when you watch the credits, it's like a lot of white people.

[00:06:18] So you don't think like, you know what I'm saying? Um, And you don’t see yourself there. Right. But when I saw, like, this is such a dope documentary on SABC 1 nogal, right. Black people that are running this thing, and I'm like, and it's so hot and it's so dope, right. That kind of inspired me. And then later came on uBra meek and the work that they we're doing, uh, about Robert Sobukwe, you know what I'm saying?

[00:06:42] And then [indistinct] Matabane as well, all the works that were like black guys were doing at that time, that actually did. I'm like, okay, cool. It's possible that I, from Thaba Nchu, it’s in the Free State next to. Um, well, it's next to Bloemfontein and whatever. You know what I’m saying. Uh, I'm from that side. That's where I grew up.

[00:07:06] That's where I was born. My parents is at. My mom's is at. My grandma’s is at. That's where, that's where my roots is. If I have to put it in Tswana you feel what I'm saying? So that's what I'm from. Um, so I got inspired by this thing, right. This work that I saw and, you know, kind of tickled my creative, my creative sensibilities.

[00:07:29] Right. And then I felt like I could be able to work this. Right. And there wasn't a time when I was, you know, like after matric and then you have to decide what you want to do. You know, it wasn't that bad at school. You know what I'm saying. It wasn't that bad. At school I wasn’t bad with math. So it wasn't bad. Like, it was pretty cool, but like, It felt like spiritually, my creative sensibilities were more like, like just, you know what I'm saying?

[00:07:54] They were gnawing at me, dog like, you know what I'm saying? And like, um, when I saw this shit, I'm like, fuck, I need to make films, bro. I feel like. There's also that part of under representation as well. I think that's what brought me into feeling that there's so many dope stories, black stories that are out there, our history and whatnot, which is not properly, um, documented and not, you know, and that's what kind of inspired me to like, mess with this.

[00:08:21] You know what I'm saying? Uh, mess with this vibe. Can we curse on you on this podcast   Wesley: We can but I mean like this is not a bar

[00:08:41] Ikaye: So for sheezy. So from that. Uh, I came to the J came to the J's that at, uh, uh, I studied at Nemisa, um, I was actually shooting that side. Actually. I was then starting to become an editor. I wanted to shoot, like I wanted to become a cinematographer, but then editing just called me, bro. You know, it's one of those things, like a fate thing, you know what I mean?

[00:09:04] And then you feel me. I've got to meet up with Delize Moabe, Delize’s the guy who actually 

[00:09:13] hit me up with SIM SIM SIM SIM SIM SIM Sims. You know what I mean? Um, and that's how I got the connection to go to work with the greatest document, the greatest work. That I did so far was actually with the dude that created a pair of boots and a bicycle, which is Vincent Moloi, you know, it gave me an opportunity.

[00:09:37] you know, give us an opportunity as young editors to come into the game and learn this thing, because this shit is hard to come into is fucking hard, bro. People think this shit is like, it's easy, but like fucking, dog, I think in terms of like filmmaking documentary is the hardest, you know, drama's easy, bro. Dramas scripted.

[00:09:54] Everything's scripted, scripted television is very easy, but like documentary, you've got to fucking find a story. You've got to find this. You got to, and then you've got to say, you gotta, yeah, you gotta set. You literally, it's like literally working on a blank canvas right where everything like literally you have to kind of, um, Draw or paint.

[00:10:22] You feel what I'm saying even with your characters, because the shit that you shoot in the field, it might come back in the timeline and it might not work in the editing suite. Right. And you've got to find a way, you know, uh, so I think like, fuck, the documentary documentary is hard, bro. Documentary is hard, dog. It's hard. But like, I love it.

[00:10:38] I enjoy it because like it's important because it's a way it's a tool to actually catch up people's stories and to tell like those untold stories about people. You know what I'm saying, which way, which is what I feel like the work is important for, uh, for me, you know, as, um, as a visual creative. Yeah.

[00:11:00] That's the five G

[00:11:00] Wesley: [00:11:00] yeah, yeah, yeah. Interesting just a point on that a pair of boots and a bicycle I’ve watched that and just for the listeners that was about the soldiers who fought in world war two. They came back and the government gave them a pair of boots and a bicycle the white boys got land.

[00:11:08] Um,

[00:11:21] Ikaye: [00:11:21] Imagine that shit, dog.

[00:11:30] Do you understand how touching that subject matter is. Like our ancestors

[00:11:33] ancestors, our grandparents, bro! Wesley: for sure. And then we see all these monuments of whoever fought in world war two celebrating those who gave their lives for Europe.

[00:11:43] like one of the one thing that resonated the most from that doccie was the part where the one, one guy says that there was an attack. I think it was in um Egypt somewhere.

[00:11:57] Yeah. Yeah. They didn't have any weapons so they had to hide under the wa. They were literally sort of almost drowning from trying to dodge bullets that was flying. That thing was heavy, and the way they explained that, wow. And like, on that what you were saying about editing I totally get what you’re saying because

[00:12:18] you know, the way the documentary or the film maker presented that, and you could feel the pain,

[00:12:24] uh, the confusion. I guess it just the mayhem and fuck man, that thing was heavy. Find enough here’s just a story. Personal thing on my side, my mother’s father, uh, my mother's grandfather. Who was it? Or was it father, one of them. Yeah. He was a German fella, uh, he fought I don't know with or whatever but he came to South Africa. He got a taste of africa and didn’t want to leave.

[00:12:56] Um, and he was one of the guys where they gave a farm, can you believe that? That’s how my mother's side of the family. So yeah, I could, I could, I could resonate with that, with that thing over there. So moving on, man. 

[00:13:16] Ikaye: [00:13:16] Funny story, my great grandfather, my great-grandfather actually went to that war. There’s actually like a gun like them old school guns. He's got that.

[00:13:27] Yeah. Yeah, B yeah, B, he actually went out there, but he actually came back. You know what I'm saying? Um, and like I was told that during the time, my grand, my great-grandmother cause we had a farm at home and we had a school, the first school in Thaba Nchu the first like proper formal education school. Even the first church

[00:13:53] my grandmother was running that shit. She was running this, she was running the church. She was even running the farm, bruh. My grandfather was fighting and then he came back. Shit. That's like fucking crazy. Like when I saw that shit, I’m like yo dog damn it’s, like, I don't know, man. It's some weird shit, but like it's dope.

[00:14:11] It's dope though. You know, it's like the spirits connect. Do you know what I mean? 

[00:14:15] Wesley: [00:14:15] That's actually, that's actually where I want to, because you're saying like, one thing I know about artists is like, you are chosen to do this gig. You know, you either have it or you don't. So if you telling me, like all of these things, sort of lead up to you saying I want to tell sort of African stories using the medium of film, that's actually where I went to, where I want to jump to from hear.

[00:14:41] So explain to me. So once you, um, the processes, so once you can see, this is where I want to go, you know, these are my influences. This is, you know, these guys XYZ. I have these skills. Where to from there

[00:15:01] and how did you get into what you're doing right now?

[00:15:03] Ikaye: [00:15:03] Well, it was like a cause with editing, I feel like editing is like long and like hard, you know? So it was like a very long slow process in terms of like developing. Um, so it led from, I feel like it's more like it's, it's both external and internal in terms of like externally the type of projects that you, you find yourself within, you know what I'm saying?

[00:15:35] that kind of build you, yeah. That kind of build a skill right. For, in terms of like storytelling, right. Uh, which is very, very important in terms of that. But when you, when you come up right. To understand what is story, what is correct? Because people take that for granted. 

[00:15:55] Wesley: [00:15:55] Yeah, I know what you’re saying.

[00:15:57] Uh, you were saying about the editing, man. 

[00:16:01] Ikaye: [00:16:01] Yeah, dog. So I would say the thing with it is that for me, and that's what I kind of feel like in terms of like, development, right? Is that like, this shit is long and it's hard and like, um, it just needs you to kind of. Um, have a love for it. Right. Um, you know, cause like when you see, when you see a picture, when you see a story in television, it feels so simple.

[00:16:25] Right. But like behind the scenes for them to make it that simple, like took sometimes years, you know, just to get it to that level, you feel what I'm saying? So that's the thing with documentary and you can never really, um, kinda like from the start, you can’t say this story. This is where the story's going to be.

[00:16:45] You might might've written it and whatnot. The shit doesn't work out, right. Characters is not working. Even the concept is not working. The themes are. Everything is kind of off and then you kind of just need to adapt. Right. And that's the thing with it. Right. And South Africa doesn't have a very strong documentary culture.

[00:17:01] You feel what I'm saying? Um, just in terms of like, it's there, but like the biggest people that are behind the documentaries is SABC but SABC is falling apart. Right? So like it's a big problem in terms of like developing documentary film makers. Right. It's very tough for us because like now we've got to do it independent shit like that.

[00:17:19] Got to wait for years and whatnot. And it's like gatekeeping, how many?  like, it's not, it's not it's it's, it's not somebody from, let's say like film school or somebody that has a film background or somebody that's like wants to get into documentary. Cut documentary straight up, right? Because, um, firstly, you don't have the experience.

[00:17:41] Firstly, we don't trust you like this. There's a lot of things that are happening, right. So you need to prove yourself and for you to prove yourself as like fucking difficult, right? It's very difficult though. Like you mentioned having to cut like a feature, right? Or like, even like a, let's say a 30 minute documentary.

[00:17:58] It's fucking tough. It's not easy dog. You know, you see a lot of shit. That's on YouTube and you're like, Hey man. But what the hell is going on here!

[00:18:09] you can see that there's an art to it. You feel me? That's actually what the old cats are still. Are still the ones that are like running this game because like it requires that, you know, it requires that experience and people are able to just trust you with their footage if you've cut that shit before.

[00:18:27] Right. So that's the vibe about it, you know, so, so fuck man. It's I think it's a thing of luck and I think it's also a thing of like calling, purpose

[00:18:41] and also where you are kind of in the industry and what you feel and shit like that. Right. Um, you know what I mean? But like it creates good editors. Documentaries creates good editors. That's what I kind of feel. You know what I mean? That background is like fucking that documentary background. Like for me, it's like, you can figure out a story quick,

[00:19:03] you know, especially when it comes to scripted shit, like, like, like, you know, what the fuck is not going to work, what's working and like, you know what I mean? Um, that's the dope thing about it, 

[00:19:14] Wesley: [00:19:14] yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, I feel you, I feel you on that then. Like]]>062ce557-95e1-450d-b469-a71fcd4e4410Fri, 25 Jun 2021 09:00:00 +020029:42falsefull5757Candice NolanPhoto Realism: Part IIPart II of this two part interview with one of Botswana's most celebrated visual artists, Wilson Ngoni. Art lexical is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Greetings everybody, uh, wesley pepper here. And this is my podcast wesley pepper’s are Lexica, which is brought to you by Spudcaster and baobulb, yeah. Thanks everybody for tuning in, uh, to all the new listeners and returning listeners greetings to you all. Thank you for tuning in to listen to me, speak for the next hour or so.

[00:00:29] Um, yeah. Thank you. Um, yeah, as you guys know today is, uh, episode two or part two of the interview with Wilson Ngoni. Uh, just to recap on last week's episode, um, last week we pretty much covered is, uh, the first half of his story. So how he got into the arts, how he choose and interacts with the subject matter, um, His philosophy as an artist.

[00:00:57] And, uh, we ended up with him talking on his book. Um, there was a bit of a technical, uh, technical thing in, you know, kind of in a, to a properly, but, um, yeah, well, we were, we just started to talk on his book and I was actually going to end the interview off there back then there was, uh, you know, the line just cut for whatever reason.

[00:01:17] I still don't know. Um, how that happened. Um, yeah, man. And, uh, today's in today's episode, um, we're going to talk about his legacy as an artist. So we're going to focus on his book. Um, we're gonna, we're gonna go into detail on that. Um, so we've cover everything, you know, are we, um, Oh, we got to conceptualising the book, how he did it because he self-published it.

[00:01:39] And, um, to be honest with you, you know, as you guys know, I've worked as a publisher for the longest time and, um, um, actually don't know anybody that has self published, a coffee table book. And for my listeners who doesn't know what a coffee table book is, that's just a local word for a. Well, an art book you notice, usually to think about is usually about the excess of 200, 300 pages, um, you know, hard cover and it's usually quite pricey.

[00:02:03] So, um, we're going to get into that. We're going to look about, we're going to talk about these future, you know, future projects. Uh, artworks shows, et cetera. And, um, he told me also he's looking to do a museum and I found that super, super, super interesting. So I definitely want to hear what his plans is around that.

[00:02:23] Um, I don't know if you guys know that, um, I'm actually very, very interested in that. I mean, sometime ago, I think it was around about 2015, 2016. Um, I was talking to some guys and we were in the process of, you know, research on the person. We were busy researching, putting up a street art museum actually in Fietas.

[00:02:42] Um, uh, but that's another story. Maybe I'll do an episode on that in the, not too distant future. So in other words, it's just something I'm super, super interested in knowing, and I understand the value of a museum too. And, um, Yeah, I wouldn't be covering all of that. So stay tuned for that. But remember, the art giveaway is still up for grabs or whatever, so like subscribe and comment on this current episode and we'll choose a name randomly and you can win an original artwork done by yours

[00:03:08] truly. So, yeah, I mean, I hope you guys are prepared for today's episode. Um, I know. Yeah. I enjoy talking to Wilson the last time and I know it's going to be pretty interesting and he’s probably got a whole bunch of things to say. Um, so yeah, man, uh, hope you guys do enjoy that and I will talk to you at the end of this with, uh, more information on future episodes and to wrap it all up.

[00:03:31] So yeah. Thanks guys for tuning in. And I'll talk to you after this. 

[00:03:35] spudcaster: [00:03:35]...]]>Part II of this two part interview with one of Botswana's most celebrated visual artists, Wilson Ngoni. Art lexical is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Greetings everybody, uh, wesley pepper here. And this is my podcast wesley pepper’s are Lexica, which is brought to you by Spudcaster and baobulb, yeah. Thanks everybody for tuning in, uh, to all the new listeners and returning listeners greetings to you all. Thank you for tuning in to listen to me, speak for the next hour or so.

[00:00:29] Um, yeah. Thank you. Um, yeah, as you guys know today is, uh, episode two or part two of the interview with Wilson Ngoni. Uh, just to recap on last week's episode, um, last week we pretty much covered is, uh, the first half of his story. So how he got into the arts, how he choose and interacts with the subject matter, um, His philosophy as an artist.

[00:00:57] And, uh, we ended up with him talking on his book. Um, there was a bit of a technical, uh, technical thing in, you know, kind of in a, to a properly, but, um, yeah, well, we were, we just started to talk on his book and I was actually going to end the interview off there back then there was, uh, you know, the line just cut for whatever reason.

[00:01:17] I still don't know. Um, how that happened. Um, yeah, man. And, uh, today's in today's episode, um, we're going to talk about his legacy as an artist. So we're going to focus on his book. Um, we're gonna, we're gonna go into detail on that. Um, so we've cover everything, you know, are we, um, Oh, we got to conceptualising the book, how he did it because he self-published it.

[00:01:39] And, um, to be honest with you, you know, as you guys know, I've worked as a publisher for the longest time and, um, um, actually don't know anybody that has self published, a coffee table book. And for my listeners who doesn't know what a coffee table book is, that's just a local word for a. Well, an art book you notice, usually to think about is usually about the excess of 200, 300 pages, um, you know, hard cover and it's usually quite pricey.

[00:02:03] So, um, we're going to get into that. We're going to look about, we're going to talk about these future, you know, future projects. Uh, artworks shows, et cetera. And, um, he told me also he's looking to do a museum and I found that super, super, super interesting. So I definitely want to hear what his plans is around that.

[00:02:23] Um, I don't know if you guys know that, um, I'm actually very, very interested in that. I mean, sometime ago, I think it was around about 2015, 2016. Um, I was talking to some guys and we were in the process of, you know, research on the person. We were busy researching, putting up a street art museum actually in Fietas.

[00:02:42] Um, uh, but that's another story. Maybe I'll do an episode on that in the, not too distant future. So in other words, it's just something I'm super, super interested in knowing, and I understand the value of a museum too. And, um, Yeah, I wouldn't be covering all of that. So stay tuned for that. But remember, the art giveaway is still up for grabs or whatever, so like subscribe and comment on this current episode and we'll choose a name randomly and you can win an original artwork done by yours

[00:03:08] truly. So, yeah, I mean, I hope you guys are prepared for today's episode. Um, I know. Yeah. I enjoy talking to Wilson the last time and I know it's going to be pretty interesting and he’s probably got a whole bunch of things to say. Um, so yeah, man, uh, hope you guys do enjoy that and I will talk to you at the end of this with, uh, more information on future episodes and to wrap it all up.

[00:03:31] So yeah. Thanks guys for tuning in. And I'll talk to you after this. 

[00:03:35] spudcaster: [00:03:35] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts. Podcast your life with baobulb.org.

[00:03:55] Wesley: [00:03:55] Um, Wilson Ngoni, thanks for coming through again, my brother, uh, we were just talking a little bit off air. You were saying that, you don’t catch the flu Wilson: um, Yeah. Yeah.      Wesley: How do you, how do you do that? Is it your diet, you know, is, uh, Joe, uh, are you you exercising? Are you healthy? How do you manage not to get, uh, cause everyone is complaining in

[00:04:20] South Africa, you know, the cold and the flu and all of that. How do you, how are you managing to stay, stay safe? 

[00:04:27] Wilson: [00:04:27] Uh, I don't know. I don't know people, I think naturally if flu is not something that, will easily attack me because was, uh, I have never had flu, uh, all my life. So maybe, well, I might say all my life, I don't know, uh, before, before my life came right now, but you know, I, I don't remember myself catching flu at all.

[00:04:55] Wesley: [00:04:55] That's pretty interesting. Um, I'm a pretty, I'll say a healthy guy myself. So, you know, I exercise, I eat healthy and that type of thing. Um, but I still, yeah, but anyway,

[00:05:08] yeah, 

[00:05:08] Wilson: [00:05:08] yeah. At that time I thought that's, you know, because, um, uh, the past, uh, three decades I've been living in, in, in, in my studio, Uh, and with the oil paint. So that at that time I thought maybe it's oil paint that just keeps flu away from me. 

[00:05:23] Wesley: [00:05:23] Interesting. I know, I know. I don't know the properties of that, but I know that smell is actually quite intoxicating for me.

[00:05:33] I love it actually. Um, it's yeah, it's comforting because you need to smell that space. 

[00:05:42] Wilson: [00:05:42] Yeah. If I stayed for three days out of my studio, I start getting depressed. I don't know if it's something that other artists, but, you know, I start catching, uh, just bad feelings, you know? 

[00:05:58] Wesley: [00:05:58] Yeah. Yeah. I know. I get that.

[00:06:02] I understand it. Um, like if I like, as honestly you need to be productive, it's like just yesterday, I sent away artworks yesterday to the gallery. Um, and I need to start a new one. So now it's on my side one, so that it's like, my life is now. I, I need to be busy. I need to wake up. So, so yeah, that's actually quite beautiful.

[00:06:29] My brother.

[00:06:33] Because I understand the, I understand the process of an artist needing to produce, and I understand how important it is. Not just for a commercial respect to the artists, um, mentally, physically, and everything. I think that's really, really important for the artist to keep doing that. Um, So with your, with your side, you've got, like you were saying, that's a substantial, you have a substantial body of work.

[00:06:58] You're well celebrated and received artists as well. So when you were telling us in last week's episode that you put together, this book, this coffee table book on your portfolio. Um, tell us, um, let's, let's start there. My brother, let's start from the beginning. Um, tell me, so, um, how did it all come together?

[00:07:19] Um, what team did you have to pull the guys together? Where did you start a little bit from there? 

[00:07:26] Wilson: [00:07:26] Uh, well, uh, in the past, uh, the Pepper, just to, to tell you, uh, a bit of backstory with me and public speaking and writing, I I've been writing for quite some time and. Uh, like what, what, uh, around 1998, uh, I, I put some, a couple of manuscripts, uh, together and try to get them published.

[00:07:52] I gave them to some of my teachers, uh, to, to proofread. They never returned my manuscripts, Pepper and journal. Well, they, they told me that they were lost and you know, it repeated and repeated and repeated when I wrote more and more and more give it to people, to, to proofread, uh, for me. And they never returned my manuscript.

[00:08:16] Uh, and you know, I started even noticing, even when I wrote compositions at school, uh, My teachers will use them as like the, the, the, the, the marking key for, for, for the class. You know? So I, I started noticing even when I wrote, uh, like, uh, some essays in social studies in history, uh, I started realising that, oh, this thing might be something really, really important.

[00:08:45] So if we take, like I say, in the previous, uh, uh, Chat with you that, you know, I was quite gifted academically, but I, I, in school, I didn't like school. So of course there was so much pressure from every subject. Every school wanted me to, to pursue, uh, what they're they're subject to would they have as a vocation at the end of my academic life.

[00:09:11] So, um, W with the writing. I continued to write, I wrote a lot of poetry. I wrote a lot of lyrics. I wrote a lot of, uh, novels books about I, you know, uh, and whenever I give it to people to proofread, it never returned. So, you know, I, I studied that pattern and I actually thought it was, they were stealing my literature.

[00:09:41] And with that, uh, instead of, uh, being angry, I started celebrating that, you know, people will not still trash people was steal gold. Yeah. I agree with you, uh, getting my material, not returning it, it was very, very motivating to me. So, yeah. Uh, some years back, uh, I, I wrote some, some, some books, uh, again poetry, had a local publisher do them and, you know, one of them, uh, they were getting into the academic system, but, you know, I, I didn't get paid, uh, good realities.

[00:10:20] And sometimes even to this day, I never get royalties, but my book has been used in schools. So I making noise and scandals in uh, 2014. Uh, so in 2010, uh, I was one of the artists who was in South Africa, when the Royal Bafokeng stadium was opened for the world cup. So I was one of the artists was exhibiting there and, uh, I was involved in a lot of, um, activities then exhibitions, uh, with the, the, the Royal, uh, uh, chiefs in that region, um, other artists.

[00:11:11] So, and from there, I was also invited to. To, to, to, to come view the world cup. Um, so, uh, I stayed in Cape town while I was in Cape town. I went to Robben island. So at Robben island, uh, we had, uh, people who, um, the likes of Sparks. There's a gentleman called sparks. Uh, was, uh, one of the, uh, tour guides.

[00:11:49] I mean, at the Robben Island museum. So is he narrated the story about how they lived during the oppressive apartheid, South Africa. Uh, I, I could feel it, uh, when I went to Mandela cell cl these people, the people live today and still managed to survive. It managed to make it, you know, I wonder how am I not making it when I have all the freedom that I have, uh, Uh, out here, uh, given that, you know, I lived, um, lives that had a lot of, uh, activity, both harrowing activities and very, very exciting activities as well, like extreme losses and, um, extreme winds.

[00:12:47] Yes. Well, you know, in 2010, when I returned home from after world cup, I started putting up, um, a book that is called doors to my eyes, doors to my eyes it's, um, it's a narration about my life, my childhood experiences. Um, I, I, I lived with a stepmother in a foreign country and how I was treated, uh, as a foreigner in Zimbabwe.

[00:13:12] And when I'd returned to back to Botswana, I was treated for, and, you know, when I visited places like South Africa and Zambia, Ethiopia, and other places, I started fitting in very, very well because, uh, I learned how to survive and even now I will not fail to become an artist and survive as an artist when, uh, for instance, uh, w w when I was growing, uh, in, in some, some, some hoods.

[00:13:41] You know, you see prostitutes along, uh, along the pavement, uh, selling pussy and, you know, you interviewed with them, uh, Pepper, you, you hear that, you know, they're selling pussy as a commodity to feed their families. So you, you start wondering if a prostitute can sell prostitutes, can sell, pussy on the sidewalk and feed their families.

[00:14:06] How we, with all this literature, I failed to write a book that can feed my family,

[00:14:16] failed to produce some good paintings to feed his family or feed himself. So you see, um, everything, everything, uh, became, uh, one thing and also, uh, Pepper. One other thing that made me to, to, to, to write was the quest to package myself as an artist

[00:14:37] if he, if he Pepper pig,

[00:14:43] pig, pig, 

[00:14:48] Wesley: [00:14:48] I'm listening. I'm 

[00:14:49] Wilson: [00:14:49] listening. Yeah. Yeah, so it, nobody wants to be called a pig. The pig is a washed properly cut properly into nice pieces. Uh, and now it's on the shelf. It becomes very expensive meat. 

[00:15:05] Wesley: [00:15:05] That's a good one and a delicious meat,

[00:15:08] Wilson: [00:15:08] delicious meat, for that matter and you know, uh, I just, when I conduct some of my, my writing precesses or my artistic research is, you know, going to shops, uh, find this, uh, big, uh, big belly guy with nice beautiful woman and know, you'll be saying, babe, you want bacon? 

[00:15:26] Uh, this like tasty soft, high quality soft meat. Initially it was just a

[00:15:33] pig. See,

[00:15:40] I decided to package myself properly Pepper. You know, if a pig is a pig is packaged, cut and packaged properly, it becomes, uh, it becomes pork.

[00:15:55] Wesley: [00:15:55] I love it. I love that. I love that. 

[00:15:59] Wilson: [00:15:59] So you see putting books, putting up a coffee table book like this one, uh, Wilson Ngoni living with the brush. It is a way of packaging myself and launching myself into the ad scene and cementing, uh, my, my dream as an artist, as a professional, it is now my position is it is a appropriate.

[00:16:18] Now it is, I think it's cemented by. By this, uh, book, which is this catalog, which is in a book format, um, packaging, Wilson Ngoni into this book, uh, living with a brush, like my, my, my new book. Um, I feel it's it's it's it's it's success. Sure. I feel also, it will save a lot of other, uh, intentions that I have, like, you know, I can't have exhibitions in museums and galleries around the world right now, due to the COVID-19.

[00:16:53] So why not put a book, you know, uh, in a catalog for so that people can experience my work in their, in their self to have their houses in offices, you know, Besides that, like I said, I'm packaging myself. Like how a pig gets packaged. Uh, this book carries my name it's so it carries my brand.

[00:17:19] So it's branding. So this is like a business card  yes, it is hard. And also is a source of revenue because, you know, I, I'm not giving this book for free. Uh, well, unless if I, I find the needs to I'm selling this. 

[00:17:38] Wesley: [00:17:38] How much you're selling it for my brother. 

[00:17:41] Wilson: [00:17:41] Uh, it's $150 

[00:17:44] Wesley: [00:17:44] us dollars. 

[00:17:46] Wilson: [00:17:46] Yes. 

[00:17:48] Wesley: [00:17:48] Okay. Okay. That's um, that's um, that's

[00:18:00] a good sign, uh, so forth. Um, when did you start working on it? And, um, when was it published? 

[00:18:09] Wilson: [00:18:09] I published it last year, December. Uh, I've been working on this book since 2016, 2017. I rated my work though. Uh, I didn't curate it to you, uh, in a, in a way that, you know, I think, uh, professionals do. I think I'm satisfied.

[00:18:29] Wesley: [00:18:29] Explain to me why I wonder, I want to ask you that. How did you manage to choose the artworks? Because usually with those types of books, you know, portfolios and so on, because like your writer knows the market, et cetera. How did you, um, select your artworks?

[00:18:51] Wilson: [00:18:51] Um, well, what I did, the first thing that I did is I just censored myself just to beat both

[00:19:00] Um, write-ups and, um, uh, and, and the pictorial, uh, aspect of the book, uh, I, I removed, uh, provocative work, especially, uh, paintings that is, uh, nudes. Okay. Yes. I didn't put a lot of breasts in this book. Uh, yeah. Uh, you know, I've painted it. Yeah. Uh, thousands and thousands of breasts, uh, uh, because it's one of the breasts, uh, just to say, breasts, Pepper breasts, uh, the greatest generosity of the universe, uh, You know, I, I will not ignore breasts as part of the major inspiration that I live.

[00:19:47] Um, amongst, uh, in this particular book, I decided not to, to put them at home to put them at home. Um, uh, because this book also, I have a son, I decided to do this book to my son. Wesley: Yes. What's his name? Wilson: His name is Essa. Okay. Yeah. So my dedication line to him, um, is, uh, if you're going to be a witch, make sure you're haunted.

[00:20:21] Wesley: [00:20:21] Um, explain to me 

[00:20:25] Wilson: [00:20:25] if you are going to be a witch, make sure you haunt. Uh, haunt as in  

[00:20:30] Wesley: [00:20:30] T. Yeah. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. So, so, so, so, so what are you telling him to be true to himself?

[00:20:36] Wilson: [00:20:36] Yes. If you go into, to be whatever wants to be in he should make sure that he goes, uh, from one straight to three, to 100. You see if it be an artist, it shouldn't be just like, uh, An artist who waits to explain a lot, uh, really really paint.

[00:20:58] Um, he shouldn't need to do, um, if he's going to be an engineer, he should make sure that he does engineering with his all, uh, so now you understand Pepper, it's not my son who is going to read this book. many other people. but that you're educating your son to be a police officer so that you can catch you. He was not coming to arrest you, uh, you arrest, uh, robbers and protect the whole nation out there.

[00:21:27] So, uh, this book was a lot of people would read it. I walk into motivate them to, to realize themselves and to, to do that. And you know, you never run losses from doing your best. 

[00:21:42] Wesley: [00:21:42] Hmm. Interesting. Interesting, interesting. Uh, that's really interesting. That's really interesting. You were saying in our episode last week about the guy who wrote the foreword and, um, we had, uh, um, you know, w I write ups on the book and explain to me again, just briefly, what did they have to say about it, um, in order to market your book?

[00:22:10] Wilson: [00:22:10] Oh, uh, I Thebe Ikalafeng. He is the, the, the, the, the founder, um, and the chairperson of, uh, Brand Africa. He is south African. Uh, he wrote the forward. 

[00:22:33] Wesley: [00:22:33] Um, yes, so. Well, I mean, you don't have to do that. You don't have to read it, but can you just give me like a, like a, you know, basically what did you have to say?

[00:22:44] Wilson:...]]>6c0ecf61-3baf-4e6e-acf3-36880a236a70Fri, 25 Jun 2021 09:00:00 +020055:44falsefull5656Candice NolanPhoto Realism: Part IPart I of this two part interview with one of Botswana's most celebrated visual artists, Wilson Ngoni. Art lexical is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:12] Hey greetings everybody, this is Wesley pepper here and you're tuning to my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Thanks everybody for tuning in. To all my new and returning listeners. Hi, greetings everybody, um, welcome, you know, uh, we have another pretty cool episode lined up for you today.

[00:00:29] You know, it's going to be a double feature, a series, a, we talking to Wilson Ngoni uh, pretty much, um, unpack his entire art story. Um, but before I explain to you what today's episode, uh, a big shout out to last week, you know, camp Cleveland for coming through thanks, my brother, um, you know, all the best with his future travels and his book.

[00:00:49] Um, I'll definitely be keeping, uh, you know, tabs on his book and maybe potentially doing a giveaway on the show. So look forward to that. 

[00:00:56] Uh, and, um, The art giveaway 

[00:01:00] is still up for grabs. So definitely, you know, like subscribe and comment to this kind of, to this episode and, uh, yeah, you can win yourself, uh, original artwork done by yours truly.

[00:01:12] And, um, yeah. And then moving on to today's episode, like, uh, so Wilson's got quite a, 

[00:01:17] uh, 

[00:01:18] Yeah, he's got quite a huge story and it's well, I just couldn't go, you know, come back, put it all in one episode, it was just too, it was a, there was just too much. So I'm going to do this double, um, 

[00:01:29] this two part series and, um, today's in today's episode, we're gonna look at his.

[00:01:34] Um, well you know how his journey through art started in bots, um, how we interpreted the surroundings, um, and his technique. Um, as you know, he does this really cool photo realist, um, images of how he interacts with his subject mapped out chooses, um, You know how he chooses to act with the subject matter and out we produces the art, you know, we're going to be diving to that entire process.

[00:01:58] It's going to be really cool. Um, and we're going to end off with him talking about his book, which is where next week's episode will start or from where we will, um, Well, we'll look at this book, uh, the content publishing behind it and his legacy because he's doing some really exciting projects. So look forward to that guys.

[00:02:16] Um, I'll chat to use at the end of the episode, um, to give you more detail about next week's episode. So I hope you guys enjoy today. 

[00:02:23] And I'll chat to you after this.

[00:02:25] Spudcaster: [00:02:25] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including Apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org.

[00:02:44] Wesley: [00:02:44] Alright man, Wilson Ngoni. Thanks for coming through my brother all the way from Botswana. Um, I've heard quite a bit and read quite a bit about you in this past few weeks, this past week, actually. Uh, so looking forward to talking to you today. So, um, before we get started, just tell me, like I know it’s very cold here in South Africa today, uh, this morning, how are you doing?

[00:03:05] Wilson: [00:03:05] I'm great, my brother and thank you so much Pepper for inviting me to have this talk with you. Uh, It is, it's such a great honour. Uh, and you know, it gives you, you give me so much energy. So, so my energy too, you know, 

[00:03:24] Wesley: [00:03:24] uh, thank you

[00:03:28]...]]>Part I of this two part interview with one of Botswana's most celebrated visual artists, Wilson Ngoni. Art lexical is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:12] Hey greetings everybody, this is Wesley pepper here and you're tuning to my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by spudcaster and baobulb. Yeah. Thanks everybody for tuning in. To all my new and returning listeners. Hi, greetings everybody, um, welcome, you know, uh, we have another pretty cool episode lined up for you today.

[00:00:29] You know, it's going to be a double feature, a series, a, we talking to Wilson Ngoni uh, pretty much, um, unpack his entire art story. Um, but before I explain to you what today's episode, uh, a big shout out to last week, you know, camp Cleveland for coming through thanks, my brother, um, you know, all the best with his future travels and his book.

[00:00:49] Um, I'll definitely be keeping, uh, you know, tabs on his book and maybe potentially doing a giveaway on the show. So look forward to that. 

[00:00:56] Uh, and, um, The art giveaway 

[00:01:00] is still up for grabs. So definitely, you know, like subscribe and comment to this kind of, to this episode and, uh, yeah, you can win yourself, uh, original artwork done by yours truly.

[00:01:12] And, um, yeah. And then moving on to today's episode, like, uh, so Wilson's got quite a, 

[00:01:17] uh, 

[00:01:18] Yeah, he's got quite a huge story and it's well, I just couldn't go, you know, come back, put it all in one episode, it was just too, it was a, there was just too much. So I'm going to do this double, um, 

[00:01:29] this two part series and, um, today's in today's episode, we're gonna look at his.

[00:01:34] Um, well you know how his journey through art started in bots, um, how we interpreted the surroundings, um, and his technique. Um, as you know, he does this really cool photo realist, um, images of how he interacts with his subject mapped out chooses, um, You know how he chooses to act with the subject matter and out we produces the art, you know, we're going to be diving to that entire process.

[00:01:58] It's going to be really cool. Um, and we're going to end off with him talking about his book, which is where next week's episode will start or from where we will, um, Well, we'll look at this book, uh, the content publishing behind it and his legacy because he's doing some really exciting projects. So look forward to that guys.

[00:02:16] Um, I'll chat to use at the end of the episode, um, to give you more detail about next week's episode. So I hope you guys enjoy today. 

[00:02:23] And I'll chat to you after this.

[00:02:25] Spudcaster: [00:02:25] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including Apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org.

[00:02:44] Wesley: [00:02:44] Alright man, Wilson Ngoni. Thanks for coming through my brother all the way from Botswana. Um, I've heard quite a bit and read quite a bit about you in this past few weeks, this past week, actually. Uh, so looking forward to talking to you today. So, um, before we get started, just tell me, like I know it’s very cold here in South Africa today, uh, this morning, how are you doing?

[00:03:05] Wilson: [00:03:05] I'm great, my brother and thank you so much Pepper for inviting me to have this talk with you. Uh, It is, it's such a great honour. Uh, and you know, it gives you, you give me so much energy. So, so my energy too, you know, 

[00:03:24] Wesley: [00:03:24] uh, thank you

[00:03:28] Wilson: [00:03:28] You know to be recognised as an artist it's, it's, it's, it's, it's a good thing sometimes, you know, we painting not for money, but, you know, uh, to make life better and you know, when we have people accepting our, uh, uh, intentions, It's great. You know, it shows that we are heading towards the proper direction. So I really, really appreciate this invitation.

[00:03:47] Wesley: [00:03:47]

[00:03:50] Thank you. Thank you so much. Wow. Uh, that's it. Uh, yeah, man. So, um, look here man, I'm looking at your work. Okay. Um, okay. Before we get to work. What I'm interested in, um, since it's your first time on the show, um, how did you get into the arts? And then so as you know, like what meeting what we do is a calling nobody really does this in the hopes of making money,

[00:04:17] it's a calling you either have it, or you don't, um, yeah, just give us, like, where did you start? When did you realize that you want to draw, uh, technical, uh, academic wise, the, an academic background and that type of thing. 

[00:04:37] Wilson: [00:04:37] Yeah. You know, uh, so you know, you, some of these things you start, uh, like, 

[00:04:42] Wesley: [00:04:42] okay, I'm listening,

[00:04:49] Wilson: [00:04:49] like playing and, you know, Next thing is it's a foundation. The next thing is this school. The next thing is it's a big field. You understand? Like, you know, when I was a young, um, I wanted to do, to be an author for other things because, um, uh, a lot of influence from home and from school. So I. You, you know, you get the pressure to become a doctor to become an engineer because sometimes you are good at it

[00:05:25] Sometimes you are good at mathematics. So, and you know, for me, like, yeah, we are going to be proud of him and, you know, neighbours, when I say, come in and say, you know, we, we he's going to help his mother is going to make his mother proud. He's going to be the doctor, but, you know, Uh, they, something is like deep down inside you that wants to come out.

[00:05:49] You know? Um, they, they got sun. But he's under the skin and people just see the limp in you, but they don't know the pain that you're feeling. And the underneath the, the, the, the, the key now, uh, it's, you know, you want to take out that thorn it's, you know, the pain of that thorn, you know? Um, it's you feel it.

[00:06:19] Um, so yeah. Uh, wait, wait, wait with me. I I say, uh, pepper. It's hard for me to say exactly. When did I start painting? Because painting is like a language it's hard for you to ask. If I were to ask you hey pepper, when did you start speaking? You can, but you can't remember when did you start speaking?

[00:06:40] Wesley: [00:06:40] I hear exactly what you’re saying

[00:06:45] Wilson: [00:06:45] So it's a language, you know, but now. At least we have a little bit of conscious life now, when did I become conscious of ? Yeah.

[00:07:00] Yeah. So. Yeah. About three decades ago. I'm over 30 years. I'm 42 going 43. This August. 

[00:07:11] Wesley: [00:07:11] Yeah me too.

[00:07:18] Wilson: [00:07:18] We have the generation.

[00:07:23] Now

[00:07:32] three, three decades ago, it became quite conscious. Uh, when I was roughly 10, 11, 12, you know, preaching, you know, and I, I had special, special movements, uh, with my hand. Uh, you know, so I, I, I started like taking it a bit serious, you know, because also people just to tell you a bit of my background, like, um, social a bit, uh, I, I, I was born in, in, in a quite dysfunctional family.

[00:08:08] Uh, well, it's not adequate. To, to, to, to break. Cause it's, it's quite common in our communities to have dysfunction. And you know, it's also quite common too, to have a families with poverty, you know, below poverty line. So, you know, when you come from that kind of, uh, background, you didn't need to wake up.

[00:08:33] Because, you know, if you suck your thumb and cry incessantly saying, Hey, I'm a victim of the system, I'm a victim of life circumstances. Uh, even, even Jesus Christ cannot come and help you people.

[00:08:55] Okay. You need to stand up, man, bruh. So, um, I. Yeah. Had to paint to survive. I had to paint because also like I, when I realised the poverty at my home, I knew that money was not invented for us. It was like money was invented for other people. But you know, I, I was not born. I did not invent life you understand Pepper.

[00:09:26] All I needed to come to, to create was a culture. So, you know, I met this culture of painting. I, I painted to try to create my own religion to try to create my own culture. And it was, uh, you see, I was born into life. All religions, all cultures. Are there already and still I I'm born and find nothing for me.

[00:09:57] What do you, do you continue grasping? What is there already and seeing it's not working, even for people who came before you, you really have to devise new methods for you to survive. Um, there's enough bread for everyone in the world Pepper, but you know, it's not available for everyone

[00:10:19] to invent, uh, means, uh, methods of attaining that bread. And for me, it became painting. You understand brush, strokes, Pepper, brush strokes, simple as that. So I started drawing because I didn't do primary school. So, you know, I was one of the people like on the streets and, you know, life was just like, it was not my time but through social workers and my mother and, um, Uh, the late, uh, administrators of, uh, my junior school helped me in the village, uh, help make them go back to school.

[00:11:01] You understand? So, uh, yeah, uh, uh, I, I started, uh, realising that, you know, Even though you are talented school is a place where you come and discover yourself again. It's like you be born again at school. So it's really, really imperative for our youth, for our people to go to school. You know, to have that kind of a little bit of guidance.

[00:11:33] So school guided me further into my, into my, into my talent, you know, into my art. You see, uh, around 1996, 97, 1997, uh, I was like serious now with water colours and acrylics and, you know, auto auto auto paint because I could not afford paint. So, you know, you go to a nearby panelbeater, uh, company, you pick empty tins so that, you know, yes.

[00:11:58] Take the little bit of pain that 

[00:12:00] Wesley: [00:12:00] is left. 

[00:12:02] Wilson: [00:12:02] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, and you know, you experiment sometimes Pepper, you don't even afford even a single tube of paint because 96, 97, you know, you end up coming a young person, you know, you fall, you have no market for your paintings. No one recognises art.

[00:12:22] Um, at the same time, you know, it beats one’s mind Pepper to realize that, you know, I'd studied in Africa, but art is not recognised in Africa, how does where's sanity there Pepper? 

[00:12:40] Wesley: [00:12:40] Yeah, no, I, I deal with the same problem. Um, I deal with the same problem, so I know what you say, 

[00:12:52] Wilson: [00:12:52] but it's, it's a thing that we live. I mean, paintings.

[00:12:57] Uh, it is form of art, our people pay, but they, uh, they decode it. How is it our hearts even like building traditional hats. It's an art in itself, you know, here we use  and we use, uh, uh, baskets. You understand? Yeah, all those, those craft paper, uh, cooking sticks, uh, poets, African clay pots, you know, ceramics, you know, beads this craft paper here and, you know, still we refuse to recognise them ourselves.

[00:13:42] So. 

[00:13:43] Wesley: [00:13:43] Yeah. I know exactly what you’re saying 

[00:13:45] Wilson: [00:13:45] Yeah. So now sometimes it takes, um, a new culture and new force to bring, uh, to the awareness of our people that, you know, we have these. And we need to celebrate what we have because, uh, the other mentors that were brought before us, like really, really waking for us. So, you know, even in that age, um, I felt, you know, I'm going to make a change.

[00:14:10] That's the reason why I pursued this career or my passion, uh, as an artist, despite a lot of challenges, a lot of pressure that was like put forth to, to, to stop me either at home, at school or with friends or in this society generally. So starting art, Pepper is not like, uh, starting painting. I hope, I think w w you needed to ask me, when did you start to resist?

[00:14:46] Wesley: [00:14:46] Okay. Okay. What I'm okay. I'm, I'm, I'm listening to you, very carefully you raising a bunch of points I actually want to tackle

[00:14:53] um, because I'm very interested in looking at. Firstly let me start with this. Let's say I understand what you say. Um, I understand how the, artists tend to be, um, I see how the artists looked at his surroundings conceptualized or rather made his groundings work for him, you know, you know, honestly, I think that's, I can actually have a series of episodes.

[00:15:22] I'm happy because I think artists have the tools or tools that, you know, versus everybody else know people work in offices. I just think we can, we can adapt. Uh, uh, to our surroundings quicker and better and harness it and we actually churn out beautiful work. So that's, uh, that's actually just something that I picked up that you said.

[00:15:42] Um, that was really cool. Uh, what, I'm, what I'm looking at your studio now and looking at your artwork. Um, I noticed a few, uh, trends, so I noticed you focus a lot on the black child. Okay. On the, on the African child. Uh, you do a lot of portraits. So I, um, uh, The portraits are very expressive, uh, they aren’t hungry, you know, they aren’t images of hungry children they actually look like they’ve got strong personalities, like, like the, uh, you know, knowledge of self.

[00:16:20] I see themes of that coming through. Uh, and it’s photo realism. Now there's, there's, there's something that I've noticed through Southern Africa. So a lot in Africa, there's a lot, there's this huge sort of migration towards photo realism, it’s really becoming quite popular,

[00:16:40] especially on social media. So that's actually something I wanna, I want to get to, talk about, um, can you just tell me about your subject matter? Like I'm very interested why you choose those images, how you handle them, you know, Uh, uh, um, and the, your, um, your techniques, are you using acrylics?

[00:16:58] Are you using oils, you know, using pastels. Yeah. 

[00:17:01] Wilson: [00:17:01] Uh, Pepper right now, you see with a lot of experiment and, you know, uh, three, three decades of staying on the brush. I felt that acrylic is dead paint. So I'm using oil, oil paints, uh, through and through and through, uh, because oil paint responds very, very well, especially with my light and my studio and with my ideas.

[00:17:25] So it really, really, uh, I have authority over it. And then

[00:17:37] mostly on canvas and regarding the subject of the black child, Africans, 

[00:17:51] Pepper, while I was growing, I was advised to migrate to Europe. Um, Still, you know, when I was under pressure, uh, to quit, to pursue the other fields, but, um, my family or my society thought that, you know,  success, uh, like, you know, you, you doing very, very well with academics and, uh, your teachers want you to pursue dreams that, you know, They failed to pursue themselves because they were not as good as you are academically.

[00:18:28] Uh, and they tried to get you into those directions. Your mom failed to be a doctor and she wants you to be a doctor. Um, uh, your brother wants you to, to, to, to be a teacher because he failed to be a teacher. So now when you pursue. Can I explain just a little bit, what art is, uh, 

[00:18:50] Wesley: [00:18:50] ja, please 

[00:18:52] Wilson: [00:18:52] For us artists who did not go to school to study art is not a promise.

[00:19:02] And yet it's a promise. Art is, uh, where you decide to become an artist. You are not promised any success. And do you know, it can be frustrating,

[00:19:18] you know, when you study the PhDs, the, the PhD, I don't mean the pull down syndrome. Um, pull them down,

[00:19:33] pull us down anyway, but.

[00:19:46] Um,

[00:19:49] When you pursue degrees you are promised uh, a job 

[00:19:52] and a salary, 

[00:19:55] but I'm here in the studio, but no one is promising me anything I'm not promised the promotion. Nothing? No, all I have are my brushes, my tubes like pigments and you know, the canvas and ideas. Now, when I say the promise is me always promising the world that, you know, I'll give something.

[00:20:15] Uh, but you know, the world is not promising anything. So the community see that, you know, you, there is no life they can see further than beyond the horizon. Like you would see beyond life. Like you will see, they try to stop. You. Because sometimes that that's stopping you because they don't want you to pursue art.

[00:20:41] It's like, because they feel bad. They want to see you in with, in a white collar, uh, having a white collar job and having a salary, um, that you can be able to take a loan. For instance, you know, my community will say, yeah, you need to get a job so that you can be able to take a loan and you know, you can blah, blah, blah, blah.

[00:21:05] And I went like my gut. I don't need nothing of that nature. I just need to paint. You know, I, I can’t take a loan to buy a brushes. I can take loan to take, to buy brushes and brushes are what matters to me. So, you know, you decided that, you know, it's me first. So now, uh, w w w w when they saw that you will get amongst the people, they decided to come around again to say, if you can't beat them, join them.

[00:21:45] Now because you know what you see finally, the world is quite envious. When you bring something, they don't understand this, they try to stop you. And when they see you happy and loving it, they start like joining in. So with my arts. Oh yeah. Yeah. Uh, and you know, that's my motto actually that that's my, my artistic philosophy.

[00:22:10] Um, that's, uh, The idea, the notion that governs my everyday life, that, you know, I, I paint to make humanity happier. So I hope to contribute to the general happiness of humanity with my paintings. So when they saw, saw this, they started like joining me and supporting me now, you know, and in that support, I felt that, you know, if I need this support, I need to allow the world, my community to lean against me.

[00:22:40] So this I give to my, my, my community and they leaning, I guess, on me, that's how we support each other. So I need to show. Uh, paintings that, you know, uh, resonate my connect, uh, that speak with, uh, with my community directly because language art is a language and in language is borrowed from your immediate environment.

[00:23:07] So, you know, uh, I needed to paint and I need to paint about my community. I need...]]>660725c9-46f2-4186-bc42-eea9f62beca4Fri, 25 Jun 2021 09:00:00 +020047:55falsefull5555Candice NolanMaboneng LifeWesley Pepper chats to Taye Uhuru AKA Camp Cleveland. The musician recently authored a book. They talk cooperative economics and pan africanism.

This is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Greetings everybody this is Wesley Pepper here. And you're tuned into my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by Spudcaster and baobulb. Yes, everybody, greetings to everybody. Um, To all the new listeners and returning listeners. Hi, hello to everybody. Thanks for tuning in this week, man. Uh, for those of you who listened to last week's episode.

[00:00:36] Thanks to Brian Jones and Jane Morris for coming through. I think they were fantastic. I had so much fun talking to them so much energy that they have, and I really believe, uh, in their business strategy. Uh, I think, um, Yeah. I mean, I think they do fantastic. They doing fantastic things over there in Bulawayo in Zimbabwe.

[00:00:56] So, um, yeah, they based in Wales but running out of Bulawayo. So if you, yeah, and just, if you know of them tune to last week’s podcast, if you haven't heard of them, tune in to last week’s podcast. But I think that was really great. Um, Well, that, that was really fantastic. And, um, just two more things before I introduce today's guests, um, the art give is still ongoing.

[00:01:18] So what you should do is like subscribe to our channel to this podcast channel. Um, And you can drop me just a line on Facebook saying that you did. I mean, obviously we will see if you did, uh, uh, well, anyway, you can, um, and we'll choose a random name. And for now the giveaway is only available to my listeners in South Africa, and that's because of

[00:01:44] courier costs because it's coming out of my pocket and that is, uh, yeah. Anyway, I'm sure you get it. Um, so that's ongoing so that it's available. Um, I'll actually tweet, um, or post a picture of the art work I want to give away on my social media pages so you can check it out there. I'll probably do it, um, yeah, very soon.

[00:02:04] So you can look forward to that and, um, I'll talk to you guys with all with regards to what's coming forth to future episodes and future additional features and stuff like that. We add into the show at the end of the interview. So stay tuned for that. So moving on then, uh, today's episode is going to be really exciting, I'm looking forward to it.

[00:02:24] So we're talking to a brother, um, Taye Uhuru, um, from Ohio in the USA. Uh, on social media he goes by the name Camp Cleveland. Um, say he's a, a historian and activist, uh, gynecologist, a student, hiphop artists, and this guy's quite an active traveler. Um, he said he's been to over 70 countries, which is actually, I don't know many people that has been to, uh, so many countries.

[00:02:51] So, uh, that's going to be exciting to talk to him to that. Um, I also had a listen to some of his music videos. Um, so that was really cool because the one video he shot at Mabonengneng and as you know, I used to stay just around the corner from there, uh, and Gary and Jola them, all the artists featured on there.

[00:03:07] So big shout out to Gary and Jola from African Icons um, and two, I'll give you guys another, um, yeah. Hmm. I actually just remembered something, but that's fine. Um, I'll make mention of all of that towards, at the end of the episode, um, with regards to everybody who I'm associated with and all of that. Um, so yeah, man, um, hope you guys will enjoy today's episode.

[00:03:28] Um, I'm certainly looking forward to it. Um, To unpacking his, um, uh, journey and all of that. So stay tuned for that. And I'll talk to you at the end of this. 

[00:03:43] Spudcaster: [00:03:43] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts,]]>Wesley Pepper chats to Taye Uhuru AKA Camp Cleveland. The musician recently authored a book. They talk cooperative economics and pan africanism.

This is a podcast where we talk art and art processes.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Greetings everybody this is Wesley Pepper here. And you're tuned into my podcast Wesley Pepper’s art Lexica, which is brought to you by Spudcaster and baobulb. Yes, everybody, greetings to everybody. Um, To all the new listeners and returning listeners. Hi, hello to everybody. Thanks for tuning in this week, man. Uh, for those of you who listened to last week's episode.

[00:00:36] Thanks to Brian Jones and Jane Morris for coming through. I think they were fantastic. I had so much fun talking to them so much energy that they have, and I really believe, uh, in their business strategy. Uh, I think, um, Yeah. I mean, I think they do fantastic. They doing fantastic things over there in Bulawayo in Zimbabwe.

[00:00:56] So, um, yeah, they based in Wales but running out of Bulawayo. So if you, yeah, and just, if you know of them tune to last week’s podcast, if you haven't heard of them, tune in to last week’s podcast. But I think that was really great. Um, Well, that, that was really fantastic. And, um, just two more things before I introduce today's guests, um, the art give is still ongoing.

[00:01:18] So what you should do is like subscribe to our channel to this podcast channel. Um, And you can drop me just a line on Facebook saying that you did. I mean, obviously we will see if you did, uh, uh, well, anyway, you can, um, and we'll choose a random name. And for now the giveaway is only available to my listeners in South Africa, and that's because of

[00:01:44] courier costs because it's coming out of my pocket and that is, uh, yeah. Anyway, I'm sure you get it. Um, so that's ongoing so that it's available. Um, I'll actually tweet, um, or post a picture of the art work I want to give away on my social media pages so you can check it out there. I'll probably do it, um, yeah, very soon.

[00:02:04] So you can look forward to that and, um, I'll talk to you guys with all with regards to what's coming forth to future episodes and future additional features and stuff like that. We add into the show at the end of the interview. So stay tuned for that. So moving on then, uh, today's episode is going to be really exciting, I'm looking forward to it.

[00:02:24] So we're talking to a brother, um, Taye Uhuru, um, from Ohio in the USA. Uh, on social media he goes by the name Camp Cleveland. Um, say he's a, a historian and activist, uh, gynecologist, a student, hiphop artists, and this guy's quite an active traveler. Um, he said he's been to over 70 countries, which is actually, I don't know many people that has been to, uh, so many countries.

[00:02:51] So, uh, that's going to be exciting to talk to him to that. Um, I also had a listen to some of his music videos. Um, so that was really cool because the one video he shot at Mabonengneng and as you know, I used to stay just around the corner from there, uh, and Gary and Jola them, all the artists featured on there.

[00:03:07] So big shout out to Gary and Jola from African Icons um, and two, I'll give you guys another, um, yeah. Hmm. I actually just remembered something, but that's fine. Um, I'll make mention of all of that towards, at the end of the episode, um, with regards to everybody who I'm associated with and all of that. Um, so yeah, man, um, hope you guys will enjoy today's episode.

[00:03:28] Um, I'm certainly looking forward to it. Um, To unpacking his, um, uh, journey and all of that. So stay tuned for that. And I'll talk to you at the end of this. 

[00:03:43] Spudcaster: [00:03:43] baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts, podcasts your life with baobulb.org

[00:04:00] Wesley: [00:04:00] Um, okay man. Taye Uhuru uh, from camp Cleveland, Ohio in the USA. Uh, thanks for coming through my brother. Um, how you been keeping? 

[00:04:13] Taye Uhuru: [00:04:13] uh all is well, thanks to you, king. I truly appreciate you for even allowing me to you know, come on your platform is definitely an honour. How you feeling now?

[00:04:22] Wesley: [00:04:22] Man? Me I'm good. Um, entering winter, uh, you know, as, as African people, we don't like the winter, so that's a bit, yeah.

[00:04:31] Other than that, it's all good, man. I'm being real busy. Actually. I've been working on some art. Um, I've got another group show coming up in a few weeks time, but the podcast we'll be hearing about that in the coming weeks. So, yeah, man, that covers me and my brother. Um, let's jump straight into it, man. So I'm you from Ohio and in the USA, you also a world traveler man, which is, which is really cool.

[00:04:52] Um, And, uh, you a historian. a musician. Um, yeah, man, they started with like, um, yeah. Uh, so you basically are you, so tell us a little bit about you, man. Just give us a little for my listeners so just give us a little bit of a background about, um, you know, stuff that's not in your, on your website, you know?

[00:05:14] Um, yeah. 

[00:05:16] Taye Uhuru: [00:05:16] Oh, okay. Yeah, I'm definitely, um, I'm a musician. I'm an MC I'm an author. I just wrote my first book. 

[00:05:23] It's called The Afro Set. Uh, I'm into 

[00:05:26] genealogy. I'm a historian. 

[00:05:29] And also I'm a world traveler. Um, 

[00:05:31] I visited almost 70 countries around the world. I've been to almost 20 countries in Africa. 

[00:05:38] Wesley: [00:05:38] That's like, that's like pretty cool, man.

[00:05:40] Like, to be honest with you, I know a lot of travelers, but 70 countries that's outstanding. Uh, just for the listeners. Can you tell us like, which of those, because there's 20 in Africa. Where else have you been, man? Um, Europe. Asia, where all over? 

[00:05:56] Taye Uhuru: [00:05:56] Yeah, definitely all over. 

[00:05:58] Um, and as far as 

[00:06:00] Africa I've been there, I've been to South Africa, Mozambique, uh, Botswana, Zimbabwe.

[00:06:07] Kenya Madagascar, Seychelles, Camaros, uh, Ethiopia, Egypt, Senegal, Cape Verde. Guinea-Bissau Morocco. I've been to south America, Brazil, uh, Dominican Republic, Mexico, uh, all over Europe, you know, Philippines, Taiwan. Thailand Japan. China. Yeah. 

[00:06:32] Wesley: [00:06:32] Wow. Wow. Wow. That's extensive. And that's extensive. So from what I can understand that you pan African is that correct.

[00:06:40] You, are you consider yourself as pan africanist? 

[00:06:43] Taye Uhuru: [00:06:43] Well, yeah, I guess it depends on your definition of it. So I think that. Uh, being black is a global thing. So I look at it as 

[00:06:51] black people in India, black people in Asia, as black people in Africa, black people in Mexico and Brazil and America. You know what I'm saying?

[00:07:00] Wesley: [00:07:00] Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, because, because I'm looking at, because like the first thing that, um, I found a picture of buyer that jumps to me, man, is that historian part, because I'm a history buff myself. Um, you know, um, yeah man, I also, co-run a website we've been around for. A long, long, long, long time consciousness where we publish specifically, um, um, uh, stuff around African history and art, uh, essays, poetry, music, and everything around the, um, the African diaspora.

[00:07:31] And, um, tell me, man, is your, uh, is your history studies, um, uh, part of the reason why you travel such a lot or where did the traveling of where and why did the traveling bug really bite? You know, 

[00:07:45] Taye Uhuru: [00:07:45] Oh, okay. Um, it kind of mostly goes back to 

[00:07:48] my family's history. So I would say my, my great-grandfather. He was a follower of Marcus Garvey, you know, in the 1920s.

[00:07:57] Um, he joined the UNIA. I didn't, I never met my great-grandfather, but his daughter, my grandmother, she would tell them more about, you know, cause she was there. She went to some of the meeting. She was at the parade. She seen the raising of the red, black and green flag. And she told me about him, you know, like he felt like we were Africans and we should go back to Africa.

[00:08:18] And things like that. And then my grandmother's son, my uncle, he started his own black power organisation. It was called The Afro Set. So Afro at that time was short for Africa. So his organisation, it was at the forefront of re-introducing black Americans to African history, African culture, African language, African dance, and African fashion, African news, you know, and things like that.

[00:08:45] And, um, you know, my mom, she gave me black history books. When I was young, she used to draw, she drove the 

[00:08:51] Greyhound and she would take us to 

[00:08:52] different places around, around the country. You know, New York, Chicago, Cincinnati. Detroit, uh, you know, just different places around the way. So that's when I first started traveling and learning about black history.

[00:09:06] So I've always admired African people and African culture and African history ever since I was younger. Uh, 

[00:09:11] Wesley: [00:09:11] that's interesting. Interesting. So tell me, uh, through that, like inspired you to start traveling throughout the continent. Is that, um, is that, is that, is that, is that correct? 

[00:09:22] Taye Uhuru: [00:09:22] Well, yeah, but it took some time because like I say, I started when I was 

[00:09:24] young and then once I became an adult, you know, I continued to travel on my own.

[00:09:29] You know, I was still making music at this time. So I would go to different cities and different states, you know, we 

[00:09:34] will promote our music, perform, 

[00:09:36] pass out CDs and different things like that. And then once I had pretty much seen the majority of the states in America, I’ve been to like 45 states out of 50.

[00:09:46] So, you know, I wanted to see more and learn more. Again, I got my passport in 2010, and then that's when I started going to different countries in different parts of the world. 

[00:09:56] Wesley: [00:09:56] Well, so you said you traveled to about more than 70 countries since 2010. That's like the past 11 years. Taye Uhuru: Yeah, 11 years. Wesley: Yeah, shit, man.

[00:10:05] That's like, that's like a lot of mileage in 11 years. 

[00:10:08] Taye Uhuru: [00:10:08] Yeah. Yeah. I was moving at a high speed. 

[00:10:12] Wesley: [00:10:12] Yeah, fuck. Yeah, absolutely. Um, just for interest sake now that COVID has, uh, is like affected everything. Um, how has that affected your movement? Have you been traveling? Um, what is the, since March last year? Yeah.

[00:10:26] Taye Uhuru: [00:10:26] Yeah. I still been traveling. Definitely. 

[00:10:28] So in January of 2020, I came to Africa. I was in South Africa. So I was there during the 

[00:10:34] lockdown during COVID shut down and everything level four, level three, you know, waiting around and stuff. So I was in Africa for most of the time

[00:10:46] Wesley: [00:10:46] uh, where in South Africa were you at that time?

[00:10:49] Taye Uhuru: [00:10:49] I was in Johannesburg. I was living in Maboneng. I had an apartment in Maboneng. That's where I shot the music video at 

[00:10:55] Wesley: [00:10:55] my brother, I actually used to stay around the corner from there. Um, yeah, man, I lost my apartment since then. Uh, we actually give up the apartment in, uh, Taye Uhuru: when was it? Wesley: January February this year.

[00:11:10] Um, so since then I moved back to Kimberly in the Northern Cape, which is like 500 Ks outside of Johannesburg. But like, but like, that's my, that's my hood, man. Actually, I wanna, I wanna get to that because I've been looking at your looking and listening to your music. Um, and I sort of want to unpack, but like I sorta want to first, see, you know, the whole traveling thing and all that, um, sort of like added to your, uh, I would say your creative arsenal and like unpack that thing.

[00:11:36] But, but, um, so if you were saying that you've been to like 20 countries in, in, in Africa is pretty cool. Um, that that's pretty cool. So yeah. What I'm what I'm interested to know. So I know a lot of, uh, American guys coming to South Africa, um, obviously worked with quite a few as well. And it's interesting for me, how they interpret or how they see the continent, man?

[00:11:57] Um, and the expectations and all of that. But as somebody like with you, like, like coming to South Africa, um, I guess, like, what is, uh, what do you, what do you, what is the first thing you try to learn or, you know, experience from, uh, from, from, from, from, uh, from, uh, from, from a country? 

[00:12:16] Taye Uhuru: [00:12:16] Um, well, it depends on the country in terms of South Africa, you know, I had a little bit of, 

[00:12:22] um, understanding and knowledge of the history before I 

[00:12:25] actually came to visit.

[00:12:27] You know, from my first visit, I've been to South 

[00:12:29] Africa, at least five or six times. Like I said, I lived in Maboneng almost a year. Um, but I was reading different books. Like I read, uh, Nelson Mandela's book. I read, uh, Steve Biko book. I read, uh, Oh, my God. Uh, Robert Subukwe, you know, I was learning about apartheid and watching Shaka, Zulu, you know, different movies, cry freedom and stuff like that, and catch a fire and, you know, 

[00:12:54] just different things.

[00:12:55] So I kind of built up 

[00:12:57] a certain level of anticipation before I went there. So I knew what I wanted 

[00:13:01] to see. I tapped into some of the music, and then I had knew someone that was living 

[00:13:05] in South Africa. So I was communicating with them before I came out there, but when I, um, 

[00:13:12] when I first came to South Africa, this was maybe like 2013.

[00:13:16] So it wasn't a lot of constant positive content 

[00:13:20] about South Africa. You know, back then, like you said, it was about 

[00:13:25] these eight or nine years ago. So if you Googled South Africa, it would be something 

[00:13:29] negative rape murder, a 

[00:13:32] poverty. 

[00:13:33] But you know, when I got to Cape town, that was the first place I went. I seen 

[00:13:38] malls.

[00:13:39] I seen beautiful women, beautiful beaches. Cars, Benzes, Bentleys, BMWs. You know, I've just seen so many my brother.

[00:13:46] Wesley: [00:13:46] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like I get you. I get you like that also thing. Um, one thing, I've one thing I've picked up. Like I know a lot of scholars, um, actually I know some from Chicago was pretty close friends of mine and, uh, they've actually been doing a project in the Northern KZN, with the rural women.

[00:14:07] So we get a, um, it's also. For me as a, for me as, as an artist, because I'm a visual artist, like that's my core. So, so, so I interpret things. Yeah. Visually and I'm also Pan-Africanist as well. So, um, When I find out when I see a lot of, um, um, yeah, for me, it's always interesting. Are the other Americans like, like back, because as you say, like if you see all this fucking rape and all this type of shit.

[00:14:35] Yeah. Well, um, yeah, yeah. That's how the, uh, that's the stuff has been as bad as, you know, if you scratch deeper, there's a lot. Yeah. Um, um, there's a, there's, there's a lot of culture, there’s a lot of history. Um, is that a context as thing which, which gives out which, which gives our music and our artistic expression such a, I guess, such a texture and vibe energy and all of that.

[00:14:56] So, um, you know, reading up a few, a few, you mentioned movies like cry, freedom, um, um, That actually quite a, that's actually quite something interesting. Um, so, uh, how, or what parts of the Africa, what part of, um, if you, if I must make it specific about Joburg, like really struck with you, man, you know, what was the, um, and I'm sort of trying to build up to your music because I was listening to your lyrics, um, as well, but yeah.

[00:15:24] What part of Joburg, and then, South Africa really, you know, grabbed you. 

[00:15:30] Taye Uhuru: [00:15:30] Man. It's hard to say because all of South Africa has been amazing, you know, from my experience. Well, yeah, I, I really was feeling Joburg. I mean, I guess, cause you know, Joburg got the money. It seems like, you know, 

[00:15:42] looking from the outside.

[00:15:43] So Maboneng was just like the ultimate place 

[00:15:46] to be, you know, as photographers, as dancers, as poets, 

[00:15:51] drummers, as singers, as painters s producers. And like even during a lockdown, you know, it was three or four different music studios in my building. It was producers 

[00:16:00] and rappers that I could just go next door or go upstairs.

[00:16:04] So, you know, I never seen a place like Maboneng. So, so maybe that may have been the most, you know, uh, remarkable place for me. 

[00:16:14] Wesley: [00:16:14] So you were staying at main street life in . Um, we, uh, in that hotel, were you staying there? Taye Uhuru: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, Wesley: yeah, fuck. Um, I know that place pretty well. Um, I used to stay down, um, Betty Street, so it will be, um, just on the corner by Burtrand by that French restaurant.

[00:16:36] Um, if you're looking left, um, I stayed just one, just two blocks from the, um, but yeah, like, um, after the, um, after, because as a visual artist, um, Yeah. I mean, once everything got shut down. Yeah, man, it really it's out long story we had to give up the apartment. But anyway, um, I'm still based, um, you know, my stuff's in storage that side and all of that.

[00:16:59] Um, so yeah. So if you were, you were there through our thought lockdown, right? Uh, Geewhizz how was that for you, because, because over here, which means that you experienced, uh, alcohol and tobacco prohibition, uh, and, uh, you know, the politics around movement. Cause we couldn't go anywhere and it was really odd.

[00:17:19] Cool man. And, um, I know the inner city, there's a lot of people there there's a lot of movement. Uh, uh, I don't know, like what, uh, because it was 21 days and the government moved it out to a few more days. What did you do to keep yourself busy? 

[00:17:35] Taye Uhuru: [00:17:35] Well, I mean, you know, I was shocked like everybody else, so we didn't 

[00:17:38] know what was next, but, you know, as far as being locked down somewhere, I couldn't have picked a more, better place to be.

[00:17:44] Like I said, cause I was still 

[00:17:46] surrounded by musicians. I was still able to shoot a music video, you know, was photographers 

[00:17:50] still living, you know, in my apartment building. So I was pretty cool for the most part. As far as, uh, being artistic and creative, I was still able to write songs. I was still able to record songs and shooting music videos.

[00:18:03] Um, When it first, first 

[00:18:05] locked down, like when we was 

[00:18:06] at the highest level, you know, I just went back and forth to the...]]>3029e15f-ca3f-48f5-860f-c9be20bfc519Fri, 25 Jun 2021 09:00:00 +020053:39falsefull5454Candice NolanSelling BooksWesley Pepper sits down with Jane Morris and Brian Jones from amaBooks publishing. They take a look at the world of publishing through the lens of Covid.

Transcript

Wesley: [00:00:00] Everybody this is Wesley Pepper here. And your tuning in to my podcasts wesley peppers art lexica. And remember we are brought to you by spot Costa and Bible, and thanks to all my new and returning listeners. Uh uh, thanks for coming for coming in to check on my platform. Uh, it's much appreciated. I know the local, the listeners are growing and there's some shout outs I've been getting and thanks to everybody, uh, much appreciated.

[00:00:38] Uh, yeah, yeah. Um, yeah. Anyway, I'm not very good at that type of thing. So it's just like, thank you. And, uh, yeah, let me continue making sound really dope ass arts based content, which I'm really passionate about man and I really, really enjoy doing. And, um, let's just touch base on last week's episode. Uh, Lerato Sibanda thanks alot my sister for coming through the poetry really gave the episode a lot of.

[00:01:04] But very limited, really layered, really textured. I really, I really loved it. I thought it was, uh, it was, uh, it was really beautiful. And, um, and what I loved about it was, um, yeah, I don't know, organic, everything was so big up to that, uh, today's episode. Um, we are talking to some really interesting for, uh, really interesting people talking to, um, Jane Morris and Brian Jones they from amaBooks, publisher publishing.

[00:01:31] Um, they're based in Zimbabwe but currently are in Wales, in cardigan. Um, we spoke with earlier in the week and I say, uh, book Saturday, uh, event in cardigan over the weekend. So promoting Bryony Rheam’s book, and we'll be talking a little bit about that. So when we're focusing on the, you know, pretty much the A to Zed about them?

[00:01:51] So in talking about, uh, how they came out, how they came to being, um, just to give it some perspective, um, they, uh, how they, uh, curate or, um, How they curate their, um, uh, authors they're their writers. I know that they publishing work is based mostly on, um, you know, stories, you know, short stories, a lot, a lot of poetry, uh, or rather some poetry or some history book.

[00:02:14] So that's really interesting, man. So when we are going to be talking a little bit about why they choose to sell that specific genre books, their author’s are top selling authors, how they will, um, adapting to the COVID pandemic as we always do on this platform and getting to know them just personally, really, you know, um, and giving my listeners or you listeners just a face to the, to the brand, which is amaBooks publishing.

[00:02:38] So. Yeah, man. Um, look forward to that. That's coming really soon. Um, with regards to the, uh, art giveaway, it is still going on. Um, remember to, um, you can catch me on all my social media platforms. So that's, uh, um, Facebook that’s twitter, that’s @wesleypepper, and, uh, Instagram is with the underscore pepper. So you can catch me on there.

[00:03:01] Um, but remember to like subscribe and comment to this channel, um, and we'll select somebody for now a disclaimer that is only available to, uh, South African based listeners. And that's just a money thing. Because it’s all coming out of my pocket. For now. Um, so yeah, man. And, um, so that's something that's, that's going to be ongoing, but like, but I'll explain a little bit more too about that at the end of the episode.

[00:03:27] Um, and in the outro, but for now, um, yeah, I look forward to listen to Brian, to Jane and Brian. Um, from amaBooks and we'll chat after that. And I hope you enjoy today's episode. 

[00:03:38] Spudcaster: [00:03:38] Baobulb.org is a podcasting platform and a medium for storytelling. This podcast is also available on all the major podcasting apps, including apple and Google podcasts podcast, your...]]>Wesley Pepper sits down with Jane Morris and Brian Jones from amaBooks publishing. They take a look at the world of publishing through the lens of Covid.